Hindu Lady Guru Maa

[Guest Akirtghan]

I believe every word of Gurbani is true

so do i :umm:

which says that without becoming Guru-wala (and there is only One True Guru) no one has or will ever achieve salvation

so does that mean that before guru nanak sahib came in sargun saroop no one was able to get muktee :umm: this question has palgued my mind for ages now.

[Bijla Singh]

Guru Nanak Sahib has been Satguru since Aad (the beginning). It was only in 1469 that Guru Sahib manifested Himself in Sargun saroop. The reasons are explained in Vaars i.e. the entire humanity was engrossed in fire on lust and greed and all other religions had failed to guide the humanity. So Guru Sahib pargat on earth to preach Naam, the only way to achieve salvation.

Gurmukh (Guru Nanak) has emerged in this kaliyug, the dark age.

Now, what about “before Guru Sahib”? The question is incorrect as it implies that Guru Sahib took birth but Gurbani and Vaars are clear that:

My True Guru, forever and ever, does not come and go.

So Guru Sahib surely did exist before 1469. Now, Gurbani says that without Satguru no one will or has achieved muktee.

Without the True Guru, no one has found Him; reflect upon this in your mind and see.

Without the True Guru, no one has obtained the Lord; without the True Guru, no one has obtained the Lord.

Gurbani says that there is only One Guru in the entire world. “Iko Satguru Jagta” and

There is One Bani; there is One Guru; there is one Shabad to contemplate.

Therefore, Guru Sahib has been the Satguru forever and ever. Bhatts addressing Guru Sahib say that:

You are the True Guru, throughout the four ages; You Yourself are the Transcendent Lord.

So it has been proven that without Satguru salvation is not possible and Satguru is only One and that is Guru Sahib.

The next question is, how did Guru Sahib give muktee? It is believed by Gursikhs that Guru Sahib used to do kirpa and give naam to selected bhagats who longed for naam and thrived for muktee. Bhagat Dhroo and Prehlad were given muktee in Satyug by Guru Nanak Sahib.

ਸਿਰੀ ਗੁਰੂ ਸਾਹਿਬੁ ਸਭ ਊਪਰਿ ॥ ਕਰੀ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਸਤਜੁਗਿ ਜਿਨਿ ਧ੍ਰੂ ਪਰਿ ॥

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਪ੍ਰਹਲਾਦ ਭਗਤ ਉਧਰੀਅੰ ॥ ਹਸੋ ਕਮਲ ਮਾਥੇ ਪਰ ਧਰੀਅੰ ॥

So now it is clear that Guru Sahib blessed bhagats with muktee. In the following lines of the same shabad it is written that “gur prasaadh prabh paaeeai gur bin mukath n hoe” and then Guru is referred to Guru Nanak Sahib. Also, Bhatts are singing praises of Guru Sahib in Guru Darbar so it cannot be misinterpreted that “Satguru” refers to Waheguru and not Guru Sahib. Even if that was the case, it would still prove that Guru Sahib gives muktee as there is only One Satguru in the world whether you call Him Waheguru (nirgun) or Guru Nanak Sahib (sargun). Both are the same. Bhai Gurdas Ji says that Guru Sahib brought Naam from Sachkhand and gave it to humanity. Guru Sahib established the True throne and Sachkhand in Satsangat. Hence, brining not only naam but also prototype of Sachkhand on this earth.

So we shouldn’t be questioning the doings of Guru Sahib as we can never fully understand His miracles. Guru Sahib’s message is above all and all other religions are inferior and nowhere close to Sikhi. Looking at jeevans of other prophets such as Mohammad it becomes clear that Guru Sahib is the perfect role model for humanity and far superior to prophets. There have been numerous prophets, bhagats, shivas, krishnas, ramas and other but there has always been One Satguru. So comparing Guru Sahib with other prophets is an insult to Guru Sahib and those who insult Guru Sahib are not Sikhs. I hope, this clarifies any misconception on salvation before 1469. Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

[Guest Akirtghan]

thank you :umm:

[Guest Guest]

what these Guru MA'S or Radhasoamis do is very clever. They will talk good stuff for 99 minutes but then the last minute or in the middle somewhere they will slip in some "<admin-profanity filter activated>" which will be enough to lead us stupid Sikhs off the path of our Guru. The majority of us would rather listen to these contraversial or self styled individuals than listen to our own katha vachaks or kirtanis. The biggest problem is there are not many good parcharaks out there or the Gurdwara committee tells them to talk about 'certain' things only and not to talk about other things. i know alot of aunties will listen to these tv stars. maybe its becuase these tv stars dont tell them about rehat and keeping kesh or taking amrit. its all about love and naam. hence only part of what sikhi is.

[Guest Akirtghan]

people complain too much, if you think we dont have any good parcharaks anymore then why dont you try to become one. but nooooooooo, then i get excuses like "o i dont have time", "i dont konw enough punjabi"

if you are not helping and getting involved, how is that bickering helping?

[Guest Santa Singh]

This Hindu lady called Guru Maa was giving a discourse. A Sikh stood up saying to whom does the word Charan (feet) of the Guru refer too, in Gurbani.

She replied "I have a question which will baffle all Sikhs, if only Guru Granth Sahib Ji is the Guru, then why did the 5th Guru not give Guruship to it, he's the one who complied it. Why were there 5 more Gurus after him."

She said to meet the God you have to meet an enlightened one. She quoted Brahm Gyani Ki Gat Brahm Gyani Janey.

Of course a very cunning lady, but why do Sikhs attend her discourses and ask these questions.

Well I have a question that when all the Respected Guru's of Sikh religion have never seen any cast or religion difference then why do we think in that way. If we are thinking that one should not attend Satsang of Gurumaa Ji by saying that she is from hindu religion, then we ourself are not sikh. Sikh means a one who is ready to learn, grow and in constant journey of elevation . Rising high is trait os sikh. Sikh is a seeker and seeker does not sees riligion divison rather he looks and respects the knowledge which is far beyond the body and religion. If someone learns from Gurumaa or any master then it does not makes a differnce.

Dear friend masters are beyond the so the so called boundaries of any religion. I am not favouring/supporting any one but rather saying this with experience.

Please see these and you will come to know about the truth (Guru is Gyan and not confined to any physical body)

just visit these sections form www.gurumaa.com

http://gurumaa.com/guru-gobind-singh-jaap-sahib-mp3.php

http://gurumaa.com/guru-nanak-dev-japji-sahib-mp3.php

http://gurumaa.com/guru-tegh-bahadur-gurbani-mp3.php

http://gurumaa.com/rehraas-sahib-gurbani-mp3.php

[ocelot]

The sikh is a seeker but he has to be sure whether he is learning is truth or fiction (Hindu mythology)

Sikhism completely nullifies Hinduism, That is what all Gurus did. Then why do sikhs learn from Hindu when our Gurus completely nullifies there principles. God is ajoon and so all there avataars are not God, and bani completely disagrees on status of Shiv, Brahma as God.

So your Guru maa has no courage to speak that as it is politics she will not disrespect her hindu followers.

A person can never be Sikh and Hindu at same time.

So in truth sikhs only need to have faith in guru granth sahib and such Guru maa have no existence in sikhi.

Sikh is a learner but what is point in learning wrong things, A learner dont need to learn kaam to minimise it. So point is we can only go on learning further once you have learned your basi (Guru granth sahib) Once you are Good at basic then learn further and try to interpret evrything interms of bani (Guru Granth sahib) , then only you can find what is worth learning and what is crap.

There is no Place of deh dhari gurus in sikhism.

Regards.

[Guest THE WARRIOR]

Some of you Neanderthals need to step out of your box and respect and treat the human race as one as Guru Maharaj tells us, the world faces eco collapse, war, famine hunger run rampant and look at the bakwas you idiots concern your time with.

DW

[Pheena]

The sikh is a seeker but he has to be sure whether he is learning is truth or fiction (Hindu mythology)

Sikhism completely nullifies Hinduism, That is what all Gurus did. Then why do sikhs learn from Hindu when our Gurus completely nullifies there principles. God is ajoon and so all there avataars are not God, and bani completely disagrees on status of Shiv, Brahma as God.

So your Guru maa has no courage to speak that as it is politics she will not disrespect her hindu followers.

A person can never be Sikh and Hindu at same time.

So in truth sikhs only need to have faith in guru granth sahib and such Guru maa have no existence in sikhi.

Sikh is a learner but what is point in learning wrong things, A learner dont need to learn kaam to minimise it. So point is we can only go on learning further once you have learned your basi (Guru granth sahib) Once you are Good at basic then learn further and try to interpret evrything interms of bani (Guru Granth sahib) , then only you can find what is worth learning and what is crap.

There is no Place of deh dhari gurus in sikhism.

Regards.

I was going to write a long reply to your points, but after reading this "So your Guru maa has no courage to speak that as it is politics she will not disrespect her hindu followers." I can tell you too have no idea what she is about nor have you listened to her enough, if any at all. Please have a listen to her Katha's on the Japji Sahib, Rehraas Sahib and Jaap Sahib and then create your conclusion. You say a Sikh is a Learner, then learn to listen to what others are about before you jump to conclusion about them.

[Pheena]

The panktee you quoted simply means that Guru Nanak Sahib is the greatest of all but there are other quotes which clearly say that there is only One Satguru or Guru. Gurbani doesn't say there are different types of Gurus with different level of spirituality. There is no difference between Guru (Satguru) and Waheguru. Both are the same.

I agree with you veer that there is only ONE True Guru, but this True Guru is Anaami. I said what I said, because you had used the words Guru Nanak Dev as being the Sole Guru. Now I simply could've misunderstood you (semantics), but i was getting the impression that you were implying that the body that was born in 1469 to be the Sole instance of Avtaaran of the Nameless Divinity. That there existed no such instances before or nor will any after?

I don't think you really understand who Guru Nanak Sahib Ji is. Guru or Satguru is not in the cycle of death and birth so the question of "before Guru Nanak" doesn't make any sense as it implies that Guru Sahib took birth which would've surely resulted in death but Guru doesn't fit in this category. Guru Sahib is "Sada Sada" and has been there since Aad. Just because Guru Sahib "Pargat" in Sargun form doesn't mean he took birth. Bhai Gurdas Ji doesn't say Guru Sahib took birth. According to Gurbani Guru Nanak Sahib has been Guru of all ages. I can provide quotes to back up my statements but I didn't because this topic has been discussed so many times before.

I think we are just losing ourselves in semantics!?!? The only True Guru is Guru Nanak Sahib, which is a wonderful statement, but by confine this 'Sada Sada' , 'Sargun/Nirgun' True Guru to the umbrella of Sikhi, it would then go against the teaching of Jaap Sahib, which says, True Guru is Adharmang? It was with this viewpoint that I wrote my original reply.

I don't undermine other religions but I do believe Sikhi is 100% truth and superior to all. Other religions condemn non-believers to hell but Sikhi doesn't. Not achieving salvation doesn't result in going to hell but in reincarnation. Those who do good deeds and practice spirituality will certainly get fruits of their labor and get better karmas but will not get muktee. I believe every word of Gurbani is true which says that without becoming Guru-wala (and there is only One True Guru) no one has or will ever achieve salvation. Others or you may not like it but Gurbani is never wrong.

See I'm all with you that you Trust in the way of the Guru is 100% and is solid. But why is there a need to say Superior? Does saying that my religion is Superior makes it more Valid to others? Does it not seem create a superiority complex? With this viewpoint how do you look at your Muslim, Hindu, Christian Brothers and not feel that whatever way they are given by the Great Guru lacks? If stating that your way is the superior, then is it truly 'your' way or was this Path blessed upon you? If it is blessing then what is the need to turn this blessing into a Duality of Superiority/Inferiority?

Have you just not condemned Non-Believer/Follower of Sikhi to be Inferior than you? If Sikhi is the Leader/Superior in this matter of reaching the True Guru have you not indirectly condemned 'others' to being Lost, will never reach salvation, is that not in likeness of hell?