Strange Preachers

[AK-47]

Farida bhoori da Bhalla kar, gussa man na handai GGS Kabir jee Slok. Who is better the khata vachik who speaks bakwash or the one waving around his fists because he dont have the intelligence to do veechar? In India people are making so much money robbing people because they say have ghosts and spirits in their homes, simple minded people give all their earnings. Maybe he is saying that Sikhs dont have time for ghosts only believe in Satguru. Its sad however that people keep confusing the sangat on Dasmesh jees Bani.

Maybe this maybe that? If you dont know what happened, how can you even try and justify this guys words when you didnt even here them?

And what makes you think that singhs didnt do veechar with him? Sitting thousands of miles away you feel you have the right to judge the intelligence of the people who challenged this 'parchark'?

Simple fact is we need to start checking the people we invite to the gurdwara sahibs to do parchar.

[ghorandhar]

Veer jee you are right, I am sorry. What I should have wrote, is this is what I believe, it is impossible for me to know what is going on in his head (this missionary khata vachik) when all I did was read what happened on net.

On the other hand, he nearly got battered as was written on this forum. Is that the form of debate which took place? since I was not there like you said, maybe you can tell us. If this statement was not made, I would not have made the comment. When people are being threatened (Nearly getting battered which I would interprete as threatening) is this the best environment for dicussions?

When a missionary khata vachik called Sagar (I cant remember his first name) did not do khata as certain people in the sangat in the Midlands wanted him to, he was attacked from behind as he walked into his room. He was asked to do Khata on Sukh and Jinda, he said that the Gurdwara committee has asked him to do suraj parash Khata, the khata vachik said he would be willing to do Sukha and Jindas khata on Sunday when the whole sangat was present and when he is free to do whatever khata he wishes. This is just an example of what ive experienced, threatening to batter people or khata vachiks trying to keep hold of there dastars is not an environment for discussions.

Veer jee you cant agree with what every parcharkh says, I agree that maybe some standardised questions could be framed. Since this is a thread regarding strange parchaks and since all khata vacikhs should be questioned, would it not be fair to ask the Damdami Taksal khata vacikhs why they persist on not pronouncing bindia when reciting gurbani when Sant baba Gurbachan Singh jee did his books? Why are they misrepresenting the Taksal and Sant baba Gurbachan Singh jee? When for 20 years the sangat was told that Sant Jarnail Singh jee is in Chardi Kala, why should we allow those khata vachiks to keep lying to the sangat and coming onto stages.

In my opinon not only have missionarys become strange, but so have the Taksal. In my opinon lying to the sangat and missrepresenting Sant Baba Gurbachan Singh jee is not a little mistake and should also be added to the list of questions to be posed to Khata vachiks.

[AK-47]

Sometimes too much hankar and akahr can lead to getting juthia. But thats a different topic.

As for your questions regarding bindia etc, please ask away, nobody is stopping you. :D

As for taksal (and by this you mean Bhrhamgianni Sant Baba Takhar Singh Ji) lying to the sangat for 20 years. Well im glad you feel confident enough with your own bhagti and sikhi to accuse baba ji of lying.

Opinions on prounciation, opinions on people being alive or shaheed etc are opinions. But to say that gurbani is wrong or totally dismissing something that is clearly in gurbani is something else.

Personally brother i wont argue with you anymore, you ask the questions you want, and ill ask the questions i want.

[TejiKaur]

Whats his name? And what area is he doing his bakwas in at the moment? It aint that tall sikh missionary college guy is it? If its him he nearly got battered at a gurdwara in the Midlands a while ago.

if you know the gurdwara committee then tell them that he does parchar that is anti sikhi and anti nitnem etc, if they dont listen to you then they are part of the problem as well. people like this need to be taken off the gurdwara stages and not allowed to utter their filth.

This particular missionary guy went around on stages saying how there were no such things as bhoot preth etc, but when sant jagjit singh ji were sitting in front of him and the question was put to sant jagjit singh (who said of course they exist and went on to explain about them) he didnt even let out a single squeek.

these people just speak their bakwas trying to confuse the sangat.

Farida bhoori da Bhalla kar, gussa man na handai GGS Kabir jee Slok. Who is better the khata vachik who speaks bakwash or the one waving around his fists because he dont have the intelligence to do veechar? In India people are making so much money robbing people because they say have ghosts and spirits in their homes, simple minded people give all their earnings. Maybe he is saying that Sikhs dont have time for ghosts only believe in Satguru. Its sad however that people keep confusing the sangat on Dasmesh jees Bani.

guru fateh ji

i have hd some confusion about this too

in my gutka it has the pranvo ad ikankara as chaupai

so i have spent so much time in confusion

for so many years ive done both just in case n i wonder which one it is

they re spelled the say wy too matlab th epunjabi akkhars in chaupai are the same?

My parents were taught from their grandparents that pranno ad ikhankar was the chaupai recited in the morning. The creation of the panthic Sikh rehit maryada standardised what everyone was to recite as chaupai. When the Panthic Sikh Rehit maryada was formed people were all reciting different things. I cant tell you the reasoning of dropping this chaupai, but all I know is that my family and others in our pind used to recite this bani as chaupai in the morning. Maybe depinding on what district of Punjab you lived in, people were doing differnt things? It would be interesting to ask the older generations what they all used to recite just out of interest to see if there is any patterns.

Thx ji ill try that

for now i guess all jus tdo both too much bani cant hurt :D

[ghorandhar]

Sometimes too much hankar and akahr can lead to getting juthia. But thats a different topic.

As for your questions regarding bindia etc, please ask away, nobody is stopping you. :D

As for taksal (and by this you mean Bhrhamgianni Sant Baba Takhar Singh Ji) lying to the sangat for 20 years. Well im glad you feel confident enough with your own bhagti and sikhi to accuse baba ji of lying.

Opinions on prounciation, opinions on people being alive or shaheed etc are opinions. But to say that gurbani is wrong or totally dismissing something that is clearly in gurbani is something else.

Personally brother i wont argue with you anymore, you ask the questions you want, and ill ask the questions i want.

LOL. hopefully no one will get juttia and also parchar against the dasam granth will also stop.

Bhai Sahib jee, Sant Takhur Singh jee is not with us, the topic is about those who are doing parchar on the stages today. As for Brahmhgiani, I dont have such knowledge of these things. All I can do is comment on what happened or in this case did not happen.

I agree that these are opinions. But the topic was about preachers. From there I commented on someone nearly getting battered. I agreed with you that we need to check out those who do khata on the stages. I did not mean to quarral with with you, all I did was add to your comment by expressing my opinion that double standards should not take places when misrepresentation and lying is taking place. Therefore if we are to check those who do khata on stages, such things should also be taken into consideration.

The topic can become circular because People who are against dasam bani will also say its our opinion that Guru Gobind Singh jee never wrote this. What I try to do is ask people do you believe in the panthic Sikh rehit maryada? they will say yes as did Prof Inder Singh Ghagga did when I asked him. The next point is that the Panthic Sikh rehit maryada when talking about who is a Sikh, clearly says on Page 4: 'daas Guru Sahiban de bani ati Sikhia (nuu manda hai)' On page 19 it also says under point ehri (3rd letter) that the bani of the 10 gurus should be apart of the Khata. Im making this point on the dasam granth to show to you that I agree. All Im saying is that one perspective should not be taken when checking the khata vacikhs.

Veer jee I do not mean to argue with you, but only do veechar and I'm sorry that my style of writing is presented differently. I firmly believe in the dasam granth and believe its good that we will all try to answer those who manipulate its pangtia. However, when these people are beaten up, they then go around saying that no one could answer us back so they attack us. My point was only that we should not do such things and fall into their trap. My purpose is not to argue with you, infact I agreed with your point that we should check out khata vachiks but not on select points.