Guru Jee Called a book!

[Guest noonespecial]

don't forget to do sohkasin for your computer as well also. Also whenever you take it anywhere make sure you have 5 Singhs..

I kinda agree with ssk. In all honestly Khalsa4Ever I don't understand why you're DEFENDING the Toronto Star for calling Guru Sahib a book!

When you Matha Tekh to Guru Sahib do you look up and see a "book" or do you see your LIVING Guru? Which one is it? If it's the latter then quit continuing this debate.

[Khalsa4ever]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

All I am trying to do is show that the Guru is in the eye of the beholder. If we wish to believe that our Guru is signified by the actual words, then we should look at ourselves and see that we do not even respect Guru's word, so why should they? For them it is a book... for us, the SGGS on computer is mearly a file, one that can be written, edited, erased at our wim.

I will quit this debate, but not before we all understand what kind of double standard we have applied to others. I have faith in my Guru, but I also know that my Guru exists beyond the hardcover backing, glue, paper, and ink. When will we all realize this?

We think we have come soooo far. Well, interesting fact: I have a small sized Guru Granth Sahib at home (the writing is tiny), so we tried to give it to the Gurdwara. At that point I learned that the Gurdwara disposes of any SGGSs that they have extra. THEY THROW IT IN THE GARBAGE. This got me thinking... is it OK to throw your Guru in the Garbage? (NO). But are we? The Gurdwara thinks of it like any other book... why should a Christian writer think of it as anything else? If it is MORE than a book, it is because of what it contains... and in the same way, that pathetic 200 kb computer file is also MORE than just a file. It is our Guru. Just as it is on paper. One and the same. If you seriously believe that they are NOT the same, are you attempting to tell others that the paper, ink, and hardcover backing has magically transformed this irrelevant computer file into your Guru?

Tha

t said, I know that even I treat my Guru with no respect... and at least this post has taught me this much.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[SaadhRayn Kaur]

I'm not defending Toronto Star and I agree with ssk but I also agree with Khalsa4ever.

As Guru Gobind Singh jee gave gurgadhee to a ladeevaar suroop which was hand-written by a rehitdharee Gursikh,

I think a ladeevaar suroop which was hand-written by a rehitdharee Gursikh is the PARTHAKH, PURAN suroop of Guru jee.

However, Guru jee can give you darshan in other ways. You can get Guru jee's darshan when you concentrate on your shaster. You can get Guru jee's darshan when you bring together five Singhs. If five aren't there, look at yourself in the mirror and there is Guru jee.

When you read the daily hukamnama, or go to Sikhitothemax, you ARE doing Guru jee's darshan.

Guru jee says, baanee guroo guroo hai baanee

Guru jee does not say, kaagaz (paper) guroo or shaee (ink) guroo.

Clearly baanee guroo guroo hai baanee means the WORD and the word can be communicated in different energies.

Dhan Guru Baba Nanak Shabad Guru Jyot Suroop Guru Granth Sahib jee can give you darshan in many ways and the appropriate respect is a matter of love, faith and shardaa.

When you get a sticker with gurbani on it why do you treat it nicely?

what about if there was a cup with gurbani on it?

Let's take it to the next level and say what would you do if there was a box with Gurbani on it? How would you treat it?

And is it the bani itself, or YOUR DARSHAN of the bani that matters?

Because what if you're listening to Gurbani on the radio - and Gurbani is coming out of there.

Can you protect the airwaves? probably not. But can you avoid your radio from being put in

a disrespectful place? And is that wrong?

I think it's all shardaa. Whatever people do - let them do it, and let them have their own shardaa. We have no right to judge others. It is only Guru jee's hukam that Guru jee has appointed the Dharam Raaj to make the judgements - that is not our job. And I'm sure dharam raaj does a good enough job so we should stop trying to do it for him. We should just mind our own business and let other people respect Gurbani the way that they think is most appropriate.

"bhola bhaao gobind milaavai"

"gobind bhaao bhagat kaa bhukhaa"

"bhaavanee bhagat bhaae kaudee agar bhaag rakh thaahe gur sarab nidhaan dhaan dayt hain"

I am sincerely sorry fo r any mistakes against Gurmat and Saadh Sangat jee please forgive me and may Guru jee bless everybody with naam and chardee kalaa.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[Guest noonespecial]

Veerji,

Is your file on your computer a tangible thing? Can you TOUCH your computer file? Can you TOUCH the bytes and the computer data that are there? No you can't...

Therefore you can't be saying that Guru Sahib is a mere book.

At home I can TOUCH my Guru Sahib. I can spend time with Him and sit and learn from Him. I can do Sohkasin Dee Seva FOR my Guru.

Also realize that the thinking that you have leads to a very dangerous place. On this site right now we are having a discussion about Naamdhari's. They believe Guru Granth Sahib Jee to be a book. They believe that the need for a human Guru is needed. The more you believe Guru Granth Sahib is your LIVING Guru then the less chance of there being sects who twist Sikhi.

Also please read Sant Baba Harnaam Singh Jee's biography. He has a episode noted where he saw the JOT of all 10 Guru's merge into Guru Granth Sahib Jee. I think you should read that passage of his book and keep in mind that he was a pooran brahmgyani.

Lastly, here is a quote from Baba Nand Singh Jee. I am sure you know of him..

"Amrit Bani (Gurbani) was the Guru from the very beginning. Sri Guru Nanak Sahib illuminated the world through Gurbani. The same divine Jot continued the process of illumination through Gurbani in the luminous form of Sri Guru Angad Sahib. Sri Guru Nanak Sahib continued the divine process through Sri Guru Amar Das Ji and so on. Illumination continues unabated through the same Gurbani from Sri Guru Granth Sahib. For Gurmukhs, the eternal illumination is flowing straight from the holy lips of Jot Roop Har Guru Nanak whereas others only perceive a holy book in front. Sri Guru Granth Sahi

b is 'JAAGDI JOT', LIVING SRI GURU NANAK SAHIB"

- Baba Nand Singh Ji Maharaj

You may wish to argue with a Sant such as Baba Nand Singh Ji.

I don't.

[SaadhRayn Kaur]

Veerjee who posted above me,

I feel that ladeevaar suroop is the full and pooran suroop of Guru Granth Sahib jee. I believe this is my living Guru. I believe I can touch and talk to and experience the love and divine grace of my Guru Sahib. I believe I could get parthakh darshan of my Guru Sahib by reading from the gurbani in Guru Granth Sahib.

Therefore I fully agree with you.

I just want to clarify that Guru Granth Sahib CAN ALSO SHINE in other places, in other ways.

Could you TOUCH the baanee that was coming from God down through Guru Nanak Dev Jee?

Can you TOUCH the naam simran that was vibrating within Guru Gobind Singh jee as he gave khande-ke-pahul to the Punj Pyare?

These are abstract things but Guru can make them real.

Touch is not the only necessity to make something real.

FEEL and touch are two different things.

When you FEEL guru while reading gurbani, on the computer, on the PDA, or whatever else, then forget about anything else - the guru will reach out to you and you will be in touch with guru jee.

bhul chuk maaf karnaa jee

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[Guest noonespecial]

"Could you TOUCH the baanee that was coming from God down through Guru Nanak Dev Jee?"

...Yes. Everytime my unworthy hands touch the ang of Guru Granth Sahib Jee

" Can you TOUCH the naam simran that was vibrating within Guru Gobind Singh jee as he gave khande-ke-pahul to the Punj Pyare?"

..Yes. Everytime this manmukh does his simran swaas swaas.

:e: