AK-47

Fantastic news!!!!! The bani of Sri Dasam Granth Ji is needed now more then ever, to counter the sikhs = hindu agenda as well as countering the hindus and devte/devis = evil agenda as well! The philosophy of dasam guru sahib ji is amazing but many will find it hard to accept! But well done again guys!!

The line in bold sent a bit of a shiver down my back there. The fact that another sikh would suggest that Sri Hazoor Sahib shouldn't be there, is shocking! Despite you saying that you understand what raja ranjit singh was thinking, i cant believe that you actually said that it shouldnt be there!! What do you suggest? Knocking it down or something!?!?!>? Apologies if this is an over reaction, but that just sounded SO wrong!!

come on guys lets think before we type! How can sikhi fail? How can sikhi be 'not strong'? Iv said this on previous threads, sikhi is a path not a community. A path cannot fail or fall or get weak, it remains constant. Those walking on the path can fall, fail or get weak but not the path. What you are observing is actually the fact that sikhi is TOO STRONG and we the people are TOO WEAK to live it. The fault is in us, not in sikhi, so please be careful with your wording. Dont forget we are the ones that need sikhi to get to vaheguru, sikhi does not need us! Everyday in rehras sahib we read, vada na hove, ghat na jae, by praising him he doesnt grow, by not he doesnt loose anything either! So whether we practice or not doesnt matter to vaheguru, as he is unaffected by it, he remains as he is. the only people to suffer will be us. even if tomorrow there were no 'sikhs' that you could see, sikhi would still be alive and in chardi khala as it is the truth, which resides at all places but is in the form of guru granth sahib ji for us to see it in its easiest form.

what an amazing evening!!!! Was so amazing to see both Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharajh and Dasam Granth Sahib Ji in parkash! Some sangat came especially just to get darshan of Dasam Granth Ji as they had never had the opportunity to do so before! The akal ustat ji da path was chardikhala and you could hear the bir raas in the singhs voice when describing the various battles and weapons! Its also a good thing that the singhs taking the hukumname from dasam granth sahib ji had done their santhia, otherwise it would have VERRY hard for just a normal granthi singh to have done them correctly! It might have sounded nice, but to do it properly is another thing altogether! May maharajh bless the singhs were more abhiyaas and kirpa. Sukhwinder Singh Ragi smashed it as usual with a 50 minute arti artha!!! Guru sahib has really done some kirpa on this singh! Balkar Singh's katha was upfront and honest, as a gianni and teacher of dasam granth bani he was able to discuss the various misconceptions people have with dasam granth bani and was able to use gurbani from guru granth sahib ji to explain dasam granth bani and vice versa also! Finally santokh singh as usual were great and finished the evening off with some really heart moving kirtan. Was great to see so many singhs there, just goes to show that we can all get together and sit together in the feet of our father, Guru Gobind Singh Ji. Thanks to everyone who came again and blessed each other with sangat. As k_z has said pics and videos and recordings should be up soon (so he says!). thank you again!

Nice poster k_z i take it you made it yourself! You got some skills brother!! Prog on tomorrow evening! Sukhi baba will be doing the arthi and santokh singh will be doing the kirtan! Hope to see all the guru's ki ladli fauj there, especially you k_z we wanna see you all tyaar batyaar, dumala, shastar and koondia walia moocha!!

Penji if you like that particular style, you might want to try listening to Balwinder Singh 'Rangilla'. Back in the 80's and early 90's when we were kids, his were the most popular cassetes going!

There is a difference between you making the movement and the movement happening on its own. Simply the act of movement does not create more 'Anand' it is what causes the body to move is when you surrender your body and mind to the beat of the Music/Sound/Vibrations/Words. But when movement does happen, get out of its way and allow it to happen and the truth of the matter is when it does happen on its own, you won't be able to stop it. You'd become an observer to the movement not the creator of it. good reply. Sometimes it does happen by itself, other times its your body moving in rythm with the beat/music, and at other times its pure pakhand. Either way, you would assume that the 'anand' which causes bodily movement is not somehow connected with the beat of the tabla. Unfortunetly for many of us it is ... the moment the fast table and fast vaheguru vaheguru stops, the heads also stop swinging and people return to their normal seated position, in a calm and collected manner .. until the next round of fast table that is!! Is this anand? or is it something else? if maharajh says that sitting like a crane in water, or with your eyes closed etc is a pakhand if there is nothing inside, then equally jumping around and swinging your head is equally a pakhand if there is nothing going on inside. In sri dasam granth maharajh describes how a bhagat should focus his dhiaan on vaheguru just like a hunter focuses on his prey. Once he has his target in sight of his arrow, no noise, no wind, no smell, no movement or anything will shift his attention, his whole being and mind is focused on the prey and the prey alone. But for fools like us, we sit eyes closed but they pop open every time a door opens or someone walks past us, and for the body poppers they snap out of their anand as soon as the tabla stops taking a beating or a kirtani that they dont 'like' starts doing kirtan. How far are we from true samadhi!!

No offence but what are you talking about?! Talk about generalising hey!! The following isnt a crack at non-punjabi sikhs, but its a challenge to the above mentality; Please show me how you can show that 'without a doubt' non-punjabi sikhs are much more into sikhi!? Do you have sort of scanner which can judge a sikh based on the colour of his skin or on the place where he was born? Have you spoken to every non-punjabi sikh? Have you spoken to every PRACTICING punjabi sikh? You say non-punjabi sikhs are doing more parchar and spreading more sikhi then the punjabi sikhs. And who do you think it was that started doing parchar to the non-punjabis!? So punjabi sikhs such as sant gurbachan singh ji, sant dalel singh ji, sant attar singh ji, sant jarnail singh ji, sant jagjit singh ji, they cant/dont/didnt do as much parchar as the non-punjabis are doing?? Give praise where it is due, and if non-punjabi sikhs are doing good parchar, then great! But dont be ignorant and insult or even try and suggest that the punjabi sikhs are somehow inferior. This is the same old attitude where anything western is seen as better then the east. Western sikhs know more about sikhi then the punjabi, western sikhi is more pure then the punjabi version, etc etc. The attitude some people have (not neccesarily you) seem to suggest that just because a non-brown person becomes a sikh, they must be better then the others! Its like being racist to yourself. A sikh is a sikh no matter where he comes from or what colour his skin is, but people seem to get so excited by non-brown sikhs and automatically put them on a pedestal. To compare the 2 cultures is ridiculous, on one hand in the west you have a fully economically developed society, plenty of money, opportunities, education, freedom, rights etc etc. In punjab you have countless problems of poverty, corruption, no jobs, limited rights, police brutality etc. Just think about this for a second and how and what kind of parchar you can do in each society! The 'punjabi' sikhs have survived countless attacks and fought countless enemies who tried to demolish sikhi. 'Punjabi' sikhs like baba deep singh ji fought with their head on their hand and other 'punjabi' sikhs like bhai mani singh ji were cut piece by piece. 'punjabi' sikhs in the last 20 odd years have given their lives to protect sikhi and the sikh institutions. With all due respect did any non-punjabi sikh fly to punjab to help and give their head? im not questioning the sikhi of non-punjabis or their conviction to the faith, just trying to demonstrate that this attitude of non-punjabi being better then punjabi is wrong and perhaps even racist. sikhs are sikhs and all are equal before guru sahib, its the rehni behni and nitnem of a sikh that differentiates him from others. Not his skin or place of birth. Sorry if i said anything wrong, again this is not an attack on the non-punjabi, but an attack on the seemingly racist attitude we have developed against our own punjabi brothers and sisters.

The taksal dera's in punjab will not let bibia stay at the dera's .. for obvious reasons. However if as the singh above suggested you were to stay at a local pind you would be able to go in to study learn etc. But again please check as the rules may be different with harnam singh in charge. Best idea would be to call them and find out what provision is available. But please make sure that if you stay with people, that you know them and can trust them, and please do not stay alone anywhere, either at any dera or gurdwara sahib. This is for both your safety and for the safety of the singhs that may also be there as people are often quick to acusse.

Just to confirm that both Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharajh and Sri Dasam Guru Granth Sahib Ji will be parkash at the programme this coming saturday. It would be fantastic to see all the sangat there! Bhai Balkar Singh Ji's katha should be amazing. Unlike many of the rest of us who make so much noise and fuss over Guru Gobind Singh Jis Dasam Granth, he HAS read, learnt and taught the gurbani to many students. So many of us make claims about respect for this bani and its authenticity etc, but have never actually read any more dasam bani then whats in our nitnem!! So it should be great to hear from someone who actually has the right to speak about this gurbani!! Hope to see you all there! ps k_z any news of a poster mate? Come on sort it out will ya!

Oh really ... well nobody asked me ... and since i dont think its anything to do with sikh pride religious identity ... or so i guess its only 2,999,999 !!

The programme hasn't happened yet singh, when it does we'll get the recordings to you. With Mahrajh's kirpa Dasam Guru Granth Sahib Ji will be there as well as our father of course, Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharajh.

I dont think many of us would act all that differently. We suffer from keeping too much hope. We would hope that somehow it was a mistake, we would hope that somehow a solution or cure would appear, we would hope something, anything!! Accepting death is one of the hardest things to do, if you had 30 days, you'd prob waste most of them in denial and just not being able to accept the inevitable. Its what we do know, maharajh tells us to always remember death as it is coming. Yet we ignore it, push it to the side and just dont seem to accept it. And ultimately whats the difference in 30 days or 300 days? If we as sikhs dont listen to guru sahib who is telling us that death is less then the blink of an eye away, do you really think we'd care much if a doctor or someone said that we only had 30 days left? Or maybe we would listen to the doctor and change our ways. But if so .., do we have more faith in the doctor then guru sahib?

his name is sabar hussain sabar we have found one cassette of his varaan but the singh who has the tape is currently in punjab, when he gets back we'll get it off him. im also told that another singh has a few more tapes in some deep dark hidden vault somewhere!! when he digs them out we'll make them available for the sangat

Sometimes too much hankar and akahr can lead to getting juthia. But thats a different topic. As for your questions regarding bindia etc, please ask away, nobody is stopping you. :D As for taksal (and by this you mean Bhrhamgianni Sant Baba Takhar Singh Ji) lying to the sangat for 20 years. Well im glad you feel confident enough with your own bhagti and sikhi to accuse baba ji of lying. Opinions on prounciation, opinions on people being alive or shaheed etc are opinions. But to say that gurbani is wrong or totally dismissing something that is clearly in gurbani is something else. Personally brother i wont argue with you anymore, you ask the questions you want, and ill ask the questions i want.

Vaheguru ji ka khalsa Vaheguru ji ki fateh With Dhan Dhan Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharajh's beant kirpa, a number of Singhs in the UK have completed their santhia of Dasam Guru Granth Sahib Ji. The singhs were very fortunate to have Ustad Bhai Balkar Singh from Damdami Taksal come from the Punjab to the UK specifically in order to teach santhia to these singhs. To celebrate the completion of the santhia, the singhs are holding a small programme on Saturday 23rd February 2008 at; Guru Har Gobind Sahib Ji Gurdwara Tividale, Birmingham Guru Gobind Singh Ji's Akal Ustat will be read from Dasam Granth Sahib Ji and this will then be followed by Katha and kirtan. Everyone is welcome to attend and take laha from Guru Maharajh's Gurbani. The programme will start at around 18:00 and will finish at around 22:30 Vaheguru ji ka khalsa Vaheguru ji ki fateh

Maybe this maybe that? If you dont know what happened, how can you even try and justify this guys words when you didnt even here them? And what makes you think that singhs didnt do veechar with him? Sitting thousands of miles away you feel you have the right to judge the intelligence of the people who challenged this 'parchark'? Simple fact is we need to start checking the people we invite to the gurdwara sahibs to do parchar.

yeh man sick ones enit. lol i would shout whhoooooooooooooooooo cant wait, but to be honest i CAN wait :D forget it lets do it whooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo hoooooooooooooooooooooooooooo cant wait (excuse the pakhand!!) whooooo hoooooooooooooo lol sounds like a god line up, make sure u record the talks etc

good stuff!! not quite the first ever in the uk though lol, the singhs have been doing parkash of both saroops at their homes for a while and the annual dasam granth akhand path at baba sang gurdwara in smethwick as well!! :D hehehe but still a great idea, see you all there! ps, where are you getting dasam maharjh saroop from? is it a lareevar saroop or padh shed one? please let me know as another singh has been asking if anyone knows where a larivar dasam granth sahib ji saroop is?

^^ lol oooh oooooh can i be july??? i heard hindus speak punjabi too!!!!!!!!!!! someone ring the akal takath!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! please lets see someone change the names of the months, which as stated above remain the same as in the 'hindu calendar'.

whoooo hoo just found it! but how do i post it or send it? its a 353 slide powerpoint?!

The dukh bhanjani sahib is a collection of shabads that are to do with dukh sukh, but theres no strict ordering of these shabads, some collections will have more shabads, other will have less. i think sikhs just collected these shabads to help sikhs concentrate on gurbani in times of hardship rather then turn to other things. once upon a time we were able to make a powerpoint using the audio as a reference, so that the powerpoint slides matched the audio track. im not sure where these files are, but ill see if i can dig them out for you. no promises though!

lol well how do you tell if someone is a spiritual gurmukh pyara? do YOU have the kami to be able to do that then?

We all need a little moan every now and then, and sometimes its good to get it out of your system. But come on guys, all this talk about sikhi on the down is garbage! How can the path that leads to vaheguru be on the down?! People practising the faith may not be following it properly and be acting like hypocrites and fakes etc, but the path cant be on the down can it! Its down to our perceptions and how we see things. The pessimistic mind will see negativity, the optimist will see positivity, some may argue that the realist sees reality (but is reality itself real?) Of course the panth has problems, but if we let these get us into some depressed mood, we are only going to add to the problems. There's various threads on why sikhi is going down and people are having a nice old moan, which is fine. I'll offer an alternative view, I have recently met some amazing singhs who are a shining example of what walking on the path of sikhi is. I have seen singhs wake up in the morning and sing their nitnem out loud, nice and slow and with real love. they said that they don't do their nitnem because of maryada or rehat, they said they do it because they have ishq with gurbani (have fallen in true love with gurbani). I have seen whole families reading their own individual sehaj paths and having to try and sneak in a few hours extra reading whenever the other members are out of the house! I have seen singhs who have sold everything they own and taken on so much debt just so that they can do seva for the children of the panth. when i mean everything, i mean everything. I have seen singhs do so much fikar and give the panth so much pyar that they end up sleeping only 2 hours a night and had almost all of their kesh and dhari fall out because of the strain they put on themselves, you can ring the singh day or night with any problem and he's never to busy to help. These might be small pointless examples to others, but they are in inspiration to me, and show me the true message of guru sahib is living in these gursikhs. We usually get depressed and sad when our nitnem isn't as good as it should be, or when our sangat is with the people who maybe we need a break from. So lets trying changing these things as well. If we only look at the negativity around us, then that is what we will become, if amongst the negativity you see the pearls of maharajh and you look closely at them, then it is like them that you will become. Sikhi is amazing and will always remain so. Nobody can change that. A singh told me recently that sometimes we need to do what we need to do and that includes pointing our right from wrong, but whilst doing so never forget to look at yourself FIRST, DURING and AFTER pointing at others. So before we start moaning (as we allllll do!) lets look properly in the right direction (i.e. inwards).

One thing I would say right from the outset is that we need to stop using the 'guru sahib did this- therfore we can do it' argument. Guru sahib is the guru we are the students, it is our job to listen and follow the commands, not to copy them in what they do. The point of guru sahib going to mecca etc has been raised before. But think about it, guru maharajh himself decided to go to mecca. if today someone has the bright idea to take maharajh saroop there, it would be the persons mat telling him to do that. as oppossed to the gurus mat as per when maharajh himself decided to go there. plus we can never truely assume that we know why maharajh did anything until we reach that level of bhramgian. and lets be honest those gursikhs who have reached the level of bhramgain do waaay more satkar of guru sahib then most of us ever do. lets ask ourselves why? (for the sake of this debate im going to take the stance that the individual has the choice in his actions - we know everything is within hukum but thats a different layer of discussion above the current one were involved in). Maharajh did lots of parchar all over the world, accepted. But he also created countless parcharaks and sent them out to do parchar on his behalf. Now these parcharks spread the message of guru maharajh without maharajh physically being there. so the teachings of the guru were being spread even when guru sahib wasnt there. so if the sole purpose of maharajh going somewhere is for educational purposes, then this can be done without maharajh being present. if maharajh is there, then fantastic the parchar will be even better as darshan can be had of guru sahib. But point is that maharajh is more than an 'eductional tool' or even an 'educator'. maharajh is the jagdi jyot of guru nanak dev ji maharajh. and whether we like it or not certain maryada needs to be mantained. e.g. there are talks at colleges, unis, schools etc every week, but it would be impractical for maharajh to go to each place for the 1 hour talk! I dont think anyone is being denied maharajh's message as the gurus door is open to everyone. if anything the parchar is even more open and widely available then ever before given the different ways current parcharaks have of letting people know about guru sahibs message. i.e. media, internet, talks in english etc. while pyar is vitally important, for us maryada is also very important. it stops us from falling of the tracks and keeps us on the road! perhaps once we have done enough bhagti and mahrajh has blessed us then we can dismiss the 'rituals' of faith, but until that point these are 100% needed or else we will falter. my comments are not based on any particular incident i.e. the school or others, but are of a general nature. i believe each incident needs to be looked at individually. quick story we heard recently from a senior student of sant kartar singh ji (taksal's 13th jathedhar) there was a rehansbhai happening at mehta and guru maharajh was parkash. (it may have been that maharajh had been parkash for an akahand path and then the rehesbhai had started). sant kartar singh went to his room during the night to get some rest. now sant kartar singh was known to do around 18 hours of katha on some days! so you can imagine he needed a few mins rest! but as he went to close his eyes guru gobind singh ji maharajh came, grabbed him by his ear and threw him to the floor. maharajh said, why are you resting when i am still sitting on my throne? dont you think that i too deserve a rest?' maahrajh instructed sant ji to go and do sukhasan seva immediately. Sant kartar singh ji then came back into the darbar sahib and apologised to all the singhs, asked for their forgiveness also for his mistake and did sukhsan di seva. the kirtan then continued and sant ji finally got some rest! for some this story will just be about rituals, for others it will show the pyar guru sahib has for his sikh and the nimrata of gursikhs, but also the fact that for parcharaks like sant ji, it was vital that he adhered to the maryada. if he didnt, then others looking up to him wouldnt either.