buddasingh

There is no easy answer. However, as difficult as it may be, generally where someone is captured, incapacitated, wounded, unarmed, and harmless, they should put to trial. Otherwise, everyone has their own justification to kill and hurt everyone. Our complex emotions separate us from animals. Our ability think through those emotions should also separate us from animals. Mod Note: Above reply sums up pretty good about this thread and serves well as the closing statement of this thread.

Kally you need to let it go and move on. Let go of the cover up, let go of the denial, let go of the ignorance. Let go of celebrating criminality. Let go of supporting promotions to mass murderers and rapists. You are stuck. Let go of your hatred, why do you hold a grudge? It’s not nice….love and peace….love and peace. The fact that this forum and these people are willing to entertain debate with what is in essence your entrenched support of getting away with mass murder and rape is testimony to the fact that Sikhs are at peace. However for Sikhs being at peace does not equate to inaction. It equates to calmly seeking justice for the entire world, that requires self-respect and seeking justice for oneself as well. You refuse to address what is brought to your attention. Your professed point of view is supporting mass murder and rape. You have the rare achievement of being so indecent that your view is disgusting and it qualifies as debate because others are tolerant of even you. But please carry on, try to weave your spells, so we can continue to educate young Sikhs and others using you as a textbook example of why we always need to educate society and help those like you let go of their disgusting hatred. When you are ready to let go and forgive yourself, we'll still be here for you. ....love and peace.

Ask her permission, with some pressure if necessary, to tell one of her other caring female friends about what she's going through. This is preferably a friend who lives closer to her, but if it's a good friend farther away, fine as long as they can communicate. She is vulnerable, unless you are gay or 85, this is generally not the time for a male friend to console her...don't you watch movies? Also she needs to talk to another woman to get to the point of talking about the stupidity of men, or at least that man.

Nice to meet you "BBC Audience Services". Opinion so strong that the corporate system has the "no one" to sign it. Corporate Cowardice! Sikhs learn to fight this new corporate "no one" as a service to humanity. Who needs to plunder and pillage and lie to the masses on the streets when you can do it in a/c comfort, via peons, anonymously as shareholders, ceos etc under a nice logo from the comfort of your boardrooms.

On the issue of tying Sikhi into things, I don't know why 95% of people who might carry a Sikh banner do so. Sikhi is not a birthright. It is not a caste. If you associate with Sikhi, make it part of your inner and outer form and protect it and serve others according to it. Don't employ it for your own agenda. Do you consider yourself born a Sikh? No such thing. What makes you Sikh? A general belief, bias or cultural preferences make you punjabi but not Sikh.

Wrong or right, natural or unnatural or whatever various arguments or points of view might be; the fact is that gays are discriminated against and oppressed and hated as human beings. Even if one is to disagree with that one aspect of their identity, the hate is not warranted. The discrimination is not warranted. Dehumanizing them is not warranted. We should be prepared to protect all human beings against such hate and discrimination. Only then do we have the right to agree or disagree with them.

paneer monster you're absolutely correct in your analogy of the joke as well as your analysis of how we can be sitting ducks to a 'approving' a racist society. Of course we should understand that they will say they were making fun of the original racist. But using another racist slur as a mocking correction is the height of stupidity and regardless of the shows intentions, it promotes racism.

HOUSTON we have a problem! With the exception of a few brave warriors here who understand, it is alarming what the majority of young Sikh males think about this incident! I just finished speaking in another thread how every Sikh should be ready to fight physically. I have been in my share of street fights and numerous near fights…in so many cases; standing my ground fearlessly and CALMLY, dispelled the situation. I have a healthy itching urge to see if my martial arts play is still relevant; but I know not to act on that urge for my ego. This example is sad! The response here as “sikhs” is sadder! Were we all raised by gorillas? Are we village goondas that we can’t recognize true courage? That is not an example of Guru Gobind Singh Ji’s sikhi whatsoever!! Kudos to the poster for at least feeling bad and knowing what he did was sadistic. He’s feeling bad because he was the one in the best position to know he did something wrong. A few things wrong actually. From his description, he seems to be almost out of character, the steroids possibly altered his thinking to increase aggression. Regardless he describes himself as out of control, simply not acceptable. No respectable martial art teaches one to hurt someone beyond what is necessary. If a person is head-stomping someone it should be a life or death situation. Otherwise a person needs to check themselves in to rehab or jail or both. That would in most cases be criminal assault at a minimum. It’s interesting the poster’s title is provocation. Maybe the guilt is also associated with a concern for an active police investigation as the victims could be brain injured or worse. The law does generally make sense in that a response to a provocation should be measured and not over the top. I’ve also been on the receiving end of racism on the street and a Sikh stands up to the racism and in the heat of the moment is prepared to fight. However a saint soldier never dehumanizes an enemy…that is not a Sikh way to fight. The person may be a racist in that moment, but it is a person that needs our assistance, perhaps after getting a beating, ONLY if necessary and to the extent necessary, but still needs our assistance. Even in the requirement to kill as a last resort, there was respect and love in gold-tipped arrows. Contemplate the enemy on the ground and head stomping v. Bhai Khanaiya’s approach. We call ourselves a warrior kaum, yet fail to distinguish goonda testosterone from Sikh courage!

An individual Sikh is the Khalsa Fauj. Fight by setting examples of how to look after the world. Reintroduce courtesy, civility, courage in your society. Start by knowing your power.

Yubacitysingh I would say you’re getting some excellent advice from warriors here. A real fight for justice is the same as the fight for love. As others indicate, amongst the tools are education and practically positioning ones input in the world. Nonetheless, your points that Sikhs need to be lions are valid and need to be acknowledged. It’s hard for me to digest the thought of Sikhs who look after mind and soul, but not body. I've always wished every Sikh would be a competent one man army (sava lakh) and know how to fight in the physical sense; that includes being intelligent and knowing when not to fight; but ALWAYS absolutely fearless…and at the very least look after one’s physical health. The Sikh psyche and expectation should be that both fitness and fearlessness are integral parts of our lives. We have too many sikhs who don’t look after their physical health and on the other hand too many that think that hotheaded fighting without a brain is some type of courage. You’ve got the fundamentals down with an intelligent passion bro. Repeating what others say; knowing what to fight for is the first fight. Sharpen your spirituality and your mind, so your body knows where your fight is.

And to throw more into the mix, i see some of the people in our gurudwaras and i wonder if the beach is a place more worthy of guruji's presence. The progressive sangat on this forum is representative of a very very small percentage of the Sikh community. Not really offering an opinion just food for thought at the irony of the debate when we have thugs and simpletons rampant within india and the diaspora community who are leaders in every aspect of life in sikh society. Our society looks upto them and our entire value system becomes thuggish. There are large segments of 'sikh' communities that are daily frauds. I am not sure if guruji should be removed from so called sangat or the so called sangat should be removed from guruji. Of course neither, but it's a thought to make a point. It's you and I who have let guruji down with our apathy toward sikh society. If we can see the thuggery, then it is our responsibility to throw as much loving activism into the mix as we possibly can. We should come to these forums to share thoughts, but the seva is required on the street. That will go a long ways in sorting out how we collectively show respect for granth and panth.

Something doesn't quite make sense here bro. If it was real why would you be getting professional treatment for paranoia? It is very real to the person who is experiencing it and one must respect that experience. However, a psychologist should not be treating for paranoia if it does not exist. By the way good question by dalsingh101 as to what drug you were put on. A side effect of citalopram is paranoia. Not sure how prevalent it is but this link will shock you but also perhaps give you hope. http://rxstories.com/celexa.html Keep in mind that even if we were qualified we could not give you professional opinions on a forum. So don't try any drastic med changes etc. without professional guidance and support. You may feel better initially only to have something else become much worse. Find out who the best mental health professional/psychiatrist is in your area. Try to establish a rapport with that person. Take it a day at a time...these things can take a bit of trial and error and time to stabilize. Research everything you can. Read up as much as you can. There is simply too much information out there for professionals to have it all at their fingertips, but you can sometimes get to know things pretty well and be educated to assist your psychiatrist assist you. Mental health issues aside... to the extent anyone experiences others laughing or looking at them because of their dastar; in my experience I am walking with superpowers with my dastar. When I am recognized in a positive manner, it's humility; if i'm recognized in a negative manner I still get a charge of positive power and energy. I may do any of ignore, educate, challenge, confront the person. Regardless I am in control of that my world and assume control of that persons world. This is the only way I've known how to wear the dastar from fights in younger years to moving forward and seeing more systemic discrimination and only the odd encounter. I am always the one laughing. I can't tell you exactly what is going on for you and don't have it all figured out myself... but enough to assure you that the dastar of a Sikh worn properly as a Sikh will let you rule the world.

Did the psychiatrist screen for paranoia? Were you feeling others were talking about you, laughing etc? If you experience this again, check with someone you trust who is with you at the time to see if they think that is what is happening. You may consider another psychiatrist or mental health professional and mention these issues specifically. This has nothing to do with how intelligent you are. It is also very real for the person experiencing it. One can be very intelligent, yet have this illness. There is also help to control it. You are making wise use of the forum as a support, but don't let that lead to not getting professional medical help.

Bro, From the description and details in your initial post, it seemed apparent that you have a mental health issue. You then shared that you in fact have a history of mental health issues, which makes it even more likely or obvious. There are many who are simply too week to accept sikhi. They may post something similar, yet different. Your details suggest something else; that you need to get professional help. Think of this help for YOU, regardless of faith. Sikhi, whether you're a part of it or not, would care enough to see you get help. I believe Sikhi at it's core is the most amazing medicine to supplement any issues, but that's me... you may or may not be at the same place at some time, but get help. One's mind and emotions are very complex. You don't require a diagnosis or be on meds to have mental health issues. Your personality may heighten or lessen your mental health issues, but the issues still exist on their own and need attention. You are probably young as well... please see someone soon. A piece of advice on getting support from mental health professionals; when you are doing so, you can be vulnerable. These professionals are like surgeons with a knife and introduced to an open heart surgery in progress. There are many practitioners with limited competency, regardless of status/acheivement. Be careful, get second opinions and research things yourself. Ask questions, establish and feel trust. Avoid those who talk down to you, even with established and 'respected' professionals. Exercise, Meditate, Eat Right. If the Sikhi can empower you, use it.

Some of them are beautiful people in a sad and ignorant state of affairs. They would not go to hell if there was such thing. However, of those that claim sikhi, if they had a glimpse of the glory. love, and sacrifice from which they came, they would feel like they have built their hell on earth.

It’s tough to be young and try to understand relationships in times like this. I would be far more concerned about your fiancee as a problem than I would be about his mother. He was aware of potential challenges the very moment he started on any kind of supposed commitment to you. If he only came to Canada 2 years ago, he is even more keenly aware of complications with respect to a potential relationship, and even more so because of his brothers experience. There are unfortunately scores of loyal women punjabi and non-punjabi who date punjabi men, where the men end up almost casually walking away. I am not saying that is your situation, but it certainly lends itself to reading between the lines. Did his brothers white wife really cheat on him or was it the other way around? I question his maturity. You sound more loyal than what he deserves. I don’t know your personal situation and love is blind as they say…but ensure that you put yourself in a position of strength with self confidence and self respect before you consider whether you actually love him or whether your hurt is blurring things. I hope I am wrong, but afraid I am right in that I doubt he is being up front about this being all about respecting his mother. It’s not you who needs the chance with his mother. It’s he who is being given a chance by you. You are holding that power. Use it wisely. The passage of time will give you some clues. If you are not getting any positive clues within a short time, then take that as a clue that his chance should be up and you should move on to a man who is more deserving of your commitment and maturity. I do not speak about your fiancée necessarily…but as a general comment from my knowledge of the mind of various sikh and punjabi men. A small percentage of Sikh men are amongst the best potential husbands in the world and large percentage of punjabi men may make a decent mate if they mature at about the age of 50.

Seva is not confined to gurudwara. Baba Kanhaiya served humanity on the battlefield. You can do small acts that you feel are physically suitable for you. It can be cleaning your street, assisting one person who needs assistance, contributing ideas and energy for the greater good online etc.

Her comment is offensive because of her purpose. She should know better. Many Guru's Sikhs are progressive in mind and spirit and integrated as global citizens wherever they reside to a greater degree than any other group. It also holds true that large segments of 'sikhs' are racist, sexist, thugs and are not integrated in the 21st century. Who cares what she says, but we should care about what the facts are.

I totally agree that a ready made turban is not for a Sikh. How do we make sure that such nonsense does not infiltrate future generations that may not know better if they grow up with this? We do that by courageously and tactfully being bold about what the debate should be about. The debate should be about trimming being completely absurd and counter to sikhi. The debate should be about the asinine act of wearing a baseball cap while representing sikh brothers and sisters. Tact requires that we separate the act from the people. Many people are misled or never had the opportunity to know better. We seem to be afraid of some kind of osama-effect, hence we don't speak up about proper style, etiquette and respect. A Sikh needs to have the graceful fighting ability to know how to get past obstacles to speak up and stick up for Sikhi. Sikhs need to focus on education and wisdom and speak up against what is ignorant and boorish.

the underlying truth...well said. Racism, Casteism, Sexism is a huge part of punjabi subcultures

Nice to see balanced points of view and attempts to understand…even to the extent of “western high horse”. However, civility is not a western concept. Our guruji’s were the ultimate masters in civility and decorum. Guru Arjan, Guru Tegh Bahadar,…Guru Gobind Singh Ji bowing before the panj piare. These are the most amazing expression of civility, humility, and courage that are arguably unmatched amongst saints and soldiers. Modern punjabi (and Indian) culture is largely uncivilized. Sorry bhangra fans, that is a reality. The west has no claim to civility either and has its own form of pushing and beyond with even barbaric practices with respect to religious and cultural intolerance in the world, in addition to theft and murder. A Sikh is not a product of east or west. A Sikh is a product of her or his Guru’s unmatched expressions of civility, humility, and courage. A Sikh should defy eastern and western cultural norms as necessary. We should expect and encourage that Harminder Sahib be the absolute ideal of civility which Sikhs then spread throughout the world. We’ve gone from from putting our heads on our palms to pushing in crowds! Every Sikh everywhere should show women with children and unsure visitors extreme courtesy. The only pushing we should be doing is that of our own spirit to think and act like saint soldiers.

If I was merely living LIKE a king, I would want to be a Sikh, then I would BE King. So recognize your Sikhi and you'll recognize your KINGDOM. punjabi cultural disclaimer...ok kids "King" does not mean you beat your chest after purchasing some worldly educational designation or having a large pricey eyesore of a chandelier in your home, while those you call friends talk behind your back...King means living the life of a humble and fearless saint-soldier. p.s. you mean "veers and pahans"

Thanks for sharing and giving strength to others. Be aware that there are doctors and lawyers and wealthy, seemingly successful people amongst Sikhs that are insecure and weak with very questionable business practices. Some of them are leaders who we look up to. So don't be regretful. Instead be thankful...and always remember to be honest, kind, brave, and answerable to yourself and waheguroo over your public image.

wow! and well put

go to http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?D=2009-04-15&ID=267677 Have a look at post #20 which mentions -- Maj. Harjit Singh Sajjan and the story below. Maybe someone else here can help you with his contact info given that Sikhs are prominent where he's from. #20 No problem in Canada... Sikh soldier returns By CARY CASTAGNA -- Edmonton Sun Taliban fighters aren't the only ones clad in turbans in Afghanistan. Maj. Harjit Sajjan, who finished a nine-month tour of duty in September and received his Canadian Forces service medal at Rexall Place yesterday, says he never doffed his turban in the Middle East. "I can wear a helmet. I can wear a gas mask. There's nothing that my turban or my beard can prevent me from doing in the military at all," said the 36-year-old Sikh from Vancouver. "To put a helmet on, you have to have an inner liner. My turban acts like an inner liner, so I just wear the kevlar shell over top." Interestingly, these Sikh Soldiers have been wearing gas masks for a while Sikh soldiers using gasmasks while defending Ieper, Belgium in April, 1915.