Not2Cool2Argue

Theres differen types of intimacy. Emotional intimacy should also be saved for the spouse.

You have to merge with Waheguru. Actually be a sant. And once u r a sant. U will save many souks not just those of ur family. But taking amrit is just the first step, enrolling is school. To pass and that too with the highest marks. Is very hard in sikhi. Gurbani itself says only virle, rare ones make it across the ocean.

It was not only the diamond that was looted. If you look at British museums and auctions, they are filled with Sikh historical items. They literally stole our heritage. They have granths and pothis in auctions and museums. And shastars and who knows what else. About the ordinary people, you are probably right, their life probably did not change much. Except the inferiority complex they gained, from having been subjugated by a different culture yet again. Imagine if the Sikh empire was still going strong. If Maharaja Ranjit Singhs sons were anything like him, they would have bribed the europeans and built railroads, steamships, and cars, because it would have been military suicide to be behind in technology. And Ranjit Singh did try to keep up with the newest cannons and guns. Panjab wouldve had a strong infrastructure as well as a strong military. I wonder if we sikhs, would have revolted from the monarchy and wanted a democracy. Or how the empire wouldve dealth with communists. Was Maharaja Ranjit big on sponsoring artists and scholars? Cuz then we might have had a strong science institution, but I dont think he was. Unlike the Persian courts, I dont recall any mathematicians in his court. About the Mutiny, it was more that we never thought of ourselves as Indian. So we wouldn't have even thought of helping the other indians. To our and India's deteriment. Also, the mutiny soldiers were looting and killing civilians, not really rebelling or fighting the british. From what i recall. I dont think the white people were especially evil or devious...except the way they kidnapped Dalip Singh was kinda sad. Other invaders were more brutal and straight forward, none of this pulling strings from behind the scenes. They say he was around 5, when he was seperated from his mom, Rani Jinda. And he cried for days for his mom. And the Britsh caretakers of him, felt really bad for him, and wrote that If this wasnt for the greatness of Britain and our Queen, I could not do it. Maybe the british were used to these underhanded tactics from dealing with the countless alliances and kingdoms in Europe, and finding ways to thwart the Pope. They were always killing heirs, or forcefully marrying them off. I mean the mughals were always killing their siblings for the throne, but didnt really play mindgames with their victims and so maybe the british were especially devious.

Was the sarcasm not clear enough?

I know of one instance where its true. Sikhs in california were trying to commemorate 1984 genocide at the california stae university fresno And the indian embassy got involved in trying to ban it. Also the sikh coalition has been trying to get awareness about sikhs into schools and history textbooks. And Hindu organizations have been trying to replace Sikh history with their own rss agenda.

Its a 2 part problem. One is statistically, as a male you are more likely to know more males personally and can know if they are good and not. And of the women you do know, they will be the more outgoing 'bad ones' as they are hanging out or talking to males. The good girls dont really talk to random guys. Secondly, i noticed in India, people had really low opinion about sikhs born in the west. I thought it was just jeolousy. But I realized they were right. Most sikhs born in the West live in comfort and dont do any hard labor nor have any problems like court cases against their family etc. And this makes it easier for them to let go of sikhi when times become hard. And they are used to having their cake and eating it too. Like sikhi camps in the west are about fun and doing activities and not making it too boring. And theres fake meat options. Also most panjabi sikhs born in the west wear beautiful dumallas and chollas but their knowledge of sikhi is lacking, can barely speak panjabi. Or if they do know panjabi, they lack cultural, dharmi values. Like sharam. In gurudwaras, boys and girls hang out together, talking and laughing. This would be seen as obscene in india. Most ppl including sikh kids, get their worldviews from society. So the LGBTQ stuff, love marriages, havin relations before marriage is all seen as ok by western sikh kids. Basically ppl in the west treat sikhi as christians treat their religion. Only matters on Sunday, thats when u dress up in bana and learn to be a good person. But the rest of the week, no restrictions on pleasure. Plus lets be honest, temptation is hard. And in the west, negative consequences that keep us from giving into temptation, are non existent. There will be no village gossip, no damage to reputation, no shittar from parents, no being kicked out of the house. Its easy to keep secrets. As for solutions: it all begins in the family. Be strict with your children esp girls. But explain to them why as well. Dont be dictator. Explain to them that girls have lots of responsibility because they have power. In california, there was a case of a 14 year old dastaar wearing girl. She became pregnant and as her mom helped her kill it or abort it. Its unclear. The girl let it slip to her teacher 2 years later. The police was called, body of baby was found in backyard. And whole family arrested. Dad ended up comitting suicide, mom is in jail and the girl and her little brother in foster care. Because of the girl, whole family was destroyed. I guess we have to use fear as a motivator when temptation abounds.

Its a way to let ppl know we' re not muslims. And that we believe in feminism. So the men cover up and women dont. Equality right? Or at least reverse equality cuz we have to make up for the years women were opressed. Also, sikhs in america faced a dilemma when sikhs were getting killed post 9-11 because they were mistaken for muslims. So sikh organizations tried to do awareness campaigns. That we r sikhs. Not....but apparently saying Not Muslims wasnt ok. Because we were throwing the muslims under the bus and saying we are not muslims implies that being muslim is bad so now we have to act out that we're not muslims but another faith. So in documentaries sikhs are shown to eat pork. And we cant tell our women to cover up. And our dastaars have to be colorful.

Yes. Its sort of normal. Theres even a name for it. Post Amrit High. As soon as u learn about sikhi or take amrit, u r on a high. Have lots of motivation and desire to do bhagti. But then it fades. Its like u get the spiritual benefits of sangats kamaii and it fadea if we dont keep it up. But the important thing is to do simran and read gurbani when you don feel like it. Thats when u really grow. Also, read gurbani with meanings.

If u have kids and moving to canada. Be careful not to move to a city with panjabi gangs. U dont want ur kids to be lead astray. And friends are what land kids in trouble. America does have alot more farms and stuff. But where sikh ppl are living, population is rising and suburbs are growing into rural areas. About healthcare, thats why its important to get a job with good benefits and insurance. Or just health insurance in general. I have heard nightmare stories about the NHS and canadian universal health system...as have all americans so we are very weary of universal healthcare. Although it seems to be the democrats running ticket.

He is a good sikh. They say his son was abducted by the rss. Because his original lectures that he go famous for were about how RSS and other hindu elements are trying to add hindu elements into sikhi. I think that lecture was called Tabai Ros Jagyo. When his son was kidnapped, he kept doing the lectures and asked no one for help, just Guru Sahib. And his son was released. Most of his lectures are gurmat aligned.

Oops. Thx for pointing it out

Yes. If you respectfully do saskaar of it. Which involves burning in fire. Maybe buy an incinerator.

I found it in english on this site: http://www.vidhia.com/index.php?q=f&f=%2FRattan+Singh+Bhangu Also check out turiyacharity.com And there are recordings of katha done of this online too.

Spot on. There are 2 young sikh guys in our gurudwara who fit this criteria. 1 always hangs out with women, is in the kitchen and does all the baking, acts like a women, laughs girly and everything. . And other sikhs make fun of him and exclude him. All our dastardhari. And i do feel sorry for him. He is more giggly and smily then most girls. And he is supposed to represent the warrior-khalsa image? So i think ur point that its on the parents not to push kids too much is right. But then we have to rewire some misconceptions that have come up. Now taking Amrit is seen as taking on a Guru. Which SGGS talks about is important. However, I think in the past we had sehajdharis and the khalsa. And the sehajdharis were just as spiritual. However, even if we reinstate the sehajdhari concept. Lots of problems remain. 1. Will we allow sehajdharis to then be openly homosexual? 2. Most ppl will want to take the sehajdhari, easy way out and amritdharis will decrease if we say spiritually they r equal. (It happened to nuns, when pope declared nuns were no more special or closer to God then normal catholics, nun became obsolete almost)....we can counter that with the cool warrior image ofc 3. There is no structure to sehajdhari lifestyle. It has been lost. We dont know how to dharan a guru, without amrit sinchaar. If this ever existed. Or another way to solve this problem. Without bringing up the sehajdhari controversy is to have an age limit or age of consent of amrit sinchaar. It doesnt have to be law, or amendment in rehit maryade, as there will be exceptions. Like spiritual roohs who have taken birth jist to get amrit. We can just make it a cultural taboo. Like no taking amrit before age 15 or 20 or until u r married. I think most ppl in the past used to take amrit right before their anand karaj. Or make it a requirement that u must have studied this or done this amount of paath. Or just have intelligent panj pyare who judge on each case.

I was listening to a debate with a homosexual. And he admited that pedophilia or at least grooming youngsters is a large part of homosexuality. That older homosexuals initiate younger ones into the lifestyle. And that person themselves was groomed.at age 16 by a 30 yr old catholic priest. He saw nothing wrong with it. Until years later, he had a stepchild who was 16 and realized how young that was and how gross. And I do commend ur views that religion and homosexuality dont really belong. And applaud that you chose to live a normal grihsti life. If God forbid, ur child turns out to be gay. What would you recommend that child, what would u do differently. What do u think a just and fair society would for gays look like? And do u think its possible to cure gays, do u think is a mental issue or a choice? Sorry if anything i said was offensive.

You are right. But so far, i have only seen our ppl, even the intellectuals and the religious (like satpal singh) echo what is said in wider society. Even on this forum, we have the ppl who have the alt-right views like hating feminism, the Jew Question, Racial supremacy, worrying abt birth rates and interracial marriages. Or the other end sjw liberals. Who are for gay rights, islam, and open borders. And think sikhi has no racial identity. Obviously, the righteous path is the middle path which is the most difficult to articulate and get behind. Honestly tho, the alt-right has the most reality based standpoints. And as more and more ppl start following them, we better be ready. The smartest thing to do would be to use our western advantages and begin relocating to punjab. Atleast have a viable career option and own some land. But dont let land just be empty. And if our migration here was wrong, lets start fixing it before its forced on us. And while we have the option to take advantage. The race realism theory, that different races have different IQs is gaining ground. And more ppl seem to be supporting ethnostates. So far its a fringe movement, but with the refugee crisis, more ppl are waking up. I really want to see if there is a way for us to thrive without the West. I want to show the world, that sanitation, democracy or at least justice and egalitarianism and scientific advancement are not only white constructs. I think we should move back and #MakePunjabGreatAgain. Ofc this is farfetched. But i dont see any other solution. Unless we join in the anti Muslim anti immigrants policies in our current countries. But this has the danger of backlashing onto usAnd toadying up to racists is degrading. And really hard to get support of all the liberal sikhs.

Wow. Such sensible views. Its so sad that sensible views are so rare and seem so groundbreaking and intelligent in todays world. My favorite quote is Liberal ideas eat themselves. But liberals will say children need to know about LGBTQ etc. Because they wont know what they are going through and suffer alone...But schools should not be helping shape the kids political nor moral views. Only morals as far as societal function.

Not to mention Dhirmaliye and Meene

Yes! You get what i mean. But is that view which is so pragmatic and was prevelent until recently, is it wrong? Is it againest Gurmat? To be honest tho, the argument that what if it was ur sister who was married to the gay person....does sway me a bit... Also although arranged marriages are considered gurmat. Where one accepts hukam and doesnt complain abt the spouse they ended up with. But its really hard to do. And our thinking has changed alot. We have adopted all the western mentality about love, marriage, gay ppl. But i wonder if the western view is more enlightened. Its easier to go abt having a marriage with love/lust. "Sikhism" doesnt really have answers to this stuff. The culture of the time that was prevalent in gurus time. Do we continue following it? Yes but there is no way to make sure that the compatibility is right. And in terms of spirituality, shouldnt we work on controlling our mind/urges...

You also have to be fair. If the dad works outside the home and has a job. Then the mom and the wife who dont work. The least they can do is housework.

Thx for answering. Thats a good answer. BUT gay ppl have been having kids for many years. Even in the west. Gay ppl would get married and have side affairs. A gay person even said it was better in the 60s, u got to have a family and a affairs in the side. Im not condoning that. I am just saying it was possible.

i must be dense, i still dont get how a gay person getting married is a bad thing. I get 2 gay men getting married as a bad thing, but not between a gay man and a women. I thought the best advice we could give a gay person, was to get married and have wife and kids and not to stray. I mean that is what all religions advocate for. From catholics to mormans. Forget ur gayness, its a delusion, and get married. Right? I mean it was only recently that ppl accepted being gay isnt a choice...

hes not. He just really into religion right now. After he graduated from high school. He started learning santhiya from local taksalis. Then he went to india and is learning sooraj parkash and dasam granth santhiya from a highly respected dera who learnt from sant gurbachan singh ji . In the west, to go live with the nihangs or join taksal are always the daydreams of young boys and parents have to disuade them. Marriage seems really boring in the early 20s...his parents want him to go to college to be engineer etc...seems really boring Also i did not want to change the subject about ur marriage problems and how ur treating ur wife. U do need to be nicer to her. If my father yelled at me and told me "why dont u know wat to buy for groceries, are u just there to eat?" i would be super hurt. Its basically telling me I am lazy and that they begrudge if I eat without helping out. There was a recent podcast about marriage and she said, "Its really hard to move from a house where u are loved to a house where no one cares about u." Please be nice to her. Also the best way to foil her saajish, is not to participate or care. Then her passive aggressiveness wont matter. If she yells NO, to u asking her to go to gurudwara, say fine suit urself. And go have fun. why isnt it acceptable? in the olden days there wasnt really an option for gay men either unless it was celibacy i guess. I would think its a perfect solution. To live a householders life without lust. Maybe i am naive, but i like to think love/lust isnt important to marriage?

Do ardaas to guruji and ask for forgiveness. Every person has to decide how much they will listen to guruji when worldly it hurts them. Its a majboori. Try to make a decision that once i have reached this amt of money, or paid this much mortgage, i will stop doing this.

How did he lie? No one asks u if ur gay. I think even if a guy admitted to being gay, noone would disqualify them from marriage in india. Parents and inlaws would just expect u to suck up ur wants and fantasies and to manage ur feelings and live a virtous family life. Girls have been married off for millenia without taking their wants into consideration. Marriage was their life occupation, there was no out to it. Now men too are bound to it, whether gay or not. Parents demand an heir esp if only son. My cousin wants to be behungum/ celibate baba but his parents wont hear of it.