Jai Tegang!

This is an amazing collection of art in one thread. Wonder what happened to @puzzled ? He posted amusing anecdotes. I also wanted to say you had a terrific thread on Vaisakhi with all the art work. This is real art and culture. Stuff that will be appreciated even centuries later and provide crucial details about our puratan lifestyle.

I'm sorry to divert this thread, but this must be shared ! lol

That is some crazy nice art (the top one).

You can't undo image damage after this

Most people will want to take the easy route and follow majority habits. It’s the religious gatekeepers’ job to figure out ways to keep members motivated to follow rules (that aren’t entirely intuitive), especially since we lack any real political power to influence these decisions. If you keep belittling people, they will continue the outward drift. We should be grateful that monay have not completely cut all ties, no pun intended, because they easily could (just look at some of the western born who have no link to Sikhi whatsoever). There are more than enough vultures circling atop ready to take them in. I’m afraid your attitude just contributes to this and affects more those who are still Sikhi oriented, because the others I have alluded to don’t even need to provide an excuse, they will disown completely.

I think you're exaggerating this to suit your set pattern thinking. There are also some kesadharis who hold the same view of progressing to their logical next step, but we don't go hounding them out of the Panth. You seem to have a hard time digesting the ground realities of the religious adherence composition of the Panth. Having fewer kesadharis and amritdharis is a result of our collective failures and inability to guard against modernity forces, especially in Punjab, given that we should have set the standard in our own majority area. But it can't be remedied by driving out and belittling everyone below whatever bar you set.

musli-yudh presents a real danger of Islamification of the offspring. Last thing you want is some half breed laying claim to the khalsa raaj throne with the help of rangarhs and pathaans. Akalis were strict about all things related to Islam and keeping its influence at bay. Sardars were not strict rehitvaans all across the board, but they pledged allegiance to the Panth, and that was good enough from a political perspective.

Goray here were no different to all the other places our people found themselves in. Racism was in-your-face, unapologetic, and especially sharp for Indians (or "asians", as you guys call it in the UK). I've heard the older generation's stories and experienced the waning days of it myself. We tended to just absorb and ignore most of it. Only when enough of our youngsters starting filling the classrooms that there were more school-yard scraps and a greater push back. It was in the early 90s when the gangster culture took root, with influence from the American black culture that was so prevalent in the media. The late 80s and 90s also brought in many kharku families and this helped the community find some long lost strength.

It's good they are upfront about how they feel about us since our people tend to be a bit slow in picking up subtle messages. The message is clear from their side: don’t hitch your wagon for a free “victim ride”. Give proportionate respect back to black orgs and individuals that stand by us, but none of this sikh coalition free pass. If racists think we have sign on our forehead reading “take-a-swing-at-the-raghead”, it’s only because we allow it. This problem gets solved by sending out clear and blunt messages through all channels.

The impending civil war between muslims and hindus is going to show us what atrocities both these groups are capable of committing. Make no mistake, the muslims are going to show their most vicious side in the areas they have large numbers and drive out hindus (if only temporarily). They will fight dirty. Women have no chance of safety. If there are some unlucky Sikhs there, they won't be spared. There is a chance of survival of sikhs in hindu areas, but it's not a certainty.

Cheley chatray tend to do that to any group, brother. You will see the same issues across the board. But we have to be careful how we approach the regular maintenance that is required without hurting the common sangat. It’s a delicate balance between destroying something and repairing it.

I think you need to step back and put your ego in check @shastarSingh. Referring to Baba Nand Singh Ji with such little respect isn't in your interest. These Mahapursh have contributed to Sikhi in ways we can't put a number to. Inspiring people to follow Sikhi in a genuine way and igniting the joy of bhagati is not an easy task. You can lump all intellectuals gyanis and parcharks on one side and they can never inspire the way a mahapursh Sant mahatma can. Don't take this the wrong way, we need all the intellectuals we can get, but their domain is never going to extend into the realms of these rarest of the rare type mahapurshs. You need approach these panthic matters with more grace. There is a way of offering constructive criticism without insulting. You need to refine these skills before speaking beyond your scope. Also, current Nanaksar as an institution is a complex matter, and also separate from Baba Nand Singh Ji.

This is one of the main culprits. I was shocked to see this phenomenon. No protection, satkaar, seva of Saroops. Just an ego-driven obsession to build. But never maintain or utilize. Only One Gurdwara per village should have the privelege to house Saroop of Maharaj. Others can do whatever they want.

I think you got him back good with this nickname?

It is. The factors include: overall population of BC is quite low (5 million) and the Lower Mainland holds 3 million of this. We have a massive stronghold in Surrey with our people numbering around 200,000 there alone. Not only Surrey, but we have many surrounding cities where we have decent numbers and well established communities dating back to 1900's. Then, we have communities scattered all over the rural and far-flung smaller towns and cities that were historically mill-towns. With plenty of young guys willing to get their hands dirty, heavy presence in trades, trucking, farming, lumber, the general image is rough and tough. It could be cleaner, with dirty, useless, low-class gang wars costing us too many boys, no doubt, but well better than the "docile asian" image many westerners hold.

All fair points. But isn't this true of all ethno/religious groups? The vast majority of men of any religion are only observant in the orthodox sense if there is a heavy-handed religious authority that wields actual power over them. Left to their own choices, the number of "true followers" is never in majority. Maybe there are only a few hundred "true Sikhs" if we apply more stringent criteria, but where does that take us as a group? You can keep applying rules to prune down our numbers to no end. First it'll be kesadhari only. Then it can come down to only Amritdharis are Sikhs. Lets take it one more step and say only those Amritdharis who have weapons training and keep atleast 5 weapons at all times are Sikhs. Then we can jump into the spiritual realm and start pruning out those who don't get up early enough. Pretty soon the definition is going to end up at only a well trained brahmgyani khalsa is a Sikh.

You are suffering from unused man energy. I think a bit of physical training and some guns and a nice amrithdari girl would answer all your questions.

why are you not amritdhari?

Are you amritdhari or just kesadhari?

We need to promote large families and actually provide resources to support them. If Sikhs keep going with 1-2 kids our problems are only going to get worse, especially in Punjab/India. Our community holding back a few extra hundred thousand kids per year has no impact on India's demographics, never mind global. The results of our birth control are being felt already with villages emptied of youth, disintegrating family ties, non-sikhs pushing into Punjab. You will see more and more churches and masjids mushrooming with fewer youths willing to protest for our kaumi rights. Caring for the environment is all good, and so is controlled population growth, but it all depends on where you are in the world. India is locked in a birthing race between the muslims and hindus and Sikhs think this doesn't affect them. It certainly does! If we don't keep up, as we are not, we will suffer the consequences, as we are.

It’s some kind of subconscious defeatist attitude masquerading as high morality. These types remind me of the groveling elite Hindus during the Muslim invasions who helped turn their co-religionists into fodder, all for self preservation.The recent clash with the gujjars showed that the vast majority couldn’t care less, and it took a certain amount of shaming to finally elicit a belated response from our panthic circles. Even then, only a few could resist the urge to retreat into bhaichara instead of applying the sledgehammer approach that this situation deserved. I sure hope the future fight for survival is not a lonely one and enough of us can grow a spine and live up to a fraction of what our forefathers fought for.

I looked up Hanwantar in Mahan Kosh and it doesn't explain the reasoning for using it in parallel with Hanuman. "Han" is explained as jaw, and Hanwantar is explained as "having a protruding jaw". Maybe he was from the more primitive tribals inhabiting India at the time.

There is a Shabad By Sri Guru Ramdass Ji that alludes to pirthi chand on Ang 1200: ਕਾਹੇ ਪੂਤ ਝਗਰਤ ਹਉ ਸੰਗਿ ਬਾਪ ॥ O son, why do you argue with your father? ਜਿਨ ਕੇ ਜਣੇ ਬਡੀਰੇ ਤੁਮ ਹਉ ਤਿਨ ਸਿਉ ਝਗਰਤ ਪਾਪ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥ It is a sin to argue with the one who fathered you and raised you. ||1||Pause|| There are several shabads that mention Hanuman (also mentioned as Hanwantar). Here is one, for example: ਮਨ ਮਹਿ ਝੂਰੈ ਰਾਮਚੰਦੁ ਸੀਤਾ ਲਛਮਣ ਜੋਗੁ ॥ In his mind, Raam Chand mourned for Sita and Lachhman. ਹਣਵੰਤਰੁ ਆਰਾਧਿਆ ਆਇਆ ਕਰਿ ਸੰਜੋਗੁ ॥ Then, he remembered Hanuman the monkey-god, who came to him. ਭੂਲਾ ਦੈਤੁ ਨ ਸਮਝਈ ਤਿਨਿ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕੀਏ ਕਾਮ ॥ The misguided demon did not understand that God is the Doer of deeds. ਨਾਨਕ ਵੇਪਰਵਾਹੁ ਸੋ ਕਿਰਤੁ ਨ ਮਿਟਈ ਰਾਮ ॥੨੬॥ O Nanak, the actions of the Self-existent Lord cannot be erased. ||26||

You would think more people in Punjab might have the lemons to say what needs to be done, but no, it's always those born and/or raised thousands of miles in foreign lands that seem to give a f. You can excuse the political class as it caters to the lowest denominator, but where are our religious groups? Where is the dard for the kaums survival? The integrity of our demographics in our last bastion of refuge?

It's shocking how many mosques have been built in Punjab, just by this Kerala based Islamic group, never mind the hundreds more that have been re-started by Wakf board from post-47, and the new ones constructed by UP and Bihari muslims. Add to this mixture you have gujjars settling down and no doubt they will build their own. How many new Gurdwaras have Sikhs opened up in pakistan punjab, I wonder? We all the know the answer! Our kaum in Punjab needs to wake up and realize that we lost our prime agriculture land and half of our shrines on that side with an understanding of living free of them. It's basic survival instinct, and we seem to have traded it for virtue signalling and umbrella-holding pics for social media. https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/nation/kerala-ngo-diverts-funds-via-jk-to-build-mosques-in-faridkot-382501 Kerala NGO diverts funds via J&K to build mosques in Punjab's Faridkot SHARE ARTICLE Tribune News Service Jupinderjit Singh Chandigarh, March 31 A Kerala-based NGO, Relief and Charitable Foundation of India (RCFI), which has no unit in Punjab, has caught the eye of the security agencies over its “curious” funding of the construction of three mosques in Faridkot district. One of the newly constructed mosques in Faridkot district. The funds, received from persons or organisations abroad, were diverted through two residents of Baramulla in Kashmir, who reportedly supervised the construction and paid the bills. These mosques, built between 2015 and 2017, are located within 40-70 km from the Pakistan border. A report by the Union Ministry of Home Affairs states the RCFI diverted international funds worth Rs 70 crore for the construction of mosques. The MHA had stopped the funding in August 2021, it is learnt. The Punjab Police and other security agencies had also red-flagged the matter. There are more than 200 mosques in the border districts of Ferozepur, Tarn Taran, Amritsar, Gurdaspur and Pathankot. Sources said many of these were built recently. Their location close to the border is also the subject of investigation. The RCFI has not responded in detail to queries made by The Tribune. One of its spokespersons, who identified himself as Salaam Ustaad confirmed the organisation had no unit in Punjab. He claimed a detailed reply to the allegations had already been sent to the MHA. He insisted the RCFI indulged in social work which was suffering due to the “arbitrary ban” on international funding imposed by the Union Government. The RCFI website says it is a certified non-denominational organisation founded in 2000, with the mission to uplift the socio-cultural aspects of backward sections at the grass-roots level. It does not mention the construction of mosques as its mandate. It claims, “The genesis of the RCFI is to improve the quality of life for the most marginalised communities. The organisation has directly reached almost 2.35 million people in 24 states with the support of national and international funding agencies and individual private donors. It works in diverse fields from water and sanitation to health, sustainable measures to support livelihood and disaster risk reduction and response, cultural restoration to school improvement, and family food security to individual special care programme.”