dass

for me is one sant comment meant, there has only been on sant who lived and died by his bachan, there are many with the label but the as everyone knows actions speak louder than words.

Veer jee debated well with guru sahibs kirpa, please refrain from any pump shump for veer jee, I have watched many of his videos and firmly believe that to help monetarily is the best way of showing him and others our respect. ousathath ni(n)dhaa dhooo thiaagai khojai padh nirabaanaa || Renounce both praise and blame; seek instead the state of Nirvaanaa. May guru sahib bless more Sikhs to this kind of parchar in our youth, it is much needed...

Whilst I commend veer je for his amazing vids etc I think you will find to make it as simple as there is no argument to have isn't what the panth has been doing for the last 150 years... whilst I agree to debate the point is futile the reality is somewhat different and we all know that, veer jee should adhere to what the akal takhat says on these matter and not what a taksal or jatha or sampardaaa does, why ? because if we say we accept the akal takhat as the supreme authority then surely we have to accept the marayada ? Plenty will argue over this point, personally don't create a debate where this is not one. "Everyone agree ? " only if it was that simple....

At least people have cleared up the patit definition it is a fallen Sikh, one who has taken amrit and done one of the 4 kurtahits, personally think a decision like this can push people away, we should be inclusive not exclusive. It would have been better to say those wishing to do seva should be amritdahri etc, and also instructing gwara committees no more elections etc, (too much money wasted on that), simple concepts of parrchees etc.

hmm I would say the comment about them being patit for being monea is incorrect, a patit is a Sikh who has taken amrit and the done one of the four kurahits as per my understanding. I agree we should work under one banner etc, and if the majority of the gdwarea through the country are in support would make sense to support them, the leaders will be the same, the speeches the same, perhaps we should try and change this concept and invite all those who want to speak but make sure they are articulate speaker and not just shouting into the mike etc. It is a difficult enough event to arrange without causing dubtaa int he community.

just hope they implement such mattea to the max, ie no badal sitting on chairs in mahrajs hazzoori !!! they have left it a bit open, from now on ? so what about all the gwarea who have already got benches or chairs at the back ? do they remove ? can't have it both ways really, as ever we seem to worrying about the wrong things in the panth.

will truly be embarrassing if there is a clash of events, I suggest that they separate their weekends, personally think over the years we have done our demos but what does it achieve other than remembering for ourselves which we all do in our daily ardass, hope the organisers for next years events try and raise as much awareness through the English press and media, full page adverts informing the public what we are remembering and why !!

Parnaam shaeeda nou,,,, :respect:

http://sangattelevision.org/ tonight.

Good point, will mention it to the poster designer person...

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, waheuguru ji ki fateh Leicester are very blessed this weekend, akhand kirtani jatha rainsbhai keertan all night at clarendon park road, Guru Amar Das jee gurdwara, please attend and gain maxim laha, Bhai Gurpreet Singh ji shimla, Bhai Manjeet Singh jee glasgow, Bhai Jagdev singh ji paris and many more national keertanee attending... har dhin raen keertan gayeeiaa, bhor na joonee payeaa.... Waheguru ji ka khalsa Waheguru ji ki fateh... PS. Hopefully some of it live on one of the channels, can't promise so if you miss out, you miss out....

True akj_4eva., you had summarised the thread very well, there is an english say "do not talk ill of the dead", this is probably in relation to karma, what we want to be remembered as, sure the case has brought up some very dubious gala, which no one is comfortable with, again I am one of those who agrees that we do not need to make a song and dance about the past, who are we too judge, it is evident that gagandip had many faults, who doesn't ?, kaam get's the better of best of the best, who are we ? yes a rapist deserve's punishment, in a court of law, not when they have been murdered and accusations made after ? yes we will all pay for our actions, let us together do ardas that maharaj forgives him of any faults/sins and blesses him however guru sahib should decide.... we are just beggars at guru jis dhar...

Reality is, so called leaders sell out when it suits them, there are very few who will go all the way and give their head to the panth...those are dhan guru dhan guru pyearea

You will prob find they are most east europeans doing media courses and techinically cheap labour !! it is sad that we can't hire our sikhs brothers/sistes who already film etc for this purpose.. I agree it is quite embrassing for the sangat... it's like saying that we have no capable people to do filming etc.. I concur the channel has lost a lot of it's orginiality and needs to get back to what it started out as, all we see now are special discussion of ofcom ! sikh national council, etc etc.. never seen bbc have a debate on offcom report, maybe a 1 minute statement... personally what I really want to see is 10 Sikh channels, why ? cus it really cheeses me of seeing all the islamic ones, and to top it of sikh channel try to pass something not allowing any other channel !!! what the hell ??? come on sikh world, sikh HD, sikh 3dtv, sikh anything you want... let's have some competition for the sikh channel !!!

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/live-from-khalsa-primary

Off course their not going to be but at least they will fight the islamic fundamentalists first !!, they are seriously out of control, i was hoping lablour or liberal would have better policies on immigration but sadly the tories are the only ones willing to cap it, but the reality is they will only make the rich richer... which i don't fall into too... realistically I couldnt' ever vote bnp but it does worry you that one day the muslims will have some serious majority in this country... we really need the main parties to address the immigration issue... oh yeh i am barking mad, woooff woofff

umm good question, i'm pretty sure akjers do it up to dush dokh tai lay bajaye, not sure what taksalis or others do, good question

Got to be BNP !!! need to stop the islamfication of UK !!!!!

hey where have all the posts from last night gone ?? am i being censored ??? same thing this thread accused akj.org from.. so we do have some moderation on sikhsangat, bole so nihaall, sat sri akal... thank you for proving my point, about forums and moderation, contributors have there own views to blame a forum or have go at site is just hypocritical when you have just done the same thing on this thread, i rest my case... judge, now who is the judge, gps, onlyfive, singhfauja etc....anyways off to read the thread on chittarprakyan on dasam granth.. i do have an open mind , see if that serves as more educational than the other engish translation that was on this site.. quick question am i allowed to ask questions there ? or will i get censored

Hold on your asking me to state whether or not I believe in dasam granth as a whole, if i say no, you will say I am anit panthic, a nastik, a dusht, if I say yes you will say I am lying, cunning, and from my posts it seems I am being anti dasam granth, which way should I go ? let me put it this way, for me it is quite simple I get up in the morning, do by simran, nitnem (including jaap sahib, swayie, chaupai sahib), go to work, come home do so dhar, sohila, in between I spend time on line learning about sikhi and going on forums etc, do i have time to research the whole dasam granth when I do not have the knowledge according to some of the more educated posters on here about guru granth sahib, never mind the whole complex issue of dasam granth, so is it now a pre requesite to clarify you acceptance of the whole dasam granth to be a contributor on this board, have the guidelines changed since I joined 04, or whenever it was ?? see I don't represent anyone, never have done, never will do, why ? because who am I ? a no one, my username is dass, but am i really a dass ? have i written like a dass or have i written in ego ? houmai ? the problem with many who write on these threads and forums is they live a bubble, anyone pokes their bubble they get all defensive and make up stories, when people like me try and write something which we believe is according to gursikhi we are told you are cluesless, you are an fool why ? because we don't agree with giving the tite to dasam granth which the contributor bloom give's dasam granth,"" Dhan Dhan Sri DasamGuruKaGranth Sahib Jee ", i have never seen these titles written before, only now the debate has gone extreme both ways we have new titles being given to dasam granth, we have parrellel parkash being done, we almost indirectly are disrespecting Guru Granth Sahib, people will say no, it is lower and on the left hand side etc, but did Guru Arjan Dev ji put any Granth next to Guru Granth Sahib, did Guru Gobind singh ji ? it is easy to insult one another, easy to fight and knock dastara off, i notice loads of edits in post directed to me, yet I don't think I have insulted anyone ? you preach you understand dasam granth, yet you show so much hatred, you preach you are great gursikhs who love those gursikhs who show dedication to your cause but yet if they didn't read ragmala they are not sikhs in your minds !! let me put it this way many of us are in the category of avar updesh aap na karea, and the truth is avath javath janmea marea... the day we actually take gurbani in our hirdea and become gurbani in thought and action, only then will we be a gursikh, never mind gurmukh, sant, maha purash or bramhn gyani.... If by not giving a straight forward yes or no means you wish to warn me, ban me or chuck me of the board, I won't hold it against you, as the whole debate was around akj.org and whether or not they have the right to admin their board the way they do, so you as moderators do as you wish, I won't hold it against you...

pjs veer ji, are you not a moderator ? if so, surely you should chk the info that he is wrriten as correct before approving ? why allow a post just dissing a jathebandi ? what is so panthic about that ? the facts are all in correct, I take it he's is talking about bhausairaya who was chukced out of the panth, and bhai sahib turned his back on him with AKJ worldwide since then... the managla charan issue is something the panth has been discussing for some time, I know tapoban singhs have done a lot of research into this and believe they should be corrected alongwith many vidvaans, obviously sampardaahis will never allow this to happen... and when the prof prog happened, which was some years ago, this dasam granth issue wasn't even there and he atteneded many gurudwarea up and down the country, so fact for fact it's a gap shap post and you want me a contributore to rebuttle it ? what is your role then on this site ?? sorry for being blunt pjs veer ji but you asked the question.. and let's be honest about the nihungs, there are many questionable issues about their rehat in the uk, niddars crew are known for many kurtutaa.. just because there is an agreement on dasam granth by taksal and nihangs, their marayada on many issues is miles aapart fact, same with akj, so for years there are differences in maryada which everybody just go on with, now it is a case of stating who is a non panthic if they have a difference....

Prime example above of why moderation is so poor on this site !!! all the above post has done is write a story which I guess must be tru cus its on the pro dasam granth side, that is the difference between proper admin of a site and a free for all, i could come on here and write I was in cali yah, and i met some singh yeh, he was like, i'm akj, i believe in dasam granth 100% but those akjs in akj uk bunch of so and sos, cus my brothers, best mates, brother in law, mate, told me... i mean how childish can you get, grow up and treat subjects or discussion seriously !!!only five i got only one thing to say you too.. repect to you for being on such an antam jammee.. you must have some serious kamai... you worked out I am cunning person.. i am.... i am the worst of the worst.. if to write what I did is a sin then so be it.. I will take the shittar from the jamn when the time comes... and bloom.. WOW... you seriously confused bro.. but good luck on whatever you believe in..

Everything i've read in this thread is funny for me and always be, simply because if I took it all seriously I wouldn't sleep, i would be stressed, I would have white beard by now, the reality is this forum has changed, the moderators are friends of the posters, so to shut someone up the posters talk to mods, why was there a need for the mod to put up what he did, where did anyone discredit anything ? i've been a member on this forum a lot longer than most and have seen moderators come and ago but lately I see moderation no different to what you have accused akj.org off, either tow the line with us on everything or get ready to be told to shut up, is that what sikhi is about ??? You make it out that dasam granth is your guru, from everything you write, you can't have 2 gurus simple as that, only one granth is guru sahib and that is guru granth sahib, to say it's okay to have paraellel parkash, that is like going against the hukam of Guru gobind singh ji, Guru Granth jee manyeou pragath guru ki deh ? also did guru sahib do parkahs of dasam granth ? of course not because the granth was compiled later ? so if Guru Sahib never made a dasam granth, there must have been a reason, of course anything guru sahib said was to considered as mukh vaak, hukam etc, the debate on dasam granth will continue for years to come, pro and against, we should learn to accept that we all agree about our nitnem baniya, we prob agree with most of dasam granth but whether you like it or not, it will be difficult to convince the whole panth that everything is guru sahibs rachhnaa, if you are so learned about dasam granth, please explain to me when guru sahib had time to actually write it all, straightforward question, something I would have asked in the dasam granth topic but since we are discussing here, please educate, time line etc... Probably get edite or moderated for such questions but on one hand it is okay to write x y and x about akj,org but to question moderation on sikhsangat is probably anti panthic !!!!

So any idea when it's going to launch ? more sikh channels please.. more the better...muslims have like 12 or something...