Naam simran in Kirtan?

[akjforever]

That's exactly what I told him, he kept insisting that naam does not mean to physically say the name, esp not in kirtan. I have actually decided to limit my going to Gurdwara because all of the politics. Because everytime I go, I am criticized, and I come back angry @ . I think it is better to do kirtan at home or in GurSikh sangat.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Jkaur]

i know how you exactly feel virji.. i have gone through the same thing back here.. its really frustrating at times and you just wish to limit yourself from gurdwara.. thats what ive done before but then i realise im not in the fault.. im not doin any mistake.. why should i stop going to guru ghar.. i started going back and i just stay away from this people.. whenever they say athin i will just smile and walk away... thats the BEST.. but dun let them get onto your head.. i do tell them off but not too frequent ...

Go on doing kirtan as you are doing virji.. nothing's wrong in repeating waheguru in between shabads... its a gurmantar..

bhul chuk maaf karni

[akjforever]

Jkaur Bhenji, I agree with your post. But I feel that if I go something always happens or someone says something against Naam Simran. And the interesting thing is that no one said anything before about this topic. But they started saying all this stuff recently when we started doing kirtan. So they are taking cheap shots at us. Not going to Gurukar may sound harsh as a solution to this problem. But if I go there, those people will not stop from saying or doing things to not just me, but anyone who does something that they don't agree with. When I go there I lose my shanti, rather than receiving it.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Balait_da_Sher]

That's exactly what I told him, he kept insisting that naam does not mean to physically say the name, esp not in kirtan.  I have actually decided to limit my going to Gurdwara because all of the politics.  Because everytime I go, I am criticized, and I come back angry @ .  I think it is better to do kirtan at home or in GurSikh sangat.   

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

Same here, Everytime i go to the gurdwara i come back angry. When i practise playing tabla on my own , with shabads form amrit kirten , i can go on for hours but at the gurdwara i can't last more than 30 mints without getting distracted by poeple talking etc.

[akjforever]

I wonder why these intellectual types have such a problem with one of the basic tenets of Sikhi?

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[japmans]

if i may add:

doing simran in keertan, though it may seem appropriate anywhere, i'm not so sure that it is.

for example, i think that it makes sense to add simran into the shabad when the shabad itself "promotes" (didn't have a better word) the japping of naam. e.g:

naam jappo jee aisai aissai..

jap man satnaam sada satnam

naam jappo meray saajan saina

but on the other hand, i don't think we should put simran when the lines tlk about the adverse impact of not doing simran. for example, if we don't do simran, then so and so happens.

i know this may be a bit confusing, but i thought i'd just add my two cents.

[japmans]

and i forgot to add...

don't stop going to gurdwara. i don't think it's the right thing to do. Don't let the losers stop you from getting to Guru's Ghar...

[bhainjee]

waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh!

"i dont see anything wrong with doing simran in the midst of keertan. not only akj does it..but even ragee keertanees like bhai anoop singh and bhai harjinder singh srinagar wala do simra"

Does that mean, these people set the standard for how keertan should be done?

Why is it that no dhunee (repetation of waheguru in keertan) is allowed at Sri Darbar Sahib? This is a fairly new thing introduced into keertan, and these new raagee's like most akhand keertanee's are starting to do dhunee in keertan.

I know it seems wierd, you're all probably thinking "why can't we just repeat waheguru in a shabad? it's no big deal.." actually it is a big deal...

If Guru sahib wanted to us to say waheguru when reading a shabad in keertan roop, then Guru sahib would have placed the shabad waheguru there. We are to do gupt naam abhyaas (svaasaa naal) as often as we can, ideally all the time....

Just recently there was a discussion related to this on the following thread, please give it a read open-mindedly :

http://www.tapoban.org/phorum/read.ppa?f=1...1&i=5800&t=5800

When keertan is done in raag, no dhunee is done, and it is said that that is how gurbanee ucharan keetee geyee see, so why would someone come and want to change how Akal purakh uttered Gurbanee through our Guru's?

Please think rationally and open mindedly about this subject, there is no reason that one should separate the beautiful Gurbanee Akal Purakh Himself gave us ,with our own matt. Who are we to come and say that we can do wh

at we want with our keertan because everyone is doing it...I specifically remember when I was little, not once did I ever hear simran in keertan at gurdwara sahib, not once. Now it seems like a trend to start with simran, finish with simran and put it in the middle of a shabad more than one time.

Do you think we can make a shabad already so rich more beautiful by repeating waheguru in it?

[akjforever]

There are two issues here:

1. Should naam simran be done in kirtan?

2. What does naam refer to when mentioned in Gurbani?

The first issue wasn't the focus of my discussion with this person even though that point did show up, but he refused to believe that the mention of "naam" = Waheguru. He said how do you know that is the name? Why can't it be anything else? And why repeat it? Repeating it won't do anything. Those were his words.

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[japmans]

Do you think we can make a shabad already so rich more beautiful by repeating waheguru in it?

so re you saying, bhainjee, that doing simran in the shabad is actually dullifying the shabad??

akjforever:

this might be an opportune to answer a question with a question...

he asks how you know that naam is waheguru, ask him how he knows that it isn't..... see where that might take you...

but at the same time, be prepared with your own argument...and please don't forget to make sure you know the whole shabad when you refer to tuks.. sometimes what happens is that the actual meaning and direction of the shabad is disgraced when we take a tuk here and there just to modify and reinforce an argument..