Khaalis

The Panth owes an eternal gratitude to both the Udasin Sampryada - which was responsible for replenshing the Singhs during the nightmarish early 18th C. It was the non Singh identity and harmless Sadhu garb/life that allowed Udasin Sadhus to freely roam the Desh, do Gurmat Parchar using their expertise of Indic religions - thus converting hundreds of thousands of Hindus into fearless Singhs who rushed to join and replenish the diminishing ranks. When Sikhniyan said to Mir Mannu 'the more you cut, the more we'll grow'. take a moment to spare a thought - how did we grow... all is Vahegurus apaar kirpa - Baba Sri Chand stands tall as a Sikh personality - and was respected by Guru Sahiban - his mission still produced great Sikh vidvaans today - from whom we can learn many secrets contained within Aad Guru Maharaj. The constant neophyte propoganda on this forum is very sad to see - what a sad state of affairs, still good to see that not all is lost.

"Rag Asa is under the first pehar of the day from 3am to 6am" Sikhs don't follow time lines for performance of kirtan. This concept has only been introduced in recent times. Goindval Pothis were constructed with time line concept i.e. raags were sectioned into the Pehars, but Guru Arjun dev Ji completely did away with that in Aad Granth. The oldet kirtan traditions i.e. rababis, don't follow time line concept either - its part of the evolving Indian Musical Science - Gurus did away with these impractical measures. Ones expression of Bani in any mood is not time bound - to say so is durmat.

Whats dates are BabajJi doing kathaa at Nanaksar Ishar Darbar?

Bhenji, Would you be able to get Bhai Amrik Singhs contact details and also let me know how they are in the UK for, it would be hugely appreciated. Its a shame the kirtan is on so early, its unrealistc for anyone who works and who has children to get to the Gurdwara by 6pm... Thanks.

Its simple to get rid of the doubts, as per Gurdwarai routine, the Sikh Channel simply needs to provide a statement of monthly income and costs, that simple. And they need to do this on a montly basis, if people are going to donate funds on a monthly basis, they have every right to know how there money is being spent -Sikh Channel needs to learn about accountability. They should put their charity number and above statement on air for one day and guaranteed, all the hours of asking for money with 3HO inspired simran will rapidly come to an end. If there are any Sikh Channel sevadaars here, could you kindly ask the channel if they will consider the above suggestion. If not, then they need to learn to live with the doubts, conspiricies and constant lack of funding, and sadly - the inevitable consequence of their actions (or lack of). I really hope they take a more transparent approach as some of my veers have suggested, it really is a prerequisite and will ensure they have a long future, paving the way ahead for many other Sikh channels....

Lol, this is the stuff 'Sikh Sangat Legend' is made of! How sad and reflective of the holes in everyones lives - that they need to talk about this sort of irrelevant nonsense to 'feel complete'. Be concerned with yourself, not others. Other than that - there is an underlying AKJ agenda being driven here - there is no evidence at all to support Bibiyan wore Dastaaran in the 18th C, in fact paintings from that period tell a different story. Dastaar was onl;y worn by Bibiyan da jujaari fauj, which was very rare - we have examples like Mata Bhago - who were the exception and not the rule - (which is why only she fought witht eh 40 muktay and not the wives of the 40 Muktay - who shamed their Singhs to return to the battlefield. Women in Dal Panth were usually widows - who joined the Dal to do seva - and even fight - and for safety and battlefield psychology reasons would have dressed exactly like her Khalsa brethren (so not be distinuished and identified as a lady in war). Most other women would not have been much different to look at than their Punjabi counterparts. The colour dark blue is a battlefield colour worn by Singhs - always by Nihang singhs because they are instructed to remain tyar bar tyar. it serves the purpose of hiding blood if a singh is wounded, as well as providing cover (camouflage) at night etc. Panthic or puratan Sampyradic rehits do not require grihisht Bibiyan to wear dastaars - this was a new innovation started by the likes of the notorious Bhasauria and those he influenced (reformers). That does not mean to say there is anything wrong with Bibiyan wearing dastaaran, its a personal choice - that should be remembered.

Thes neophyte trend of reconciling Aad Sri Guru Granth Sahib with sansaari subjects like Physiscs and even Jurisprudence (as some like to believe the Guru is a book of exoteric laws), is the height of Kalyug - people totaly bypass the greatness of the 'Atmik Marg' and keep trying to make Guru 'useful' through creating what are not acually very imaginitive theories trying to reconcile Nirgun/Sargun parm-atma with flipping particle behaviour - what a distraction from the true aarth if ever there was one!

Humire, That would entail having the word 'civilised' in ones vocabulary - this seems to be an alien concept for many of todays 'World Sikh Rehit Policeforce' youth (based in the UK, and only take on selective assignments, namely ganging up on old people). Its irrelevant if the old man had done something wrong - if he had, then he should have been exposed in front of the sangat - the shame of that would have been enough of a punishment - the sangat themselves would have taken action i.e. kicked him out of office. If not, then a national pressure campaign could have been launched...

May Vaheguru bless him on his journey onwards - his contribution to Sikh Academia was massive - and over teh last 40 years - he opened debate on all areas of Sikh History - as opposed to the spoon-fed Singh sabiya reformist domination that had withstood to that point. His preservation of works such as the Chaupai Singh rehitnama which was burned in teh Sikh reference library in 1984 is invaluable - he spent a very long time wrtiting it out word for word in beautiful handwriting. His translation of many rehits and other works into english is also invaluable - and is food for thought for the rest of the Sikh Academia, who up to that point, didn't even think of sharing the knowledge of thse works with sikh Audiences world over. He was a historian - of the western scientific method - and an Atheist to boot, so had no interest other than factual research. No one is asking to take his opinions literally, but simply put them in the cnotext of his technique and beliefs - there is much that all can benefit from Mcleod, his opinions on history and divinity withstanding. His loss is a sad one - but his contribution is immense and will not be forgotten - in fact it paved the way for real research and study into this area - be it for the purpose of rebuttal. Here is a small tribute: A Gentleman and A Scholar by JAGPAL SINGH TIWANA Dr. W.Hew McLeod is my favorite author on Sikh history. In fact, he is primarily responsible for my interest in the subject. Before reading him, my knowledge of Sikh history was only what I had learned from my dharmic ( religious) teacher at B.N. Khalsa High School, Patiala, or what I heard at home and in the gurdwaras. His books provoked me to read more on the subject. In the early seventies, I read his name for the first time in Choice magazine, as the author of Guru Nanak and Sikh Religion. Choice is an organ of the American Library Association. It reviews books for academic libraries. Libraries select any book recommended by Choice with no hesitation. Thus, his book came highly recommended. I ordered one copy for our college library, and one copy for my personal use. It is indeed a scholarly work. The best part concentrated upon the teachings of Guru Nanak. Guru Nanak Dev University had it translated into Punjabi and published it as Guru Nanak da Updesh. Then, in 1976, came McLeod's second book, The Evolution of the Sikh Community. Overall, I enjoyed the book, but could not easily digest some of the new ideas it presented. McLeod puts a question mark on traditional concepts which are not supported by documents. He does not reject them, but only says they need more research. However, a mind nurtured on centuries-old traditions cannot easily accept a question mark. Even now, it takes me a week or so to appreciate his ideas which question the traditional approach after churning over them many times. I wrote a review of The Evolution of the Sikh Community which was published in The Canadian India Times in 1978. When I read that review now, it looks so childish and simplistic. We invited McLeod to Halifax in 1992 as a guest of the Maritime Sikh Society. He delivered a public lecture, "The Sikh Struggle in the Eighteenth Century and its Relevance Today", at the International Centre, Saint Mary's University and he gave a talk in our Gurdwara on "Sikhs in New Zealand". He then attended a reception in his honor at a restaurant that evening. Everybody was deeply impressed by his friendly, unassuming and modest nature. If he is brilliant as a scholar, he is equally decent as a human being with no ill-will or animosity towards his critics. Within a few weeks after he left Halifax, Dr. Pashaura Singh's thesis came out. A flood of criticism rose against McLeod from a section of Sikh writers, since he was the supervisor. I must admit I developed some doubts about McLeod's research motives. I, myself, started believing that he was indeed a Christian missionary who wanted to hurt the Sikh faith, and had ulterior motives. In 1994, I visited India to attend the wedding of my nephew. I took this opportunity to talk to the following Sikh scholars on McLeod's approach: 1 Prof. Pritam Singh, former head of Dept. of Punjabi, Mahendra College, Patiala; 2 Prof. Harbans Singh, Editor, Encylopedia of Sikhism; 3 Dr. J.S. Grewal, former Vice Chancellor, Guru Nanak University and former Director of the Indian Institute of Advanced Studies; and 4 Principal Sant Singh Sekhon. All of them said, without hesitation, that McLeod is an honest scholar. He has absolutely no motive to malign Sikhs. This was also the view of S. Khushwant Singh when I met him in February 2003. I was also advised to check the qualifications of people who were criticizing McLeod. There are always some good and some bad points in the works of every scholar. Those who focus merely on the negatives are biased and less than honest. Prof. Pritam Singh was my main source. He told me that when McLeod was working on his doctorate on Guru Nanak, he came several times to interview his next-door neighbor, the celebrated historian, Dr. Ganda Singh, and also interviewed him (Pritam Singh). Dr. Ganda Singh found McLeod absolutely sincere and earnest. Pritam Singh said that as long as Ganda Singh was alive, his critics did not have the courage to attack McLeod. Ganda Singh stood too tall and well-respected in the profession. He wrote an article in defense of McLeod in a journal, The Punjab, Past and Present, which he edited. It was a befitting reply to some critics of McLeod. Who knows better how to read, research and write history than Ganda Singh? Harbans Singh has included several well-researched articles of McLeod in Encyclopedia of Sikhism. A scholar who comes recommended by such fine minds as Ganda Singh, Harbans Singh, Khushwant Singh and J. S. Grewal has to be accepted and respected. I made my decision. I recall that I had my first lesson in history from my history Professor, S. Kartar Singh Shergill. I once mentioned to him that Nehru says so-and-so about the Moghul Emperor Babur in his book, Discovery of India. He shot back at me, " Nehru is not a historian. Read Panikar or Majumdar!" He said that, like any discipline, history, too, is a specialized field. A historian is properly trained to conduct research. Historians take pride in their qualifications. If a historian cannot write with authority on physiology, botany, or geography, the same is true in the field of history for others. Now, whenever I am asked to read a book on Sikh history by a critic of McLeod, I always check the qualifications of the author and compare his standing in the profession with Ganda Singh and others mentioned above. I then form my view accordingly. I also check the publisher of his books, if he has written any. Such famous publishing houses as Oxford, Princeton and Cambridge Universities have published the works of McLeod, Khushwant Singh and J. S. Grewal. Do I accept wholeheartedly everything McLeod writes? Certainly not, especially in the area of Sikh scriptures. He lacks proper qualifications here. If his interpretation of Gurbani clashes with that of Sahib Singh or Jodh Singh, for example, I, of course, readily prefer the views of the Sikh scholars who are the real experts in the field. As I mentioned earlier, McLeod has been accused of being a Christian missionary who came to Punjab to destroy Sikhism in order to promote Christianity in its place. No one ever cared to find out what kind of missionary work he actually did, though his critics claim to be better informed. When this kind of character assassination was in full swing in the early nineties, Dr. I. J. Singh of New York asked McLeod to clarify his position. This he did in an article in the Sikh Review. McLeod did come to Punjab as missionary of a church in New Zealand, but soon his interest in religion started to wane. As a trained historian, he found the history of Sikhs very fascinating. He taught Punjab history at Baring College, Batala, spent his extra time learning the Punjabi language, and then did his Ph.D. on Guru Nanak from the University of London. He left the college, and lost all interest and contact with the Church. After this explanation, some responsible critics stopped repeating the missionary charge. If McLeod had any motive for destroying Sikhism, he would have readily accepted that Guru Nanak was the chela (disciple) of Kabir as given in some of the works by Western writers. He not only rejects this view, but rather doubts whether Kabir and Guru Nanak had ever met. He does not believe that Guru Gobind Singh ever worshipped goddess Durga, and doubts if the Chandi Charitr, a questionable section of Dasam Granth, is the composition of Guru Gobind Singh. His book, Sikhism (1997), is full of complimentary passages on Sikhs. Lately, McLeod is getting acceptance from his open-minded detractors. His support as an expert in the court cases on turban and kirpan issues in Canada won him appreciation from many, especially the World Sikh Organization (Canada). His book, Textual Sources for the Study of Sikhism, has won him laurels from all directions. He has admirers amongst Kiwi Sikhs for tracing their New Zealander roots in his books. A while ago, when some friends started bashing McLeod on the Sikh Diaspora forum (with which I'm involved), Navtej Singh Randhawa from New Zealand came swinging in his defence. He wrote: "I am a fourth-generation Sikh-New-Zealander and I can assure you that if it wasn't for Dr W.H. McLeod's rather legendary research work on our Sikh community here in New Zealand , I would have never known about our early Sikh and Punjabi heritage in this country. Some of the historical facts are so fascinating that we are just startled by the details. Now I can very easily refer to some concrete data and collections from his books, Punjabis in New Zealand and Sikh Migration to New Zealand. My grandfather and great-grandfather worked with him on these projects. My grandfather tells me that if it wasn't for this scholar, we would have lost a very valuable piece of history from our heritage." The new generation of Sikh scholars hold McLeod in high esteem. He is the most quoted author on Sikhism today. After Ganda Singh, he is indeed the Baba Bohar (the mighty Banyan Tree) of Sikh history. Book List: Books by W. H. McLeod as at 17 May 2008 Guru Nanak and the Sikh Religion. Oxford: the Clarendon Press (1968). First Indian ed., rev. Delhi: OUP (1976). Third impression 1988. Oxford India Paperbacks 1996, 1998. Guru Nanak de udesh. Punjabi translation of Part V of Guru Nanak and the Sikh Religion. Amritsar: Guru Nanak Dev University (1974).* The Evolution of the Sikh Community. Delhi: OUP (1975). Oxford: the Clarendon Press (1976). viii, 119p. Oxford India Paperbacks 1996, 1998. Henry Steinbach, The Punjaub (1st ed. London, 1846) 2nd edition, with introduction by W. H. McLeod. Karachi: Oxford University Press (Oxford in Asia Historical Reprints) (1976). * Early Sikh Tradition. A study of the janam sakhis. Oxford: the Clarendon Press (1980). The B40 Janam sakhi. An English translation with introduction and annotations of the India Office Library Gurmukhi manuscript Panj. B40, a janam sakhi of Guru Nanak compiled in A.D. 1733 by Daya Ram Abrol. Amritsar: Guru Nanak Dev University (1980). Textual Sources for the Study of Sikhism. Manchester: Manchester University Press (1984).* Chicago: University of Chicago Press (1990). Chicago edition still in print. Punjabis in New Zealand: A history of Punjabi migration, 1890 1940. Amritsar: Guru Nanak Dev University (1986). Order from Singh Brothers, S.C.O. 98, City Centre, Amritsar 143001. The Chaupa Singh Rahit nama. The rahit nama attributed to Chaupa Singh Chhibbar and the associated prose rahit nama attributed to Nand Lal. Gurmukhi text and English translation with introduction and notes. Dunedin: University of Otago Press (1987). * The Sikhs: history, religion, and society. New York: Columbia University Press (1989). Who is a Sikh? The problem of Sikh identity. Oxford: the Clarendon Press (1989). New Delhi: OUP (1989). Popular Sikh Art. A selection of bazaar posters with accompanying text. Delhi: OUP (1991). Illustrated. * Punjab to Aotearoa: migration and settlement of Punjabis in New Zealand 1890-1990. With S. S. Bhullar. Hamilton: New Zealand Indian Association Country Section (Inc.) (1992). Illustrated. Historical Dictionary of Sikhism. Lanham, Md., and London: Scarecrow Press (1995). South Asian edition New Delhi :Oxford University Press (2002). Second edition revised and enlarged published by the Scarecrow Press, 2005. Sikhism. London: Penguin Books (1997). Available only in India. Gandhi and Indian Independence. With Richard Webb. Auckland: Macmillans (1998). Sikhs and Sikhism. One volume containing reprints of Guru Nanak and the Sikh Religion, Early Sikh Tradition, The Evolution of the Sikh Community, and Who is a Sikh?, all originally published by the Clarendon Press, Oxford, and also by the Oxford University Press, New Delhi. New Delhi: Oxford University Press (1999). 259+317+127+140p. Exploring Sikhism: aspects of Sikh identity, culture, and thought. Collected articles. New Delhi: Oxford University Press (2000). 288p. Sikhs of the Khalsa: a history of the Khalsa Rahit. New Delhi: Oxford University Press, 2003. 482p. Discovering the Sikhs: autobiography of a historian. Delhi: Permanent Black (2004). xii, 245p. Prem Sumarag: the testimony of a Sanatan Sikh. Translation of an eighteenth-century rahit-nama with introduction. New Delhi: Oxford University Press (2006). 129p. Essays in Sikh History, Tradition, and Society. New Delhi: Oxford University Press (2007). xi, 291p. 1.2. Booklets The Sikhs of the Punjab. A text for use in secondary schools. First N.Z. edition published by Graphic Educational Publications, Auckland (1968). Second N.Z. edition by Whitcombe & Tombs, Auckland (1970). Indian edition by Lyall, Ludhiana (1969). U.K. edition by Oriel Press, Newcastle on Tyne (1970). * The Way of the Sikh. For children 10 12 years. Amersham, U.K.: Hulton Educational Publications (1975 and four reprints). * A List of Punjabi Immigrants in New Zealand 1890 1939. Hamilton, Country Section of the Central Indian Association (1984). Illustrated. * Most of these books are still in print. Those marked with an asterisk are out of print.

Bhenji, the underlying principle is this - Guru Ji travels outside to do parchaar i.e. at a smagam, but when one seeks Gurus blessings - then as part of the process/act of humility/subservience, one goes with nimrata and appears before Gurus charan, in his Dargah, to seek blessing... In the old days, people did not expect Guru Ji to travel to them, when it was their wedding, they went to Guru Ji to be married by them, be married in their presence and and be blessed by them, in their Darbaar.... I hope you will understand. May be you could organise a seperate parchaarik occassion in the beautiful wild surroundings you have mentioned one day i.e. an akhand paath, kathaa, kirtan and dhadi darbaar... that would be great as an event - and one which was nish-kaam. I pray it all goes well.

Great posts Jassa Singh, thanks for sharing. What many people don't realise here is that Guru Sahiban used extant vidya in all aspects of Sikhi be it Simran, Kirtan, Santhiya, Yudh Vidya what have you. If one wants to learn about the Raj Niti and Battle stratagem - one needs to speak to Nihangs who have retained an oral tradition over hundreds of years and can put the Panth Prakash/Suraj Prakash into context. There is nothing wrong with the fact that Gurus used existing knowlegde - in fact, in all spheres, we can see the Gurus purified, repackaged, and presented it in its original form (after centuries of corruption). What the Gurus gave us was already Aad Sach - but it had been forgotton. The Guru Granth Sahib is contructed around a raag framework - Gurbani and Bhagat-bani have been placed under each modal sentiment in order of honor. Raag formed the basis of the compilation due to 'Kirtan being Pardana in Kalyug' and being the chosen tool for disseminating the divine wisdom - through a science which had already existed for over 2,000 years. Now how does one learn about raag - through genuine oral tradition or through studying the Sangeet Granths i.e. Sangeet Ratnakar. Raag is an ancient science of devotional music in India, as are the aspects of war which Jassa Singh has spoken of. The Gurus purpose was not to invent new sciences - but to spread the message of esoteric practice - i.e. realising the atma. People today treat Aad Guru as a book of law, a book of science, a book of numerology and a whole host of other things. Aad Guru is not any of these things, it is higher than them all, it is the timeless essence that gives birth to all these wordly things. Re the silly and offensive understanding of Krishna in the Kharag Singh kathaa - look up what the word allegorical means. Guru Gobind Singh was a master of the art of poetry, youth today, struggle to speak even one language correctly, let alone studying linguistic and artistic sciences.

"Bina Abhihas Shastar Bhik Maano" Exactly.

You can thnk SGPC/Singh Sabha for getting rid of all the Baags that once surrounded all teh Guru Ghar. Baba Balbir Singh Ji as I saisa perfect role model - the Gurdwara they do seva at in Sultanpur Lodhi is totally self sufficient, they have the most beautiful Jal to drink and all langar is sourced from their own 100% organic farm (on the Gurdwara ground), so the sangat eat whatever is in season. Organic food and milk and beautidul green surroundings (to do do vichaar, simran and kirtan in) are a must for all Guru Ghar.

Dude, we talk or we act - people like Bhagat Puran Singh Ji and Baba Balbir Singh Ji acted on environmental issues - these are the sort of people we should support - esp financially. The best of raising environmental awareness amongst sikhs is for them to get involved. Awareness alone means nothing, many people have 'Internet Awareness' but do nothing except moan. Those who really don't speak, they act.

http://www.time.com/time/specials/packages...1841808,00.html http://www.nirmalkuteya.com/ Sikhs do have a hero! I have met Nirmala Baba Balbir Singh Ji - they are absolutely awesome - pure Nishkaam Sevadaar. They have many green projects going on in Punjab - if you go to India - visit the Gurdwara in Sultanpur Lodhi which is on the banks of the very river that Guru Nanak Dev Ji disappeared in when they entered Akaal Purkhs Darbaar.

I'm not slandering anything, I simply stated my opinion on the music (as you had done) and showed a better/extant alternative - to learn about the same issues, as well as older ithihaas - a tradition defined, perfected and given to us for this very purpose by the 6th Master. The Gurus didn't use second rate music or instruments - they used the best that was available i.e. Shaastri/Haveli Sangeet in Dhrupadi style alongside true and relavant folk traditions, they also invented or redesigned the Saaj that they used - which were perfect for the deliverance of Vira Rasa and Shant Rasa. For you to prophesize what they would do if they were here today is pure egocentric hogwash. For you to taint the nucleus of Gurbani - kirtan, in the style that the Gurus themselves sang in, amounts to blasphemy. Are all other Sikh traditions stuck in a time warp too.... should we neglect the many rehits, the dress code and even Gurmukhi... Your comment about youth finding traditonal Sikh Music boring is a lie - the resurgence amongst 'educated' youth is strong and growing everyday - their are Gurmat Sangeet academies in the US, CA and UK, as well as many in India - youth have access to resources and education - and are discovering how do-gooders have/are degenerating our beautiful traditions. The Dhadi tradition is also slowly growing with UK youth starting to learn the puratan parsangs and vaaran.... Good luck to you and Dya Singh of Australia generation.

What a noise... Here, for anyone who wants the real deal, modern day hip-hop/jungle/pop/bhangra mixed music will always sound 2nd rate next to the 6th Masters - Sri Guru Hargobind Sahibs own introduced/gifted tradition - Dhan Dhan Sache Patshah - Shakti aur Bhagti de Malik : http://www.dhadikavishr.com/index.php PS no need to start a hot debate, I am only stating my opinion and promoting a real Sikh tradition - we are already seeing a massive resurgence in Gurmat Sangeet - and the decline of Filmi Kirtan, we now need to apply the same effort to promote Dhadi Parampara in its pure form again - rather than polluting/fusing it with this disco music. This is exactly how many beautiful folk traditions got lost in the embarresment of the newly invented musical genre known as bhangra. Those who like this music, fair enough, your choice - I am simply posting this for those that are more interesting in learning about, listening to and promoting our Gurus Rvaaj. Cheers.

"Can you provide a link to this jee" You need to buy the book, not everything is on the net. You should be able to get a translation from DTF on Soho Rd.

...

Kam, do you have contact details for Giani Takur Singh Ji whilst they are in the UK?

It used to be a public view account, but was changed to private a few years ago. Unless you know the guy, you can't get access. Not to worry, there is plenty of good kathaa on Suraj Prakash on the net. Just do a quick search.

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Spec******Singh, Blackpool, don't listen to the other people, they are leading you astray.... This is a recession!

"Some1 should go and give them a slap and get the sikh relics back into sikh hands. Any idea Where they live?" What a typical Sikh Sangat sentance! Lol, **click** (snapping my finger), look into my eyes... when I say 'Akaal' you will awake, and will no longer live in a fairytale land, where you think conquering nations do not and have not always helped themselves to the treasures of the defeated foe... yes, even the Sikhs took booty from their enemiies in order to fund the Khalsa armies and supplies there in.. I for one am glad that many of the Sikh relics came into the hands of the British, at least they have looked after them and preserved them for our and future generations. The state of the majority of relics (and the security surrounding them) in Punjab is beyond a joke. we caouldn't even preserve our architecture (our biggest relic) let alone anything else. Numerous birs and ithihaasik granths are diminishing or have been stolen, old saaj have virtually be neglected to extinction (just 1 or 2 sorry examples left), many shastar have been replaced with equivalents i.e. the tiny kataari that supposedly belonged to the physically huge 6th Master... etc etc. The Sikh exhibition at V&A a few years ago was amazing - the condition of the relics was immaculate - making them a pleasure to behold - and them having the ability to transport us back in time due to their immaculate state. Lets educate the keepers of Punjab 1st and change the 'perishables' mentality, set up secure, temp controlled, modern evironments for 'real' relics - then lets approach those that have preserved our ithihaasik relics, in an intelligent manner in order to persuade them to return them to us - or purchase them back.

Original Poster needs to go to the Gurdwara and beg the Gyani and Commitee for forgiveness - as he has commited serious Nindiya. Then he should do the Joreh Di Seva for the Ramgharia Gurdwara Sangat, starting with those whose name he has attempted to tarnish. People are so flipping obsessed with trying to act as Rehit Police that their eyes and ears seem to stop functioning. Do some abhyaas to correct your temporary sensory disability - as well as to work off your ill thought actions.