Sikhsangat Betrayal

[citizen_soulja]

Im so disappointed in the attitudes displayed by members on this site!!

I made a post which i have repeated below about the beadbi that is taking place in relation to our dastaar and the post only received 115 views, with no comments or action yet when some1 made a post about micheal jackson the post received over 3500 views!! and the discussion is spread over 5 pages!!!

What is happening to us?!?! do we really care about more about mj than our Sikhi?!?!

There are so many treats facing us many of them we don't even realise, so many undesirable elements, so much distortion, not enough love and courage to stand up to these cowards. And now I hear KPS Gill have been appointed as an advisor to Interpol!!!!

My original post:

Vaheguroo Ji Ka Khalsa

Vaheguroo Ji Ki Fatheh

I am writing this to inform you, and for you to inform others about the comments and statements made about our beloved Dastar by a person claim to be a Sikh who is in a responsible position of an organisation made in name of Sikhs. Namely the British Sikh Police Association.

Below are just few news items from different news organisations web based news sources with their addresses and contents for your convenience.

http://www.sunriseradio.com/news/?id=1941

British Sikh police association launched

29 April 2009

The British Sikh Police Association launches today: it is the first ever national police organisation devoted to the faith.

It will work to increase representation, retention and promotion of Sikh officers, but critics question the need when there is already a national black police association.

They fear it will cause further division within the force at a time when British policing is already under attack.

However, BSPA chair Kashmira Singh Mann says Sikhs need to be heard.

But can other organisations fulfil concerned Sikhs concerns

http://www.kismatradio.com/news/?id=2135

http://www.sunriseradio.com/news/?id=2135

Bulletproof turban declared a farce

14 May 2009

Plans for a bulletproof turban are a "farce", according to the Metropolitan Police Sikh Association (MPSA).

They have been reacting to claims by the newly-launched British Sikh Police Association (BPSA) suggesting scientists are not far from developing a Kevlar-like fireproof turban.

Last week, the BSPA claimed Sikh officers were being sidelined for promotion because they could not join the more dangerous units like firearms.

However, the MPSA's Palbinder Singh says that is simply not true, as many can and do wear protective gear over the article of faith, and accuses the new association of trying to get publicity.

http://www.sunrisetv.tv/news/?id=2154

Dispute Between BSPA & MSPA

15 May 2009

The head of the British Sikh Police Association says Sikh officers should not have to compromise their faith by wearing a smaller turban.

Kashmira Singh Mann was responding to the criticisms made by Palbinder Singh of the Metropolitan Sikh Police Association, who says his campaign for a bulletproof turban is ridiculous.

Yesterday, Palbinder told Sunrise News he wears a smaller turban which fits under a helmet, which is adequate for Sikh officers.

However, Mr Singh Mann says it is wrong to expect everyone to be happy with his solution, and believes some officers' concerns have been neglected.

www.asiantimesonline.co.uk/news.html?groupId=7...5188

Met Sikhs fire turban bullet

27-05-2009

The bitter row between two Sikh groups over bullet-proof turbans for police officers has led to fears of a setback in the community’s fight for equality.

The Metropolitan Police Sikh Association (MPSA) has dismissed the idea of a turban made of special flame-retardant ballistic material as

“preposterous,” claiming it is an unnecessary waste of public money.

But the British Sikh Police Association (BSPA), which claims to represent hundreds of Sikhs who serve in the police, want the Home Office to develop the special protective headgear to ensure they are not excluded from fire-arms training.

The rift worries community leaders, who feel the row may backfire on serving Sikh officers. Palbinder Singh, chair of the MPSA, told Eastern Eye: “We are unsure whom the BSPA represent, but they do not have a mandate for representing the Sikh community, or Sikhs within the MPSA.

“Sikhism is a pragmatic, sensible, rational and progressive faith.

There is nothing preventing turbaned Sikh officers from participating in public order training or joining firearm teams, as they have been doing so for the last 30 years.”

The group points to cricketer Monty Panesar as an example of how protective helmets can be worn over a small turban or patka. It also says helmets used by Indian Sikh rulers between 1760 and 1850 are effective and don’t offend the faith.

(my personal comments: if we as Sikhs have let people have personal freedom and have not made comments on their inappropriate practices in their personal life which are not compatible with life as Sikhs, this should not be an excuse or reference material for other people to justify anti Sikh practices)

“A small turban can be worn under NATO-style helmets. Even our ancestors had seen the wisdom in it. There is no turban that can be designed to withstand fire or offer a screen against missiles. We hope that politically correct policy-makers do not pander to this dangerous idea,” Singh added.

The BSPA, which is currently in consultation with the National Police Improvement Agency and Home Office, termed the MPSA’s opposition as “obstructive and negative”.

Sgt Kashmira Singh Mann, BSPA chair, said: “Some turban-wearing Sikh officers have been participating in public order policing and firearms duty at the lower level by taking off their turban or wearing a small turban before wearing the NATO and Kevlar helmet. They have had to compromise their religious duty to do so".

“We have consulted with the Jathedar of the Akal Takht [head priest of the Golden Temple in Amritsar] and he supports our search for a universally acceptable solution to the problem. As the national voice for Sikh police officers and staff, it is incumbent on us to raise the issue.”

The Network of Sikh Organisations has characterised the row a “difference of opinion” that will be resolved amicably in favour of the approximately 80 turbaned Sikh officers in the UK, of which over 26 are believed to be in the Met.

Jaspal Singh, spokesperson for Sikh Federation UK, said: “The turban represents the Sikhs’ crown and to have to cover it up goes against the very principle. We support research into finding a solution.”

But Harmander Singh fears the issue could end up providing an excuse to some police services to discriminate against Sikh officers.

“If Sikhs can ride motorcycles and go on building sites without helmets, there is no reason why it should be an issue within the police force. There are various levels to firearms and riot training and in the majority of cases, the issue of full body armour does not even arise. This... should not become an excuse to not offer Sikhs the same level of promotion opportunities." he said.

I hope you have considered these news items and realise the threat that this division between the two police Sikh organisations (BSPA & MSPA) pose to the perception of Sikhs in the UK, Sikhs have fought long and hard to preserve the right to wear a Dastar in the UK and as a result UK law reflects the unique ability of Sikhs to where their Dastars.

But the most disturbing aspect of these events is the fact that Palbinder Singh has been chosen to give a talk on Baba Banda Singh Ji Bahadur's legacy on 27th June in Bristol. It can be seen quite clearly that it would be very inappropriate for a person of these views:

Yesterday, Palbinder told Sunrise News he wears a smaller turban which fits under a helmet, which is adequate for Sikh officers.

to say anything let alone give a talk on the legacy of Baba Banda Singh Ji Bahadur, if anything it would be an insult to the legacy of Baba Banda Singh Ji Bahadur.

More information for this event the web address is

http://www.thesikhway.com/bandasinghbahadurproject.html

Organisation arranging it web address is:

http://www.thesikhway.com/

[Guest shastr]

micheal jackson died?

[PAL 07]

kaljug mentality

[citizen_soulja]

yes, and apparently its a great loss to the world!!

"Enjoying his pleasures, one is reduced to a pile of ashes, and the soul passes away

He may be great, but when he dies, the chain is thrown around his neck, and he is led away.

There, his good and bad deeds are added up; sitting there, his account is read.

He is whipped, but finds no place of rest, and no one hears his cries of pain.

The blind man has wasted his life away. " Asa Ki Vaar

vaheguroo vaheguroo vaheguroo vaheguroo vaheguroo

only the power of naam can save us, only naam is valuable, everything else is an illusion.

(easy to say, hard to understand and follow)

[Jag_Singh]

wjkk wjkf

That seminar in Bristol was more about afro-Caribbean slavery. Very limited teachings of Baba Banda singh Bahadur ji. I think it was great for those who are new to Sikhi.

wjkk wjkf

[citizen_soulja]

really? what part was particularly good in your opinion for people who are new to Sikhi?

[Jag_Singh]

wjkk wjkf

To begin with, I think the whole layout of the seminar was quite professional. The brief explanation of how the khalsa was formed was based on a lot of dates. I spoke to one of the guys who told me he had learned alot about Sikhs, he actually took a fair bit of information on how the khalsa was created, what time's they were created and why it was created. Although the vast majority of the people from the seminar were keshdhari sikhs, I feel this should of been aimed at historians/students who study history, etc. But of course like most events this one does have many downsides, like of the ones you mentioned.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

wjkk wjkf

[citizen_soulja]

these down sides as you put it create confusion and division the dates they gave were debatable and the history they gave was from a Gora perspective, Sikhs themselves have not unified their collective history why do all these Gora run people insist on hijacking our history and telling our stories. If we look back at our history it is clear on numerous occasion how goreh deliberately created confusion and misinformation they lied, they stole, they cheated and betrayed and now they create proxy organisations to further propagate their whole divide and conquer mentality/strategy.

UNITY IS STRENGTH

EDUCATION IS POWER

VAHEGUROO IS SUPREME

[Jag_Singh]

these down sides as you put it create confusion and division the dates they gave were debatable and the history they gave was from a Gora perspective, Sikhs themselves have not unified their collective history why do all these Gora run people insist on hijacking our history and telling our stories. If we look back at our history it is clear on numerous occasion how goreh deliberately created confusion and misinformation they lied, they stole, they cheated and betrayed and now they create proxy organisations to further propagate their whole divide and conquer mentality/strategy.

UNITY IS STRENGTH

EDUCATION IS POWER

VAHEGUROO IS SUPREME

wjkk wjkf

Question is what are we doing about it?? we can create all these threads and criticize about the way our history is being distorted. However, what are we going to do about it. If you were at the seminar, why didn't you say anything, why didn't you correct them? instead of making countless threads of 'how we are ignoring' the issues, why don't we act upon them. Personally, I do think the organisers of the seminar were very carefully not to make any major mistakes, in terms of portraying Sikhi. You mention about the number of occasions the gorah have distorted Sikhi history, question comes back to what are we actually doing about it?? Debates on forums can last long, but turning that debate into action requires a lot of strength and power, as you have mentioned. We just need to focus on Waheguru, he is the guide.

I am trying to be very carful about what I type on these sikhi forums. These forums are constantly checked for updates of 'what our community is up to' by other organisers (I think we know who they are). The thing is there can be too much information on here for us/our background to get distorted.

Let's stop complaining about what is wrong, and focus on unity among khalsa panth.

Bhul chuk maaf

wjkk wjkf

[citizen_soulja]

let them check! there is nothing to hide or be afraid of we are talking about Sikhi, a Way of Life that preaches love and respect for all of mankind, but will never stand for injustice or tyranny!!

how can we have unity without sorting out the issues?

question IS WHAT ARE YOU DOING WE ALL HAVE RESPONSIBILITY

I can name 100+ organisations that are working to some level or another to collate, analyse, review, correct, support and educate our brothers and sisters, they never rest! when was the last time you gave a donation, not just money thats easy to do but actually donated your time and energy to help out even in your local Gurdwara?

the opposition we face is staggering (esp frm people claiming to be our own!!!!!)

When Guru Gobind Singh Ji said SAVA LAKH SE IK he wasnt just talking about the battlefield you know it also had a metaphoric meaning, think challenging an institution.

Forums are an excellent place to make common our thoughts and inspirations so that we may inspire others and have dialogue. Khalsa Ji you carry on being very careful when we need you we'll let you know

also:

i created 2 threads not ''countless''

the plan of the seminar was to distort

its not about having a shouting match at the seminar but rather to educate and take preventative measures and look at the bigger picture

its not about the seminar, one seminar cant do anything is about the organisations behind the seminar their long term objectives and their support network.

WE ARE ALWAYS WATCHING THEM 24 hours a day 7 days a week