Aarteee

[sall]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ke Fateh

What are people's views on AARTEE done of Guru Ji and where it is also done of weapons by modern day nihangs in the UK?

Is this a pracitce that was carried out by our Guru's if so then what is the difference between us and hindus?

I know the practice exists at Hazoor Sahib, but what is it amongst youth in the western world who jump on this practice whole heartdly without giving thought on rehat maryada of the AKAL Takhat?

Surely a manmat practice??

[GuruManeyoGranth]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

It depends on what you mean by Aartee. There are GurBani shabads of Aartee ... "Naam Tero Aartee Majan Muraarey" and "Gagan Maen Thaal Rav Chand Deepak Bane", etc.

These shabads are done at all Takhats, Nihang Dals, Damdami Taksal, Rara Sahib, Nanaksar, etc. It is also done at Siri Darbaar Sahib daily, after Rehraas Sahib Da Paath. In these shabads, Guroo Jee is explaining to us what the real Aartee is - ie Naam.

If you mean trays, fires, etc being waved round in front of Guroo Jee, then that seems to me to be against Gurmat.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

Waheguroo

[sher_panjabi]

There is no such thing as singing "Aarti" or "Aarti Da Shabad". Modern day Sikhs have got shabads from Guru Granth Sahib Ji which mention "Aarti" (candle-lit worship) and put them all together under the title of "Aarti" which can be seen in the Amrit-Keertan.

There is nothing wrong with sing any Gurbani. So singing "Gagan Mai Thaal... " shabd or singing the shabad "Gopal Tera Aartaa..." etc are fine. Guru Nanak Ji himself used to sing "Gagan Mai Thaal ..." shabad after Rehraas Sahib according to Bhai Gurdaas Ji's vaars.

However, some Sikhs have become so ignorant and blind to what the Shabd Guru is telling us, that they sing the shabad which describes Aarti, condemns the Aarti ritual practiced by the Brahman and emphasises that Naam Simran is the true Aarti, that they start singing the shabad and waving a big fat taal in front of Guru Granth Sahib Ji just as the Brahmans did infront of idols when Guru Ji was invited to the Mandar in Jagan-naath.

Wake up Sikhs! Read Gurbaani and do Vichaar (contemplate on it!). By reading the Shabad and its message, you will know that Aarti ritual practiced at Sri Hazoor Sahib and others is MANMAT (contrary to Guru Ji's teachings).

At Sri Darbaar Sahib, Amritsar the shabads which talk about Aarti are sung in Shabad Kirtan. What is wrong with this? Singing shabads of the theme of Aarti is sung at all the Takhats and also other Gurdwaras. Great! But when we start doing things like waving a thaal and throwing flowers everywhere and getting the Sangat to touch a Jyot (oil-lamp) for blessings - then you just got to see IRONARY and IGNORANCE - showing that how people are more interested in the ritual practice rather than what Guru ji is explaining in the shabad.

As a result, the Panthic Sikh Rehat Maryada condemns and prohibits the "Aarti" within Gurdwaras. (This does not mean that it condemns and prohibits the singing of Shabads about Aarti).

Bhul chuk maaf.

[sall]

Sher panjabi Thans for your reply.100% spot on this is what I witness a young bunch of Sikhs carrying out in my home town of Gravesend. The fat taal with lit up candles wavering it around weapons of Guru Ji is total and pure manmat. Nanag followers of Niddar Singh have adopted this practice.

There is no such thing as singing "Aarti" or "Aarti Da Shabad". Modern day Sikhs have got shabads from Guru Granth Sahib Ji which mention "Aarti" (candle-lit worship) and put them all together under the title of "Aarti" which can be seen in the Amrit-Keertan.

There is nothing wrong with sing any Gurbani. So singing "Gagan Mai Thaal... " shabd or singing the shabad "Gopal Tera Aartaa..." etc are fine. Guru Nanak Ji himself used to sing "Gagan Mai Thaal ..." shabad after Rehraas Sahib according to Bhai Gurdaas Ji's vaars.

However, some Sikhs have become so ignorant and blind to what the Shabd Guru is telling us, that they sing the shabad which describes Aarti, condemns the Aarti ritual practiced by the Brahman and emphasises that Naam Simran is the true Aarti, that they start singing the shabad and waving a big fat taal in front of Guru Granth Sahib Ji just as the Brahmans did infront of idols when Guru Ji was invited to the Mandar in Jagan-naath.

Wake up Sikhs! Read Gurbaani and do Vichaar (contemplate on it!). By reading the Shabad and its message, you will know that Aarti ritual practiced at Sri Hazoor Sahib and others is MANMAT (contrary to Guru Ji's teachings).

At Sri Darbaar Sahib, Amritsar the shabads which talk about Aarti are sung in Shabad Kirtan. What is wrong with this?  Singing shabads of the theme of Aarti is sung at all the Takhats and also other Gurdwaras. Great! But when we start doing things like waving a thaal and throwing flowers everywhere and getting the Sangat to touch a Jyot (oil-lamp) for blessings - then you just got to see IRONARY and IGNORANCE - showing that how people are more interested in the ritual practice rather than what Guru ji is explaining in the shabad.

As a result, the Panthic Sikh Rehat Maryada condemns and prohibits the "Aarti" within Gurdwaras. (This does not mean that it condemns and prohibits the singing of Shabads about Aarti).

Bhul chuk maaf.

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[mighty singh]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

It is unfortunate to see what is happening at Takhat Sri Hazoor Sahib. An aarti is performed (the thaali full of deevas and lights, rotated in clockwise fashion) before Sri Guru Granth Sahib Maharaj. Literally idol worship of Guru Sahib. This is how much braahminvaad has crept into our religion.

Though I have noticed a number of Gurdwaras in India have a recitiation of Aarti shabads following Rehras. Eventhough an actual aarti is not performed, the shabads mentioning aarti (in amrit kirtan pothi) are sung. What is the significance of this? Where has this tradition come from? If one is to read the shabads carefully then you would realize that the message is that Guru Sahib is refraining us from performing any sort of aarti ceremonies because they are useless. The only aarti is to meditate on Akal Purakh.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

[GuruManeyoGranth]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

There is no such thing as singing "Aarti" or "Aarti Da Shabad". Modern day Sikhs have got shabads from Guru Granth Sahib Ji which mention "Aarti" (candle-lit worship) and put them all together under the title of "Aarti" which can be seen in the Amrit-Keertan.

Veer Jee ... I agree with everything you say ..... almost ... I must disagree where you have said that "modern day Sikhs" have got together the Aarti shabads. As you have said, the shabads about Aarti in Guroo Granth Sahib Jee have been sung since the times of Guroo Nanak Dev Jee Maharaaj.

Therefore, the Aarti shabads have been together as a collection for a long time, not something done by modern day Sikhs. This is evidenced by how the shabads have been together as a collection of "Aarti Shabads" at Darbar Sahib, the Takhats and many Sampardhas of the Panth.

It is one thing to be on the guard against ManMat practices entering the Panth, and we must not have Thaals for Aarti, but it is another thing to discount the collection of Aarti shabads, which have been around for along time. You are right to say that we must do Vichaar of Gurbani and we must realise that Naam is the true Aarti, but we must not discount that there is no such thing as Aarti de Shabad.

Bhul Chuk Maaf

Waheguroo

[Niranjana]

There are 2 ways to look at this:

1. As per above, Guru Sahib in various shabds, particular Aarti Sohila (Raag Deepaki M1) has expanded on the practice of aarti to explain and give reverence for the Divine (re: the Sun and Moon are thy lamps, vegetation your incense etc etc). From this, some have concluded that physical Aarti is wrong. Modern day enthusiasts have taken this a step further and concluded that it is Brahminvad and therefore definitely wrong. This view is describe amply in the posts above.

2. Aarti is a practice in vogue across India and the subcontinent, typically amongst the royal courts – today this can be found amongst Buddhists, Jains, the various “hindoo” movements (shavism, vaisha etc) and particularly amongst the “Khatri” (Kshatriya) classes. Some have on this basis argued that it is not a Brahmin practice, but in fact one of royal patronage and that Guru Gobind Singh himself did it in front of the Guru Granth Sahib (although I have yet to see the reference for this).

On the basis of point (2), it would appear that the events at Hazoor Sahib and in vogue amongst the Nihang Dals are simply a means of affirming the sovereign status of Guru Sahib (in the same way as we commonly see done using other ‘courtly’ and ‘royal’ customs, such as a Thakt Sahib, Chaur Sahib, standing during Ardas, keeping one’s head covered in the presence of the true Emperor, not turning one’s back to the Emperor etc etc) – these are not uniquely “SIKH” customs as some may believe, they are courtly customs that we observe in the presence of our true sovereign the Sri Guru Granth Sahib.

Hence, depending on your outlook, either the Aarti is a completely Brahmin concept and should be ditched (but then shall we do the same with the other ‘non-sikh’ customs described above as well?) or it is a courtly ‘rasam’ and we should continue its use alongside other such customs as described (but if so, why then do we not find any reference to such occurrences prior to the 19th century and how does one interpret the Aarti shabds? – the “recreation of the eternal macrocosmic act with the microcosmic?”)

Gur Fateh!

Niranjana.

[sher_panjabi]

Guru Nanak Ji condemned the "practice" of Aarti in Jagan-nath Mandar!!

The Guru Khalsa Panth has agreed and declared [the practice of] Aarti is Manmat, as per written in the SRM.

Some people honour kings and emperors with animal sacrifices or in some cases human sacrifices, does that mean we should do that as well to show honour and sovereignty to Guru Granth Sahib Ji?

Guru Rakha.

[GuruManeyoGranth]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

The Guru Khalsa Panth has agreed and declared [the practice of] Aarti is Manmat, as per written in the SRM.

Veer Jee ... could you clarify your stand please ... in my view and understanding of Sikh Rehat Maryada, it is not the singing of Aarti de Shabad (which is Gurbani) that is ManMat, but only the physical acts of dhoof, thaal, etc. The former is accepted by the Panth, and practised at the most holiest of Sikh Gurudwaras, whereas the latter is condemned. Are we in agreement on this?

Waheguroo

[sher_panjabi]

Yes I agree with you - thats why i wrote "[the practice] of Arti". I wrote "practice" in the brackets referring to the phyical Aarti (candle-lit worship involving waving a platter) rather than the Singing of Gurbaani.