SAY NO TO UNESCO!!

[Harmeet Singh]

Many sikhs are misinformed and have felt elated in myraid ways after hearig the news that Darbar Sahib would be passed to UNESCO and given a world heritage status reducing Darbar Sahib just to another Homenymoon destination and advertising business point. Please WAKE UP khalsa panth. This will pass all the sovreignity and jurisdiction of Akal takht to UNESCO and GOI.

GOI is spreading rumours that this would give following advantages: http://www.tribuneindia.com/2004/20041111/aplus.htm#5

Advantages of heritage status

* The heritage status would increase public awareness about the site and impose primary responsibilities on the government to preserve the property and its

original architecture as per the highest standards of preservation.

Indian Government would preserve the property of Darbar Sahib?

* In case of any regional war, the parties in conflict will be obliged to refrain from attacking Sri Harmandir Sahib.

There is no neeed to impose laws and interfere with Khalsa Panth, If GOI attacks again we will tackle we wont allow UNESCO to conduct any kind of work as it may batter the santicity of Darbar Sahib.

* There would be a shared international commitment to preserve the heritage and legacy.

NO need for that. Guru sahib have taught us Sangat and Pangat for doing all work and Sewa, This is an plot by GOI to make us refrain from our culture and identity and what it means.

* Any new construction will need to be notified. It will have to get the approval of the World Heritage Committee.

We have already seen the GOI co

nstructing AKal takht Sahib and doing it's utmost damage to us.

* The SGPC will have to consult UNESCO while carrying out repair work.

While it is true SGPC is corrupt we need to fight SGPC and get our gurudwaras back rather then passing them to another corrupt agency.

Heritage Status For Sri Darbar Sahib ::Witness84

The Sikhs face a big threat to their sovereignty - the jurisdiction of the Sri Harimandir Sahib and Akal Takht is to be formally conceded over to the jurisdiction of the Indian Government, if this 'behind the scenes stealth' move is allowed to go through.

Without any consultation with the Panth, collusion between the Government of India and some misinformed Sikhs, has resulted in an application for 'heritage status' to UNESCO.

In essence, the Harimandir Sahib should have no formal juridical control by any manmade political institution. Its physical protection and management is the responsibility of the Sikh Panth.

The Akal Takht is the political seat of Sikhs, representing the sovereignty of Guru Panth in the balance of Guru Granth & Guru Panth - it is the 'living' decision making institution of the Sikh Panth. With a Heritage status, the independent sovereignty of Guru Panth will be formally taken away, making one of Sikhi's main institutions defunct. This is why the world's buildings representing seats of sovereignty institutions - like Buckingham Palace or Windsor Palace in UK, the White House, be as they be beautiful buildings, never apply for heritage status as they are 'living' sovereign institutions.

We present the argument below in more detail- the pros and cons for this application in order for a consultation within the global Sikh community. In addition to this website, we are taking this argument into the community.

Witness84 was able to get hands on this 'very secret' document - an event that in itself sent alarm signals. We have studied this document and had lawyer

s in the UK deliberate on the documents.

Witness84 is taking a stand of opposing this application with the most forceful vigour. Our campaign is to make representations to UNESCO and SGPC - we make these letters available below for YOU to join in and make this a common Panthic campaign, which requires urgent action as the application is at an advanced stage.

In addition, we are building a PETITION page by the end of this week.. please show us your support by signing this.

Witness84

http://www.witness84.com/unesco/

Read more at

http://www.sikhlionz.com/saynotounesco.htm

[Guest rsingh]

My brothers and sisters we need to keep up support with Singh's, Singhnees who are keeping up pressure, We cant let this happen. Send your lettters to UNESCO, Print them and leave them at gurdwara.

[amandeep]

With respect to you all - and I have written before on this topic - but this petition is baloney. You are all being swept into internal SGPC politics here. World heritage Status does NOT mean any change in jurisdiction at all - it simply prevents interventions into the fabric of the building or the architectural integrity - THAT IS IT. if anyone - kar seva babas or Indian government, the SGPC or anyone else wants to mess with the fabric of the building then conservators will now be able to lobby UNESCO to provide expertise - that is it.

What is happening is that there is an internal power struggle within the SGPC and you guys are bring swept into it - one faction is raising the spectre of GOI control and 1984 and whipping up sentiment in the west by using this issue as a stick to beat the other side - you guys are getting swept into that.

Had WHS been in place in 1984 - the Sikhs could have easily taken India to task over the damage to the Harimandir and the destruction of the Akal Takht straight to UNESCO. We could have avoided the SGPC from pulling the Akaal Takht down and could have provided expertise in getting the building conserved properly. We could have avoided the bathroom tiles being used inside the Baba Atal Tower, we could have provided world class expertise during the re-guilding effort, we could have stopped the SGPC from pulling down the last of the ancient Bungas around the Harimandir etc etc - that is the value and importance of the WHS - it gives conservators more of a level playing field and nothign else.

Aman

[Guest rsingh]

you have your points, but still avoid the key issues, Darbar sahib will legally be the ownership of GOI, theres so many points, have you read the argument presented on wittness84?

[amandeep]

Hello

and thanks for your message. I re-read the UNESCO page on the witnss84 site in case it had substantially changed since the last time - it hasnt and I do still retain my points.

The last paragrpahs are really interesting becuase it is here that there is some common ground. The site asks:

Why the community has not been consulted

questions the SGPCs authority over the Harimandir ands ability to speak for Sikhs globally

questions the SGPC jurisdiction

why the SGPC have not responded to your valid questions

Now, here I think that we can both agree that teh SGPC do not consult, do act as if they own the place and are incompetent in many matters o administration. However, this does not mean that there is a deep seated consipracy to "hand over the Harimandir Sahib complex" to UNESCo or the GOI - it just means that the SGPC are incompetent and vastly over inflated.

The reason that I trust the the WHS application is that it has been lead by world class conservators who care deeply about the damage that had been done to the various buildings over the years. The SGPC and indeed the state and central govt need to be "on side" to make the application simply becuase they will be held to task if there is any threat to the fabric of the building or the architectural integrity . Nothing else changes at all - nothing - everything stays the same until such a time as someone tries to damage the building with unsympathetic conservation or even tries to erect neon signs (as they have at the moment in adjoining hoitels). It also stops the corrupt city officials from allowing buildings encroaching onto the site or further whitewashing of the Bab Atal etc etc

Have a look at t

eh myriad of sites that have WHS (on the UNESCO website) its quite clear that these have not ceded any kind of control in their functioning - its just offers a level of protection to the fabric of the buildings.

aman

[Guest rsingh]

‘Sikh sangat not consulted’

“In consistency with UNESCO's own guidelines and its subsequent letter, my concerns are that the Sikh community has not been consulted widely enough nor have the benefits and the implication of the heritage status to Sri Harimandir Sahib been put across to Sikh masses," alleges Dr Jasdev Singh Rai , international advisor to Jathedar.

"We cannot allow a few Sikhs to decide on important matters. The SGPC (Search) is a regional organisation and only a small part of the Panth, and is not THE PANTH by any stretch of the imagination. The dossier has important and misleading statements, such as - the SGPC is the highest religious body among the Sikhs and its decisions are considered final by all Sikhs. The SGPC cannot, under any circumstances, supercede Sri Akal Takht (Search) Sahib," Dr Rai adds.

http://news.waheguroo.com/?633Q6-17274-696...9443-Q3136-3736

Keep up the presure people!

answer 1 thing, who has the highest authority on sikh matters. :T:

I do Ardass Guruji keep Dr ji in cardi kaalaa :e:

[Guest stopsingh2]

This is being blown out of proportion. Where was Dr and co when all the historical Sikh shrines were being destroyed by cladding them in cheap nasty white marble by kar seva wale.

What did Dr Ji and co do to prevent the Brummies from using cheap nasty destructuve methods when they did the re-guilding of the Darbar Sahib or has he done anything to appraise the Akal Takht of the destructive nature of the work that was done ?

Now we have a chance to put into place measures to preserve the heritage of the Darbar Sahib, people with narrow minds and pathetic conspiracy theories are creeping up everywhere. If anything WHS have afforded protection which has helped preserve the charachter and heritage of WHS which is in sharp contrast to what has been happening to Sikh Gurdwara in Punjab and other states.

[amandeep]

THank you stopsingh2, I hope that others can see the folly of this petition.

Actually Dr Rais latest press release betrays the petty politics that are at the heart of this deception. THe main thread of his argument is that the SGPC is not representative of all SIkhs and therefore shouldnt decide unilaterally on Sikh matters and secondly that the SGPC isnt the highest authority on Sikh matters. This is the heart of his problem - the SGPC and its powerful political position. Unfoirtunately he is using this issue (WHS) as a stick to beat the SGPC and at the same time whipping up sentiment in the UK and the US to dmamage what is an otherwise extremely positive step forward.

I personally dislike the way the swagger of the SGPC and most of the things that they do but in this case they are unwittingly supporting a change that will stop them doing further damage to the buildings that they control.

Aman

[Guest rsingh]

we ask where was Dr but where were we, where were our parent, where were our brothers and sisters.

Dr Rai has been running Sikh Human Rights Groups for the past 20 years, he has done emense seva. lets concentrate on 1thing for a minute. I think we can all agree that Akal Takath is the highest seat, therefore shoulsnt it say, Akal Takath is the highest seat and Akal Takath owns the premisis.

Lets face it SGPC is an organisation which is ment to manage Gurudwaras, but instead today hands out also to get elected and belive there are the "top dog". when was SGPC during the Gora era, but today the SGPC is seen as a waste of space by sikhs living out side Panjab. They do no parchar, have no control, dont react to events concerning sikhs in the world, may it be france or anything else.

[Guest stopsingh2]

we ask where was Dr but where were we, where were our parent, where were our brothers and sisters.

Dr Rai has been running Sikh Human Rights Groups for the past 20 years, he has done emense seva. lets concentrate on 1thing for a minute. I think we can all agree that Akal Takath is the highest seat, therefore shoulsnt it say, Akal Takath is the highest seat and Akal Takath owns the premisis.

Lets face it SGPC is an organisation which is ment to manage Gurudwaras, but instead today hands out also to get elected and belive there are the "top dog". when was SGPC during the Gora era, but today the SGPC is seen as a waste of space by sikhs living out side Panjab. They do no parchar, have no control, dont react to events concerning sikhs in the world, may it be france or anything else.

So whats that got to do with the WHS application. If anything your arguments further cement the need for WHS as this will stop illiterate kar sewa wale and the bumpkins at the sGPC further destroying our heritage.

Not me making the fuss over the WHS application. It is Dr Ji. Begs the question whether some people have a vested interest in allowing kar sewa wale to continue in their destruction of our heritage.