Sarbloh

http://newspostindia.com/report-12034 Sikh Shrine In Lahore 'taken Over By Hooligans' TUESDAY 21ST OF AUGUST 2007 An 18th century Sikh shrine in Naolakha Bazaar here has been 'taken over by a group hooligans' and the government is 'hesitating to take action' against the Muslims who have locked the Sikhs out, Daily Times said Tuesday. It said the government's action was 'almost like the way Islamabad hesitated over the Lal Masjid affair,' and asked if President Pervez Musharraf was 'aware of the potential danger in this development. 'In an editorial, the newspaper urged Lt. Gen. (rtd.) Zulfiqar Ali Khan to 'act without delay.' A failure on his part, it warned, could prompt the Muslim clerics opposed to the government to 'escalate the incident into a national crisis.' 'Is President Musharraf aware of the potential danger in this development?' the4 editorial asked. The shrike in the heart of Lahore is under the control of The Evacuee Trust Property Board (EPTB). The newspaper did not explain how Gen. Khan, a former chief of the Water and power Development Authority (WAPDA) that deal with development of water supply, is connected with the shrine. The newspaper said that the 'hooligans' had locked the Sikh devotees out and had painted Islamic motifs. They claim that the shrine was originally the 'tomb of one Pir Kaku Shah, a claim not supported by the local Muslim community.' The Sikh temple in Lahore's Naulakha Bazaar is the remains of Bhai Taro Singh who was known to be a patron of the poor. He died in 1745, harassed by a local ruler. The Sikh community built a temple in his honour which is now in the custody of the EPTBas alien property. 'Whatever the facts, General Khan should take no more time in deciding the matter unless he thinks the Sikh shrine is no longer evacuee property after 60 years,' the newspaper observed. The plea for avoiding 'Lal Masjid-like situation' was a reference to the military-led operation last month at the controversial mosque where 167 people died and many injured in the process of evacuating Muslim devotees and students, both boys and girls. The military action, taken after nearly six months' siege, earned praise for Musharraf among the world community and the liberals at home, but has angered the conservatives and the clergy, leading to several suicide attacks. Learb more about Bhai Taru Singh http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bhai_Taru_Singh

People take unexpected time off all the time and most employers should be flexible about. Stick to the truth! Mention that you love working here but have to take some time off due to your brothers wedding, maybe take it as unpaid leave. I personally don't think it will be that big an issue unless there are some deadlines that you were expected to meet. If that's the case try work and bring those deadlines forward as much as possible.

As you have mentioned above, I think the aim is to progress to being a Khalsa (Pure). Khalsa is the highest, and the most glorified state, of a Sikh, who has attained spiritual perfection. Sikhs may respectfully call each other Khalsa. However, calling ourselves Khalsa does not make us Khalsa. For a Sikh, the Khalsa represents an ideal that he/she will continue to revere all his/her life.

I am surprised at some of the responses to this issue. It seems that many people in our sangat are more fearful of muslims for their black magic expertise than anything else. What doesn’t help is the hysteria being created by Sikh groups claiming interaction with any muslim results in a conversion. The whole muslim black magic “phenomena” only pushes people closer to doubt and delvers of these bad practices. We are close to a family who went through a period of suspecting their daughter was being brainwashed by Muslims for the reason that she had well paid job and wanted to invest in a flat to rent out. Through interference from other relatives and family friends, they came to a conclusion that she was seeing a Muslim boy and was going to move out and live with him in order to convert to Islam. The situation went so far that they were advised to enlist the help of some local “babas” who were to break the “spell” of muslim black magic that had been allegedly put on her. This lead to an unpleasant situation where the daughter ended being beaten up by her brother and mother and the Police became involved. Anyway, in the end the daughter did move out and now lives with her Mama’s family. She is now engaged to family friend of ours (a Sikh Guy!) and will be getting married next summer. There was never a Muslim boy or any black magic, just an over paranoia within her mother and brothers who took onboard ill-advice from misguided people. The whole misconception ended up in spliting the family apart. My advise to you is to literally seek 3rd party help if the actions of your family are distressing you. There will be Gursikhs locally who will be able to speak to your family and give them confidence that delving in these practices leads to further dissociation from Sikhi. Also start convincing your family you are strong minded, optimistic, independent and decisive in your daily decision making. Start getting up in the morning and learn/recite Sri Japji Sahib. Attempt learning other essential banis such as Reharas Sahib, Jaap Sahib, Swayie, Chaupai Sahib, Anand Sahib and Kirtan Sohila. Take these visible steps towards Sikhi and watch you familiy's conception of you change. Over time your state of mind will enter a state of high spirits (Chardi Kala) which will be reflected in your outer manifestation. Believe me no one’s going to want to mess with your emotions then!

http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/0100n...-name_page.html Illegal migrant gets life term for murder Aug 14 2007 A SIKH who battered a fellow Indian to death was caged for life by an Old Bailey judge who said the case highlighted "uncontrolled" immigration into the UK. Merjit Bains, 32, beat flat-mate Ragbir Singh Chahal, 31, to death in their flat in Plumstead High Street, with a heavy metal Kara bracelet that Sikhs wear as a sign of devotion. Bains and fellow defendants Jatinder Kandola, 28, Jagpal Jaswal, 22 and Ritesh Marwaha, 22, then dumped the body on Plumstead Common and fled to Birmingham in March 2006. Last Wednesday, a jury found Bains guilty of murder and he was jailed for 12 years. He had already admitted a charge of attempting to pervert the course of justice. Jaswal and Marwaha were found guilty of manslaughter and attempting to pervert the course of justice, after being acquitted of murder. Each was jailed for four years. Kandola was cleared of both murder and manslaughter, but convicted of attempting to pervert the course of justice and jailed for three years. Judge David Paget said the case showed the problems with illegal immigration into Britain, which he said was a matter of "great concern". All four defendants are illegal migrants from India, who have been working in the UK as builders. Judge Paget recommended each of them for deportation when they are released from prison. Prosecutor Jonathan Laidlaw said the flatmates used to drink heavily and argue with each other. Mr Chahal - also known as Bittu - was said usually to come off the worse. He said: "It appears it was Bittu that bore the brunt of these verbal arguments and when the arguments became elevated he also became the victim of their assaults." On March 2, 2006 a row started after work and Bittu was beaten by the others. Mr Laidlaw said: "So forcibly had he been beaten around the head that Bittu also received injuries to his brain that were to lead to his death the following day." The next day, three of the men went to work leaving one to stay with the dying victim to stop him calling the police.

Interesting way of looking at it!

Take some time out from winding each other up and action the following thread! http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showtopic=30009

Looks like that's going to become his claim to fame! Incidently, he was the only one that swore on the documentary. They even gave his gaal english subtitles for more impact.

Done! Thanks for providing the email contacts.

The only shops that I know who sell kacheras are online. Anyhow, I don't see what's wrong with buying your kacheras, aslong as they are kacheras and not something that's been modified. It's not that big an issue!

I now my post will be branded as a "hippy" post. Doesn’t Gurbani teaches that a certain set of acts, beliefs, or some affirmations, alone, without inner sincerity, are futile and are the acts of a Manmukh? I felt somewhat uncomfortable about the old ‘jathedar’s’ comments in the documentary. A million human deaths were experienced during the partition, the cause of which can really only be put down to ignorance. We can guise the intentional slaughtering of humans as ‘t;t for tat’. Actions out of ignorance result in the 'sins' that generate pain, here, as well as hereafter. Maharaj clearly tells us there are consequences of our actions. I don’t think massacres are always a result of "God's wrath". Sri Akal Purakh is loving, forgiving, and Nirvair (free of hostility or revenge). Sri Akal Purakh does not desire to see anyone in pain or in separation. Gurbani says that whenever we seek Sri Akal Pirakh’s kindness, He saves us from experiencing hell. God resides in everyone. Every action creates an equal and opposite reaction. Some consequences are immediate but not visible and the person may seem to be content at the moment. Other consequences may not be experienced in the present lifetime or in this world at all. They are certain to occur nonetheless.

I was told that the origin of the term “mona” was given to a Sikh who had decided to cut their kes (hair) or not keep their kes. As the decision had been made not to keep the outer look of a Sikh as prescribed by Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj, they would not participate in any Sikh activities and keep themselves to themselves and hence would remain silent (Moan) on Sikh issues. Therefore loosely translated the term “mona” Sikh really means the silent Sikh. Not sure how authentic the above is, just something I once heard from someone.

I think it’s spelling differences between different authors when translating into English. There is no official culturally acceptable English spelling for many “Sikh” related words therefore I don’t think there’s any ulterior motive in it. In Gurbani, Maharaj uses both Hari and Har to describe Sri Akal Purakh. Hari mandar Shabde khojeeyai Hari Naamo lehu samaali The Temple of the Lord is found through the Shabad; so become imbued in the Divine Name Ang 1346

The question is who creates the demand for these idols? Suppliers are only meeting a demand, so somewhere along the line some misquided members of our sangat are obsessed with having idols. In my opinion that's what the real issue is.

I have been thinking about this from my last post. Although the distinction between the innocent and the less innocent is a difficult one to make, most people would say that there is something especially wrong with the deliberate targeting of civilians in war. Modern weapons of mass destruction such as nuclear bombs and chemical and biological weapons, whose use would kill thousands, and maybe millions, of ordinary people, seem to be impossible to justify. But if all wars involve killing the innocent, then we are back to the impossibility of justifying war at all? We have to accept that however terrible battle may be, it's at least possible that sometimes a refusal to go to battle may be even worse. For example looking at the Second World War, it led to huge destruction and millions of deaths, but if Nazism had not been resisted there might have been an even worse outcome. All too often combat achieves nothing except terrible suffering, leaving a legacy of bitterness which sows the seeds of future wars. Most people are likely to say that, because we should value every human life as something unique and precious, we should look sceptically at the reasons groups give for inflicting death and destruction in war. But most people would also say that we have to look hard at each individual case, for just occasionally war might be the lesser evil! It's a difficult scenario to comprehend and I believe only through Gurmat Gyan can we really begin to possibly understand this. Perhaps that's why Maharaj made his Khalsa Sant-Siphais (Saint Soldiers).

PS. I assume that the party hall facilities have been stopped at the Ramgharia Education Centre Hall in Slough?

Interesting. I like the fact that people are attempting to drop the caste label. Reading this there is some postivity there and the gathering looked inclusive of different groups. Good Luck.

Dukh daru sukh rog bhia ja sukh tam na hoi. Tun Karta karna mai nahi ja hau kari na hoi.. Pain is the medicine, happiness is the disease. In comforts, there is no longing for God. You are the doer; I do nothing. Even if I try to accomplish something, it comes to nothing

As per C4's response to me regarding the bias portrayl of Sikhs in the documentary "last days of the raj", only 20+ complaints were recieved regarding this. 20 out of a population of 500,000 thats a "staggering" 0.00004% of the UK Sikh population complained! No wonder they did not take it seriously.

Fair comments. However, in order to get the message across we can clearly see some of us overestimating the numbers involved and exaggerating the seriousness of incidents (such us several hundred “forced” conversions in the UK, conversion bounties, Special Branch interventions etc). Inadvertently there is also a danger that the exaggerations lead to the real issues being labelled as rumours and urban legends with an adverse effect on the scale of the problem.

My concern is that all some people on this forum seem to do is attempt to arouse prejudices in our families/community by labeling the Muslim community as something Sikhs fear, hate, loathe and find undesirable. Why is it everytime we post anything to do with the Muslim community reporting it focuses on the stereotypical traits that the reader expects, even though they are far from being representative of the whole community? Below is a wikpedia definition for the term "propaganda". As responsible individuals, perhaps we should question whether some of the current direct anti muslim/hindu stuff being preached by a few of our UK youth fall in this category? Propaganda is a concerted set of messages aimed at influencing the opinions or behavior of large numbers of people. Instead of impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. The most effective propaganda is often completely truthful, but some propaganda presents facts selectively to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the cognitive narrative of the subject in the target audience. The best thing for you to do is to go and spend time with a family whose daughter has run off with one or converted, preflerby 2-3 days after it occurring. You wanna see the state of these people, or you can imgaine the state of them. Its like someones died well many people have died in fact. Some loose their minds, heavy crying, suicidal, being sick and depressed. ..Then go round looking for fancy definitions on the internet. I am not attacking the issue. I believe you. However, I feel the issue is being manipulated to create blatant combat between different religious communities. Rather than create an “awareness” there seems to be more of an obsession with some groups of youth to discredit a whole religious community. I am sorry but that’s what I sometimes see and that’s something that I am also concerned about.

My concern is that all some people on this forum seem to do is attempt to arouse prejudices in our families/community by labeling the Muslim community as something Sikhs fear, hate, loathe and find undesirable. Why is it everytime we post anything to do with the Muslim community reporting it focuses on the stereotypical traits that the reader expects, even though they are far from being representative of the whole community? Below is a wikpedia definition for the term "propaganda". As responsible individuals, perhaps we should question whether some of the current direct anti muslim/hindu stuff being preached by a few of our UK youth fall in this category? Propaganda is a concerted set of messages aimed at influencing the opinions or behavior of large numbers of people. Instead of impartially providing information, propaganda in its most basic sense presents information in order to influence its audience. The most effective propaganda is often completely truthful, but some propaganda presents facts selectively to encourage a particular synthesis, or gives loaded messages in order to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. The desired result is a change of the cognitive narrative of the subject in the target audience.

There’s no denying that we are in a time of diminishing appreciation for Sikh maryada and teachings. Just looking back 30 years or so ago, you would find more value was given to Sikh ceremonies and Sikh beliefs. Over a fairly rapid period of time the adoption of modernity and non-Gurmat values have taken over the community resulting in a dilution of Sikh values. Sikh maryada is being crafted to make life easier for our devolving community, where once Amrit was staunchly preached; today the topic is very delicately handled so as not to offend people. Anand Karajs and Akhand Paths are just seen ritualistic acts that are performed for the sake of it without any consideration or thought being given to the betterment of our own lives or society in general. We are now in a self created situation that will take a period of time to restore, where the Gurdwara and Maryada has been left open for abuse by “Sikhs” themselves. I fully agree that we cannot expect to make overnight “radical” rules because in the haste of quick fixes we can generate a bigger problem. If on one side people think they should stop certain marriages being performed in Guru Ghars then we could see more people going to halls/hotels to carry out Anand Karajs, thus creating another problem. Further to this sweeping and radical announcement from Delhi Sikh Gurdwara Management Committee, I think we (all Sikhs) need to personally take charge in mentoring our immediate/extend families and friends, interacting with them and discussing Maryada, Gurbani, Ithaas. This again means focus on our own Jeevans, before we decide to preach to the world because there’s nothing more hypocritical than being a hypocrite. Not only should we not feel embarrassed about looking like a Sikh, we should also not feel embarrassed in discussing Sikhi. Second and third generation Punjabis need to comprehend that there’s intensity and depth to Sikhi beyond mere family rituals and formalities, perhaps then we will begin to re-cultivate a stronger appreciation of the Anand Karaj.

These kind of dangerous blanket judgemental views, which are being promoted by some "Sikh" groups, need to be avoided. It adds NO legitimacy to any dharmic cause. vadee so vajag naankaa sachaa vaykhai so-ay. Evil actions become publicly known; O Nanak, the True Lord sees everything. sabhnee chhaalaa maaree-aa kartaa karay so ho-ay. Everyone makes the attempt, but that alone happens which the Creator Lord does. agai jaat na jor hai agai jee-o navay. In the world hereafter, social status and power mean nothing; hereafter, the soul is new. jin kee laykhai pat pavai changay say-ee kay-ay. ||3|| Those few, whose honor is confirmed, are good. ||3||

Is overestimating the numbers involved and exaggerating the seriousness of incidents reported the Gurmat way? It can be argued that often rumour and urban legend are a substitute for factually based accounts with the aim of increasing the perceived magnitude of the problem. I personally think that as GurSikhs it is NOT justifiable to blow a situation out of proportion no matter what the intentions are. Sooner or later our own adverse actions will catch up with us.