Caste System

[randip singh]

As for Randip Singh, I leave it up to the sangat to form their own opinions about him, you only have to Google "randip singh jatt" so see this man's internet crusade against Jatts.

There is an old punjabi saying that says "pelo upnee manjee thalay dandha fayro"............you should do that first..........

Actually..................this started with a group of guys who called themselves sikhs who went on an anti-sikh crusade.............................are you sure you are not one of these fellows hiding behind an alias...................there are a number of these fellows here is a list of these crimes who claim to be proud jatts........

1) Insulted the Sikh Turban by refering to sikh as Towel Heads.....

2) Referred to the Guru's as weak Bhappa's........(I see you use the same term Bhappa).....

3) Posted pornography alongside Sikh symbols such as the Khandha......

4) Refrred to Sikh warriors such as Jassa Singh Ramgharia as Gullighara and woodpecker........

5) Insulted Shaeeds like Beant Singh who dispatched Indira Gandhi to hell...........refered to them as dirty Chamaars...........

6) Insulted the SIKH 10th Light Infantry because they are made up of Sikhs from Choorah and Chamaar background..........

7) Insulted great warriors like Baba Deep Singh Shaheed, and Bhai Mehtab Singh/Bhai Suka Singh.............

8)The most dispicab

le thing they said was mocking my relatives who were burnt to death by Hindu mobs in the Delhi riots...........youcannot get lower than that.........:wub:

etc etc etc.....the list further goes on..........

the name of the fellows who reside at jattworld are ajat, johaljatt, lordjatt, cp...........so before you make acusations about someone find out the facts..........

I will defend Sikhism till my dying breath and will not let a bunch of castist/racists (who incidently run down the name of decent jatt people) bring it into disripute

[The Khalsa Fauj]

Upmaa Khalsay Jaate Na Kahee!

The Khalsa is the highest caste joining which all other castes get destroyed! Simaple as that!

[amankaur]

Aman Kaur.....there are a hard core of about two or three people who write this divisive stuff..............

what did u exactly mean by this randip singh plz explain urslf!

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

PunjabiPredator Sahib Ji, a similar topic to this was discussed just a few weeks ago. The conclusion to that was the same as this...a Sikh does not care about caste/race/creed/gender/etc. There is nothing to discuss because as per the Guru Sahiban, a Sikh is a Sikh is a Sikh. What more is there to discuss? The ancestory of each and every Sikh who takes Amrit from the Panj Pyare is erased. They are told to abandon all previous associations and hold supreme their committment to the Khalsa. Their parents and their place of birth are changed. When authors commented on the Sikhs physically, they stated that when comparing the Sikhs to Punjabis and other Indians, there was an entirely different look to them, their posture and their entire being, almost as if they were a different race altogether. This was the heritage of the Gurus to the Khalsa Panth.

Tracing genetics and ancestry...what will that achieve for a Sikh? If anything, it is yet another distraction from what a person whould be doing...remembering Death and the Almighty. In the end, our body and our ancestry is not worth a dime...it all turns to dust.

[randip singh]

Aman Kaur.....there are a hard core of about two or three people who write this divisive stuff..............

what did u exactly mean by this randip singh plz explain urslf!

There are two or three guys that hide behind the jatt community and are writing very anti-sikh stuff..........recently they insulted Sant Bhindranwala too.......................they think they can get away with anything.............

there are two or three of these guys................one guy is called Sunny Singh Bains aka Sunny Singh aka Ajat (some say he has a muslim jatt mother and sikh father and has a hang up about Sikhs sticking together because of what happened to muslims in partition).............

...........another fellow is a guy who runs jattworld.com and calls himself lordjatt (he hides behind an alias).............someone e-mailed me saying that this fellow was a muslim jatt trying to split sikhs........

........a third fellow is johaljatt ( who is allegedly a hindu-jatt and a pro-Indian governement supporter ) again trying to split sikhs along jaat paat.............this guy also posts under aliases of Surrey Pride and HS Birk and boasts about being a Black Cat and torturing Sikhs)...............he made fun about my relatives being burnt alive by Hindu mobs in Delhi in 1984.......... :wub:

................a fourth fellow BS Dhillon who posts under XXX on indiaculture.net claims to be an Anthropologist and Historian, but is an Engineer.............claims Sikhism is really jattism and they should be seperate from other Sikhs.............

..........Now if you analyse this, then it is very clever because over 70% of Sikhs are from jat backgrounds....................get them away from Sikhi and into Jaat Paat fights and we have a very tiny minority of Sikhs left over from other sections...................

...........sister I suggest you let as many people know about these tactics to divide Sikhi and cause us to fight one another..................

...they all seem to plans strategies from www.jattworld.com.................see the discussion forum at www.sikh-history.com under "turban insulted" where a Sikh of jatt origin stopped posting at jattworld in disgust because of these shinanagans................

........its very sad and sinister............. :D ..............I think everything Sant Bhindranwala said is coming true...........

[sikhlionz]

When it comes to people still trapped under the caste regime it is best for them to refer to the Gubani specifically written by the Bhagat contributors to the SGGS as many were high caste, many were low but all were vehement on providing gian to northern india on the riculous nature of the caste regime that the people were allowing to be imposed upon them- most if not all their Gurbani can be seen at:

http://SikhLionz.com/bhagatz.htm

If people want to argue- let them waste away their lives in ignorance of the gian avaliable from Gurbani

If they have decided not to liberate themselves of worldly man-made bondages then don't waste your breath- let them close their minds to knowledge and find what is lurking on the path that they follow

Peace

[PunjabiPredator]

ms514

Sat Sri Akal:

PunjabiPredator Sahib Ji, a similar topic to this was discussed just a few weeks ago. The conclusion to that was the same as this...a Sikh does not care about caste/race/creed/gender/etc. There is nothing to discuss because as per the Guru Sahiban, a Sikh is a Sikh is a Sikh. What more is there to discuss? The ancestory of each and every Sikh who takes Amrit from the Panj Pyare is erased. They are told to abandon all previous associations and hold supreme their committment to the Khalsa. Their parents and their place of birth are changed. When authors commented on the Sikhs physically, they stated that when comparing the Sikhs to Punjabis and other Indians, there was an entirely different look to them, their posture and their entire being, almost as if they were a different race altogether. This was the heritage of the Gurus to the Khalsa Panth.

Tracing genetics and ancestry...what will that achieve for a Sikh? If anything, it is yet another distraction from what a person whould be doing...remembering Death and the Almighty. In the end, our body and our ancestry is not worth a dime...it all turns to dust.

I'm the one who started the last thread to see how many people believe in the caste/creed/race/gender and etc thing and what there opinions are of it. Not every Sikh knows about the caste/creed/race/gender/etc and ends up listening to there parents or friends who do follow t

hat and think of themselves as a Sikh. The point in discussing it is to make those people who still follow caste/creed/race/gender and etc and show them the true path of Sikhi which is to treat everyone equal and stop caring about the caste/creed/race/gender and etc. Not every Sikh is educated and knows alot about what his or her religion expects from them it could be because of age or nobody told them or they were bought up the wrong way and to believe in the wrong things. If we educate our own people it is not a loss it is a big gain for us this is the only way we will be able to accomplish anything together in the future. You might know about not to follow the caste/creed/race/gender and etc thing but many Sikhs do not still we need to help them understand better. :TH:

[PunjabiPredator]

When it comes to people still trapped under the caste regime it is best for them to refer to the Gubani specifically written by the Bhagat contributors to the SGGS as many were high caste, many were low but all were vehement on providing gian to northern india on the riculous nature of the caste regime that the people were allowing to be imposed upon them- most if not all their Gurbani can be seen at:

http://SikhLionz.com/bhagatz.htm

If people want to argue- let them waste away their lives in ignorance of the gian avaliable from Gurbani

If they have decided not to liberate themselves of worldly man-made bondages then don't waste your breath- let them close their minds to knowledge and find what is lurking on the path that they follow

Peace

What if they can only read things in English or can't read at all or write how you expect them to read the Gurbani not every Sikh is educated to read the Gurbani and can understand it. I agree people shouldn't be arguing but we should have discussions on this and help them understand and not leave them lurking on the wrong path.

[sikhlionz]

When it comes to people still trapped under the caste regime it is best for them to refer to the Gubani specifically written by the Bhagat contributors to the SGGS as many were high caste, many were low but all were vehement on providing gian to northern india on the riculous nature of the caste regime that the people were allowing to be imposed upon them- most if not all their Gurbani can be seen at:

http://SikhLionz.com/bhagatz.htm

If people want to argue- let them waste away their lives in ignorance of the gian avaliable from Gurbani

If they have decided not to liberate themselves of worldly man-made bondages then don't waste your breath- let them close their minds to knowledge and find what is lurking on the path that they follow

Peace

What if they can only read things in English or can't read at all or write how you expect them to read the Gurbani not every Sikh is educated to read the Gurbani and can understand it. I agree people shouldn't be arguing but we should have discussions on this and help them understand and not leave them lurking on the wrong path.

Had you visited the site you would've seen a line by line translation of all the bhagats Gurbani

totally agree that constructive discussions help put people on the right path but i was actually speaking about certain pro-caste people that were consistently visiting sikhi sites & forums to push their pro-caste agenda- these certain few people are just pushing their own pro-caste agenda and are not in the slightest way interested in learning about Sikhi.

Peace

[Mann_Jatt]

Hi Punjabi Predator, I still don't think you will ever understand what I am saying about preserving my culture and heritage. Let me ask you a question, do you believe it is ok for a Sikh to marry outside their faith?? According to your stand on equality this shouldn't really be a problem, am I correct???

Here's an article you might be interested in, this relates to my stand on this issue:

You Took My Breath Away 

Anont Singh Sun Jun 02

  

"This is how the Indian family system is structured. This is how the larger Indian community is organized in its caste system. Here I don't mean to neglect or absolve the Jat culture of Punjabi Sikh of its xenophobia. I also know how rampant the caste system is in the Sikhs, Jat or non-Jat." ('Marching Backwards With Élan And Energy', May 30)

Wow. We would not tolerate discrimination against females, untouchables, the disabled etc., but it is open season on Jats! Are we to accept anti-Jat chauvinism because it is fashionable for the self-proclaimed Sikh elite? How is this inconsistency squared?

What is this "xenophobia" of the Jats? The usual stereotype is of a most hospitable, generous and outgoing people, very happy to mix with, and emigrate to other cultures. They are reluctant to have their children intermarry with others. This is a trait shared with many other ethnic groups of ancient pedigree. This is not considered anti-social except by those eager to breakdown successful social structures,

and/or are envious of Jat characteristics.

I.J. Singh has usually enough in his articles to defend himself on either side of the argument. Here he makes no apology for suddenly attacking Jats in the most casual, offhand manner. Can we expect a suitably unbiased arbitration of some future Gurudwara dispute, when such a glaring bias is apparent?

Similar attacks on Loren Chan Singh were recently displayed. I feel proud that we have at least one Chinese Sikh who is articulate and courageous enough to call a spade a spade. Punjabi biased chauvinism trying to cloak itself in Sikhi - there is no other way to describe it - was the response to his very reasonable initial, and subsequent, articles. He was further logically supported by Alice Basarke's insightful essay.

Two types of ethnic chauvinism here: pro-Punjabi and anti-Jat.

This is surprising. Jats are the majority community amongst Punjabi Sikhs. Their infusion in the early days of the Nanak Panth irreversibly changed its character and ethos. Many Khalsa ideals correspond to general Jat characteristics, such as egalitarianism, kes, vigorous defense, etc. They are not part of the "caste" system that is bludgeoning Jats these days. They are a separate ethnic entity, maintaining their bloodline through socially enforced endogamy.

Central Asian Jats (a.k.a Scythians, etc.) who migrated to South Asia embraced Hinduism, Islam or Sikhi as their religion. They remain Jats. Where in the Guru Granth Sahib is it stated that one must give up one's ethnic identity to be a Sikh? Neither can I find any mention that one has to embrace the Punjabi culture to be a Sikh. There is ample condemnation of caste loyalty.

Jats, Chinese, Europeans etc. can all be Sikhs, without having to compromise their ethnicity. It is a specious argument to insist otherwise.

It is time to begin examining chauvinisms of all sorts that serve to cause unnecessary friction amongst us. We should be mature enough to accept that people from different ethn

icities can be Sikhs. Denouncing ethnic identity is not a prerequisite to being a Sikh. That very denunciation is anti-Sikh.

I hope the Sikhe.com editors are wise enough to discourage this ethnic bashing altogether.