Sarbloh

The worst thing is that theres so much backstabbing and "too too mein mein" going on in the Panth at this point in time that the influential Sikhs will fail to notice and even take this situation seriously.

With all due respect I don't think you need to facebook group to legitimise or confirm a public vigil. I think it's an important idea and regardless of who confrims or cancels I personally see no harm in all being there on Saturday 6pm. Even if it's just for a short period of time.

The brave death of Bhai Sukhwinder Singh is an inspiration for us bickering Sikhs. So many of us are so into our Jathas, our Groups, our version of history and our version of maryada. We spend hours proving each other wrong and justifying our Sikh superiority over others, justifying our own jeevans. However, picture this. A women being mugged by 2 big black men, a woman being punched in the face by the aggressive mugger and then a lone Singh of Guru Gobind Singh Ji giving chase to these muggers risking more than just his live, but risking the life-line of his wife, son, mother and father all the way in Punjab. How many of us would have gone this far to help someone? How many of us Sikhs would fear our own lives and turn a blind eye? This is “Sarbat Da Balla” in its entireity. This is the “Shubh Karman” that Guru Gobind Singh Ji talks about. This Singh belonged to no Jatha, no Taksaal, no Dal, he was just a sewadar earning a living in the UK. He was a Sikh of Guru Nanak Dev Ji, of Guru Gobind Singh Ji, of Guru Granth Sahib Ji Please let’s not forget this. Sukhwinder Singh has become a national hero for Britain, his memory in the mainstream may only last a few days but his noble deeds should be an inspiration for us Sikhs for the rest of our lives. Please, let’s not forget this veer’s actions. Someone’s already mentioned a fund for the family of Sukhwinder Singh, please can this be shared amongst the Sangat so that we can show his family that they were blessed with a brave son, a brave father and a brave husband. I passed by the crime scene last night and it felt like an empty ground with no memorial for what this Singh. When a loved on is killed in a car accident, people place flowers, cards, photographs on the scene, people visit the scene and remember their loved one. This Singh was a Pyara (loved one) of the Guru and the least we owe him a place in our memories.

To the Management of The Sikh Channel, Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh! Many thanks for responding and also the detailed PM you sent me. With Guru Ji's kripa the management are doing a great sewa and the TV channel is having a massive impact in our household, there's no questioning that. Now, with this great bakshish comes a massive element of responsiblity, which I know you are fully aware of. The Sikh Channel is a massive platform for Sikhs and a medium which is sill very new to us. Potential audience ratings are large and messages can be spread quicker and with more personal depth as the TV is a big part of peoples daily life. It's almost like having a Gurdwara diwan in your living room and for some people this may be the most influential exposure to Sikhi they get. Although we already have a number of Sikh celebraties (via T-Series recordings etc), the channel has huge potential of building the profile of anyone who manages to get a slot on the channel. Basically the Sikh Channel can incorrectly authenticate a parcharak's credability and raise their profile within the Panth. There's also no doubt that parcharaks and keertanis will try to get a slot on the channel in order to promote themselves. It is easy to vet someone's parchar on the TV, however, one-on-one the person has full freedom to openly talk about their beliefs. The danger of allowing a naamdhari on your stage is that you are building his profile within the audience (the sangat) and almost authenticating anything they may say afterwards in a disscussion within another environment. Please think extremely carefully before giving the blessed Sikh platform to anyone, regardless of what they commit to on that specific day. Thank You once again for your great sewa. Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

OK. I am glad a discussion has been started on this point and it is evident that there are naamdharis on this thread too. The katha of the Naamdhari was tactfully OK, he talked about the right things and made no reference to his own living Guru. He obviously had full awarness of who is audience was and made sure they heard what they wanted to hear. No great surprises there as most of our Granthis use the same tactic anyway! From a panthic stand, Sri Akal Takht Sahib has given clear instructions in the form of a familiar Hukumnama (which I believe in the Rehat/Maryada section of this website) that Naamdharis and blatant followers of living Gurus should not be allowed to perform keertan or katha on the stages of Gurdwaras. This mata was passed by the Punj Singh Sahibs and signed by the Jathedar. Naamdharis do not fall in the same category of jathebhandis, dals or sampardays as do the SGPC, AKJ, GNSSJ, Nihang Dals, Taksals, Nanaksar, Missionaries etc. The simple criteria being the accpetance that Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj finished the dehdhari Guru lineage and passed the GurGadi onto Shabad Guru in the form of Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj. There were no 11, 12, 13, 14 or 15th Gurus there on after. The dehdhari belief breaks this parampara allowing the acceptance of a Human form of the Guru to exist, Naamdharis openly do parchaar and vichaar of their further 4 Gurus after Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj It is essential that the Sikh Channel adheres to our parampara and ensures that their representation is not only whiter than white, but also within the mainstream of Sikh maryada which is essentially adhering to the standardised Sri Akal Takht maryada and Sikh belief. Careful consideration must be made when chosing a parcharak or presenter and their affiliation to non Sikh groups (such as Naamdharis) must also be taken into consideration. I have a slight concern that the management of the Sikh Channel may fail to take this on board.

Brothers are brothers! No matter how bad it gets, the good one always does his best for the bad one. I saw this happen with my dad and my chacha too who was a bad alcoholic. He eventually died from an inflamed liver due to the years of alcohol abuse but the descent brothers did everythign they could to help him. Keep doing ardas for your dad and your chacha.

Does this gathering take place in Southall often?

Abortion may feel like an option now but you will regret it in years to come. What's happened has happened. Do the right thing, get married and bring your child up. It's now your responsiblity.

Yes, it should!. The problem is most of us want to run our own high profile organisations, jathebhandis, panthic groups, samagams, schools, achedamies and divert the sangats finances, time, sewa and commitments on to that instead of going back to basics and just feeding the real needy people. All it takes is for some gursikhs to set an example and others will follow. Some Gurdwaras do do this by providing langar to homeless shelters or allowing anyone to enter the Gurdwara regardless of their state. Ask at your all local Gurdwaras or hang around with the right sewadars at the Gurdwaras (not the official committees) and you may be surprised at the gupt sewas that do take place.

Wasn't it a photo? Doesn't he wear a dastar? There are mixed pictures of him in the media. Notice how the BBC homed in on a old picture of him with a turban and full beard.

The newly found "Bhai Nand Lal was a mona" conspiricacy theory keeps coming up as does the Sukha Jinda mona example. The pictures we see of Sukha and Jinda were in Kes and according to what I have heard the were hung wearing their banas. Were the dastars and dara's fake then? At the end of the day scholars like Nidar Singh or Amardeep Madra can only make assuptions based on their research and intellect. It's just another opinion. We all start off as monay, but eventually in order to progress our Sikhi we know we need to keep our sabat soorat roop. That doesn't mean we only focus on our mona pasts and only promote that mona roop.

Theres something very uncomfortable about this. What is so funny about some people mocking the Dhadis of Sri Guru Hargobind Sahib. If this was done in a Bollywood movie Kirpans would have come out by now. Leave the silly boliyan to the likes of Ramta, Sukhwinder Singh, you don't need to do stupid things like this.

Some valid points to think about.

So the legend of Sant Baba Mani Singh was true. This is just so overwhelming. I grew up hearing the story that great mahapurash was born and living in Birmingham. Now all the bits fit into place and everything makes sense. Many of my relatives were privalged to have the darshan of the older form of Sant Baba Mani Singh back in the 1950s/60s in Africa, they always told me that Sant Ji was a tyar bar tyar GurSikh from the time of Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji Maharaj and Sant ji often told them about his recollections from Maharaj's army. Back in the 80's the story that Sant ji had been born again in the UK was discussed amongst the East African GurSikhs (mainly within the Nishkam Jatha) and I overheard the story a few times as a child. I suppose the sceptic side of me never expected it to be true, but now we find out that Sant Mani Singh was really there.

The hundreds of brave Sikh kids who make their stand by attending schools proudly showing their Kes even though they get taunted, mocked and marginalised don't look at getting high profile publicity. It takes the publicity hungry ones to get in the media, be it MPs or organisation or individuals. All people want out of this story is a great big pat on the back. It will be interesting to see if the publicity hungry Sikh organisations who pushed this story forward will continue make any attempt to guide the girl in her Sikh jeevan. If their support stops at the kara then they might as well have defended a piece of metal.

will you be leading the way mr sarbloh? Yes Yes AK47 Sahib, I will save the panth, I will lead you all. Is that what you want to hear from me?? Everyone picks their issues as it suits them. When the issue of these restaurants was raised ( http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showto...mp;#entry287939 ) it wasn't important enough to even make it to the beadbi blogs, yet you have 24/7 exploitation of the Khanda on the High Streets. As ever one thing is always more noticable than the other. I am not saying that the merchandising thing is good, but if we are being encourage to home in on it then also expand our thinking to the meat shops, restaurants, off-licences too. There's no personal attack here, maybe a generalisation of Ilford youth which I apologise for.

SonyNeech, I admire your honesty. Personally I think on the outside we can physically show an immense love for Akal Purakh in order to convince ourselves and the people around us but deep down inside we know our own weaknesses and know our distance from Akal Purakh. You are blessed enough to sit in the sadh sangat and can quote bani, keep carrying on the way you are and build your bond and jeevan. Just think that there’s million of people who will never have any exposure to Gurbani or the Sadh Sangat and you are one of those few (in comparison) who does. You don’t need to please any person or any jatha, just focus inside and believe me from the content of your postings I truly believe you have the aptitude to take amrit very soon.

I dont think it the good work of DSGMC but the kirpa of the Kar Sewa Sants.

I can't see the IkOuankaar range on the site either, maybe its gone. There is still some major exploitation of the Khanda going on, but I guess there's a demand for this stuff which makes it more annoying. Here's another one for the beadbi hunter walays blog http://www.abshar.co.uk/site/ . No one's too fussed about these restaurant/bars using the Khanda to promote themselves. This is even in Ilford, the heart of the anti-beadbi hub. Comeone frontliners, too busy looking for beadbi in other towns, look at your own doorsteps too.

The pessimist always sees the glass as half empty, never half full! The Gurdwaras are not failing anyone, we are failing to understand what the Gurdwara can give us!

I believe we have witnessed the deterioration in the usage of beadbi slogan certainly over the last 2 years. I don’t think the R4G campaign is in existence anymore and has been replaced by splinter cells of agenda driven groups. From groups in the East London/Ilford area who source many of the beadbi sms text messages to some of the elders from the West Brom or ”Babbar Khalsa” Gurdwaras who have jumped on the bandwagon in order to appear panthic. Issues seem to be hand-picked by influential individuals and then blown out of proportion in order to gauge a passionate reaction. The spreading of text messages, use of multiple ids on the internet forums, use of buzz words like ‘masands’ and anonymity all help spin the issue. Below are some of my concerns that I have expressed in the past about the approach of the anti beadbi campaigns in the UK. Despite being one of the strongest and most established Sikh community outside India, we are no where near united in one leadership. It seems the anti beadbi campaigns are reacting to situations every time rather than working proactively, which is the stage they SHOULD be at NOW after almost 5 years. I have never heard the beadbi campaigns holding large scale parchar and gatherings up and down the country continually to educate the Sikh masses and the Gurdwara parbandhaks. The best way to counter beadbi is to involve and increase the knowledge and learning among the Sikh sangats, run active learning process where the Sikh sangats participate in daily care and respect of the saroop of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji during daily prayers and ceremonies. This will increase the involvement of local Sikh sangats, offering them opportunities to take control over their own areas and their own Gurdwaras. The field is now open to a Singh Sabha type large scale movement among local sikh sangats over this issue. Many Sikhs are now having great concerns the direction the present campaigns are taking. If it simply continues on this road, all we may end up doing is to expose the campaigns as nothing short of fanatical individuals, finally segregating the beadbi campaigns to a bunch of riot seeking fanatics comparable to any other religious zeolots. This is not what they should become, neither only the crowd that gathers only to make “force" respect for Sri Guru Granth sahib Ji. The danger with the growing egos is that the Sikh youth are not going to understand the dire need to turn the anti beadbi campaigns diplomatic and into a Sikh sangat movement. We need to connect the Panth together where there will be no need to force large protests to counter issues over the respect for Sri Guru Granth sahib Ji, each and every time, and causing volatile situations which we seem to struggle to justify when confronted by the media and even other Sikhs.

My dear undercover Beadbi squad frontline brothers, why not get a ladder and remove the Gurbani if it hurts you that much? Or is this just an excuse to populate your blog.

Sorry to burst your SAS bubble. The BNP are not a mainstream political party but a group of extremists trying to stir up division and hatred in those communities they are targeting. And don't be so niave in thinking you are not part of that targeting. WE all know there are problems in Britain. Our community is not perfect and we've still got a lot of work to do but the BNP were not sent to save the Panth. The BNP want to divide our communities on the basis of the colour of your skin, where you were born or what you look like. So unless you can scrub the brown of your skin, you've got no chance of doing their sangat.

Someone who doesn't stir trouble usually makes a good leader!

Looks like someone has been brainwashed by the BNP!