SikhKosh

Johnny, Muhammad in Gyan Khand? Waheguru

Which Hindu Bhagats Bani is in Guru Granth Sahib? Gurbani is united under one Soch, one Veechar because it is Dhur Ki Bani so it is not contradictory; all Gurus and Bhagats had the same views. Bhagat Kabeer Ji met Guru Nanak Sahib in Magaar (UP), Sultanpur and many other places. The Puratan Goindwal Pothis say 'Kabeer Nama(dev) Bhagat Guru Babe Ke'. Mehervaan Janamsakhi records the incident where several Bhagats (including Bhagat Kabeer Ji and Bhagat Naamdev Ji) were ordered by Akaal Purakh to go and meet Jagat Guru Nanak Sahib. Its not about followers its about the essential practises. You need to go on Hajj and keep Ramadan fast if you are a practising Muslim, right? Gurbani rejects that, so how doesn't it reject Islam?

Not every Muslim is out to give Dawah? Brother, every committed Muslim is out to give Dawah and is at war with Dar Ul Harb (non Islamic world). If a Muslim is peaceful he is not yet acquaint with the content of the Al Quran and the Hadith. Puratan Singhs knew <banned word filter activated> inside out and they were (rightly) high handed in their approach to them, you can look at Baba Banda Singh Bahadur, Akali Phula Singh or Hari Singh Nalwa.

To VanHelSingh, Mehtab Singh and others who do not agree: If it is not so, then please clarify the following: 1) Why are integral parts, rituals of many religions fully condemned in Gurbani? 2) Do you believe all religions lead to God or only some (if so specify)? 3) How do you determine that a religion is genuine (= leads to God) or not? Bhaniarawala has followers, and Gurmeet Ram Raheem has millions of followers, do his followers reach God also through him? If not then the statement that all paths lead to God is wrong.

I am simply stating what the Guru said. Anyone can realise God individually but if you follow the mentioned religions to the letter you won't because you will get struck with Karam Kaands. Now a Sufi can realise Waheguru by chanting Wahid Allah (Ik Oankar in Arabic, as they do in some Arabic countries) but then he is not following Islam to the core. Because Muhammad preached hate, and if you follow in his footsteps, you will get violent. Several sects of Islam that do have some resemblences to Sikhi have deviated from the Quran and the Hadith, but I am talking of the actual religions, who follow their scriptures blindly, not the watered down versions. My brothers and sisters, I am not saying that we have to discriminate against Hindus or Muslims but that their faith is flawed. But others than that, I do not follow any Dehdhari, my faith lies in my Guru and He rejected integral aspects of other religions and I do believe in every single action and word of the Guru whole heartedly.

Maybe slightly off topic but Puratan Singhs used to lift weights, wrestle and often engaged in mock fights. This is confirmed by Kavi Santokh Singh in Gurpartap Suraj Granth and also Rattan Singh Bhangu in Panth Parkash. Even before the Sixth Patshah, Guru Angad Dev Ji established several Mal Akharas (wrestling arena's) for Sikhs. We need to get this martial aspect back into our new generation (instead of promoting aalsipuna - lazy lifestyles are condemned in Gurmat).

Yes, but my only point is that we should stop the parchar that all religions lead to God, Hindus and Muslims wrote in Guru Granth Sahib etc. It does more bad than good. How often haven't you heard Sikhs married to non Sikhs justify it by saying 'but doesn't Sikhi say that all religions are good and lead to God?' ... There is a difference between saying a religion is wrong and actively promoting the killing of all non-believers. We respect all, we will defend them if need arises BUT we do not agree to their religious practices because they are simply wrong. Evelyn Hall in Voltaires biography wrote a line which comes to mind: "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it".

The political correctness is ruining our Nation. The 'all religion leading to God' mentality is a major cause for inter-faith marriages and conversions of Sikhs. The idea does not find any place in Gurmat, for religious practices of Islam, Hinduism, Jainism were rejected and heavily criticised in Dhur Ki Bani, Guru Granth Sahib. The Gurus and Bhagats rejecting Islam (Hajj, Circumcision and Ramadan) I do not keep fasts, nor do I observe the month of Ramadaan. (M5, 1136, Guru Granth Sahib) Because of the love of woman, circumcision is done; I don't believe in it, O Siblings of Destiny. Devotee Kabir (Bhagat Kabeer, 477, Guru Granth Sahib) The Gurus and Bhagats rejecting Hinduism (Idol Worship, Teerath Yatra, Ekadashi fast amongst others) I have stopped fasting on Ekadashi; why should I bother to go on Teerath to sacred shrines? (Bhagat Naamdev, 718, Guru Granth Sahib) O brother, why worship idols of gods and goddesses, what can you ask of them and what can they give to you? What is the use of washing stones, which themselves drown in water? (M1, 637, Guru Granth Sahib) I have searched many Shastars and Simrtis, they do not show the way to God, but contemplation on God is invaluable. (M5, 264, Guru Granth Sahib) Guru Nanak Sahib's satire of Jainism (about 5 million followers) Shalok, First Mehl: They pluck the hair out of their heads, and drink in filthy water; they beg endlessly and eat the garbage which others have thrown away. They spread manure, they suck in rotting smells, and they are afraid of clean water. Their hands are smeared with ashes, and the hair on their heads is plucked out-they are like sheep! They have renounced the lifestyle of their mothers and fathers, and their families and relatives cry out in distress. ... (M1, 148, Guru Granth Sahib Ji)

Battle tactics or money made some 'Singhs' sellout Baba Banda Singh Bahadur? Watch from 5:08 onwards. Historical reference included.

You should read Theodor Herzls 'Der Judenstate' and about the migration of a few decades that got Jews their nation they didn't have for centuries. Think logically. An example: lets say there is a hamlet in Andhra Pradesh with 14 families, one in Maharashtra 25 families and one in MP with 17 families. Admit it or not, they have no say in the local politics because they are not a large minority enough. Besides, tuition and Gurmat Parcharak will have to be 'paid' (yes, sadly) for every hamlet, small or big. A Gurdwara will be built for every hamlet, wheter small or big (British Sikh Council is doing it, a good job though). Won't it be better to have 56 families in one colony and build one Gurdwara thus saving money for 2 Gurdwaras and also save by having less Parcharaks. This money could be used on further colonies of Sikhs and will also give them political power. The lands these Sikligars are living on are often 'illegal' (see case of Sardar Colony, Alwar which is not enjoying facilities other slums are enjoying because its not registered), and ONE day in the future it is sure they will face the fate of Kutchi Sikhs and Uttarkhandi Sikhs who will come under the radar with some land law being enforced and Sikhs evicted. Assisted migration to the north is only a win win situation. Even Muslims are doing it in Punjab, they are creating colonies in Malwa and now they are majority in 20 seats of 117 Punjab legislative assembly (according to Izhar Alam himself).

N30, every single Sikh should be a Parcharak. Besides that Gurbani instructs us to make others Jap Naam (Jan Nanak Dhoor Mangai Tis Gursikh Ki, Jo Aap Japeh Avreh Naam Japaveh) and spread Sikhis message (as shown in the exemplary lives of our Guru Sahibaan, Guru Nanak Sahibs Udasis and establishment of the Manjis). Seeking individual salvation is not right, you have to inspire others, your family (Gurbani talks about Kul Taarna) and the world.

Secondly, where in the Guru Granth Sahib is Muhammad or Jesus accepted as a Sant or anything else? This while Sants preceding Guru Nanak Sahib such as Dhru, Prehlad and others are mentioned and accepted. Guru Sahib rejected Islam (pilgrimages, circumcision, Halal, etc) then why should we 'respect' Muhammad, especially seeing the anti-Gurmat and anti-moral life he led indulging in rapes, keeping concubines, massacring tribes? Islamists always use the argument that our Gurus were mere humans and suffered such terrible deaths (Waheguru forgive for typing this), but when our Sikh brethren know that Muhammad was poisoned by a Jewish woman they can easily shut the Islamists up. I honestly believe that offense is the best defense.

Brothers, it is high time we realise the difference between certain things. Stating the truth is encouraged in Gurbani, even if it hurts. Presenting objectionable facts from the life of Muhammad Ibn Abdullah or other 'revered' figures should be allowed. If we allow people to post info regarding rapes and murders committed by Gurmeet Ram Raheem then why not Muhammad? Just because some of these 'leaders' have a larger following does not mean we have to close our eyes to the major flaws in those religions and their leaders. Besides it is really important for EVERY single Sikh to have in depth knowledge of other religions for self-preservation and defense purposes. Muslims, Christian missionaries attack Sikhi at every possible instance, it is our duty to know the flaws of these religions to counter these people and inform gullible Sikhs. Ever wondered why all old rehatnamas say not to trust the word of a Turk? Because our ancestors were aware of the fact that Al Taqiya (lying to disbelievers) is allowed in Islam, so they were warning their fellow brothers. Dhan Guru Nanak, Dhan his Sikhi - the only Right Path.

This issue has been going on for several months with hundreds of farmers migrating to Malwa BUT so called 'Panth Rattan' Badal said he wasn't aware of the exact issue the Sikh farmers are facing (4 days ago). Many are not aware but the same thing happened to Sikhs when Uttarakhand was carved out of Uttar Pradesh about a decade ago, many houses of our Sikh brethren were razed to the ground and our Sikh families made homeless. The persecution of Sikhs in India stopped after 95? No! Its continuing, slowly but differently.

Sat veer, the Dastara part was not about this thread but disunity in general. Many Sikhs in Punjab don't even know the basics of Sikhi, we need to make leaflets and distribute them in villages. Leaflets such as Guru in Sikhi (making them aware against Dehdhari Gurudom), Women and Sikhi, Alcohol/Drugs and Sikhi (with scientific proofs too) Caste and Sikhi, Idol Worship and Sikhi, etc as you see just the basics but well argumented, short & to the point with Gurbani quotes and examples from everyday life to speak directly to the readers.

^ This thread is the classic example of why we are failing. Every thread about Panthic Masle gets hijacked and becomes the hub for name calling, leg pulling etc. Something needs to be done about the disunity. Anti Panthic forces have a good time watching the Sikh brothers fight and rip each others Dastara off.

This is the result of being so welcoming of missionaries, migrants and trying to get good image in the general public by being tolerant. I don't know why we need to gain the acceptance of Manmati people, the amount of times our Sikhs tell non-Sikhs about the so-called Hindu Muslim Bhagats in Guru Granth Sahib makes me cringe. The Christian missionaries are targetting many Sikhs, churches have come up in many villages and their numbers tripled in a decade. A Christian Pastor called Harbhajan Deol openly insulted our Gurus and we could do nothing. He forcibly converted 2800 Sikhs in his village and we couldn't act on it? Its funny, Christian missionaries couldn't fulfil their agenda during the British Empire but they're growinly rapidly under the so called 'Panthic Sarkar'.

In one of the videos, one of the caught goons said Delhi Police sent them to kill in Punjab (and he specified 'no looting, only killing'). With none of the Punjabi or Indian medias reporting this, I feel there is a big game going on. Its alot of Bengalis from what I've seen and also a few Africans.

Many of the caught are African as confirmed from sources in Punjab. Don't know if they're students but quite a few of them are African, just like in the left pic and also some videos from near Fatehgarh Chudian. Why do you keep denying without any proof? Then you also got Bangladeshi Muslims. The American ambassador had warned years ago that Bangladeshi Muslim immigrants will cause trouble for Punjab Sikhs in the future...

Gurbani is full of metaphors. The Gurus explained people the concepts of Sikhi by using vocabulary from the 'world' the adressed person belonged to. Wheter it was religious or work related terms, they were used to illustrate what Gurmat is. Terms of other religions where redefined. For example Gurbani teaches Muslims to replace the 5 Prayers (without good actions) with virtues. Many other concepts are redefined, Mecca becomes mind, etc. That is where you have to be careful or you do tend to get confused, especially in the beginning. Besides terminology from other religions, Gurbani also uses words related to the occupations of the respective people they were talking to; agricultural voc (seed, field, water, ...) to explain the Truth (Sikhi) to farmers, economic terms (capital, ...) for businessmen etc. The Abrahamic story of Satan, the fallen angel who can rival God, does not make any sense. Besides that, the Abrahmical story of Satan is never mentioned in Gurbani either. Therefore you have to read the Gurbani tuks containing word Satan in their respective contexts.

Many of these gang members have been caught and they're African. Several were caught in Talwandi Rama (near Fatehgarh Chudian). According to statements from the caught dogs there are more than 40 of them.

Veer Sarvjeet Singh, I will PM you some details of Harpal Singh Kasoor soon, but it is difficult to contact him because he travels alot for his research. Did you find the stone with details of Jagat Guru Nanak Sahib in Anuradhapura Museum? Could you elaborate on the Sinhalese book on Guru Nanak Sahib which was given to you? What is said in it and do the locals still 'revere' 'Nanak Acharya'?

Legal'Singh', seeing your political correctness I can say you wouldn't last one day in the times of Baba Banda Singh Bahadur or Hari Singh Nalwa. Sense was beaten into Suleh literally, the only way they understand. Looks like Pakis forgot who made them wear Salwara

King Shiv Nabh of Sri Lanka did convert to Sikhi and sent preachers far and wide in his kingdom. The Portugese and Dutch did destroy alot of the indigenous culture. The locals reverted back to their old ways with passage of time just like the Nanakpanthis in Arabia, Mesopotamia etc. Best of luck with your research, Sarvjeet Singh. Try to contact Harpal Singh Kasoor (Canada), he is researching Guru Nanak Sahib's udasis since decades, and I'm sure a collaboration would have great results. The last remnants of Guru Nanak Sahibs visits in many places are vanishing, so we should support brothers like Sarvjeet Singh to locate, preserve this history and also raise awareness about it. Dhan Guru Nanak, Dhan Guru Nanak...

Guru Granth Sahib rejects circumcision, Hajj, Ramadan, Hindu fasts, idol worship, etc. Stop being politically correct. "Call the religions of the Vedas and Katebs false, false is he who does not contemplate on the Truth." - Bhagat Kabeer Ji (1350, SGGS)