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Isn't that statement a fallacy? or if not a fallacy, erroneous? We should adhere to Gurbani, and have faith in it. Then as mentioned numerous times in Gurbani there are ghost, pooth, prets, all that nice stuff. I agree, a Gursikh becomes untouchable, but then you call them fallacies. Isn't that a fallacy, saying that pooths and prets are not real/misconceptions but then saying to adhere to Gurbani which states that they are real? If they were not real why would we need Waheguru Ji's protection? (refer to gurbani below please ) Therefore to the OP the best way of looking at this is yes there is black magic, ghosts, evils, w.e. How do we save our selves? hir ismrq ikCu cwKu n johY ] har simarath kishh chaakh n johai || Meditating in remembrance on the Lord, the Eye of Death cannot see you. hir ismrq dYq dyau n pohY ] har simarath dhaith dhaeo n pohai || Meditating in remembrance on the Lord, demons and ghosts shall not touch you. hir ismrq mohu mwnu n bDY ] har simarath mohu maan n badhhai || Meditating in remembrance on the Lord, attachment and pride shall not bind you. hir ismrq grB join n ruDY ]2] har simarath garabh jon n rudhhai ||2|| Meditating in remembrance on the Lord, you shall not be consigned to the womb of reincarnation. ||2|| By seeking the protection of the Lord. Therefore the best prevention/protection is Gurbani. When can we be harmed? When we are weak in our spirituality. Therefore strengthen your spirituality if you are afraid, or give this advice to others if they feel like they need to go to these pandits. But to just trash something because we can't fully see it or understand it is absurd. Time is a tricky thing. We look at it like everyone in the past was ridiculous, blundering around being stupid. Now we are the right ones and we get to scorn those who still live in the past. Not really, it seems much more circular, rediscovering, losing, inventing, reinventing. Everyone is focused on how modern, and progressed the world is compared to the past but look at all the old forgotten sciences which were originally thought to be baseless and our now being researched and validated. The scientific method/thought process is far from perfect but people apply it to everything now a days. Truthfully, science is corrupted. You only research things that make money, or you do research in truly important fields and live broke, get laughed at and your research sits in archives. They get the caste of "untouchable" until some rich guy comes along and wants it researched so he can make money off of it! by this point the original researchers career is over or their dead..... so yeah. Sorry I went on a bit of a tangent, but long story short: it's there, do you're paat, you'll be good. Convince others to do paat as well, they'll be good, and you'll get brownie points!

Sabsai upar gur shabad beechar || Paramount is contemplation on Guru's word From my experience 99.9% of sikhs show zero interest in study of the maharaj (not talking about recitation as in sehaj path) , I think this ignorance and neglect of the core gurmat knowledge is root cause of all problems in sikh samaaj today. Here is a link to download SGGS in english translationa and transliteration http://www.facebook.com/groups/341594932591046/342922462458293/

Jaswant Singh (second from left) being felicitated by the SGPC in Amritsar; and (right) Jaswant at work. Tribune photos Seventy-six-year-old Jaswant Singh Khosa from Malaysia starts his day as early as 4 am and for the next 12 to 13 hours he writes copies of Guru Granth Sahib in Gurmukhi. It is the outcome of his faith and passion that he has already prepared five handwritten copies of the holy book in the last over two decades. He presented one copy to the Akal Takht on Monday. Talking to The Tribune, Khosa said the copy of Guru Granth Sahib which he handed over to the Akal Takht had pages having a length of 26 inches and width of 19 inches. "The holy book weighs 50 kg while it has a total of 1,430 pages, the same as a printed copy has. It has also made it to the Malaysia Book of Records as the heaviest handwritten religious book. It is a meticulous work to write in Gurmukhi script in exactly the same way as appears in the printed copy. One has to ensure that words are linked together and each of the 19 lines on every page are perfectly aligned. Moreover, it needs a lot of attention, as a single misspelled word will mean sacrilege," he said. Khosa said he had used a special white paper and ink named Kohinoor which was procured from the US. He said the handwritten copy could last up to 300 years and even water could not affect it. He said he had already started working on his sixth handwritten copy of Guru Granth Sahib. He said his first handwritten copy had been installed at a gurdwara in Southall, London, while the second one was at Har-ki-Pauri at the Golden Temple. Similarly, his third "bir" had been installed at a gurdwara at Edmonton and the fourth one at a California shrine. On what inspired him to take up this work, Khosa said it was his visit to Amritsar post-1984 as a part of a five-member Sikh panel from Malaysia to take stock of the damage caused to the Golden Temple during the Operation Bluestar. "We visited the Sikh Reference Library and were distraught to see the damage it had suffered. Our treasure trove of rare books laid burnt and destroyed," he said. Whether he faces any health problem while performing this painstaking task, Khosa said he was perfectly fine, though he wore glasses while writing the holy book. He said he wrote the first four copies while sitting on the ground in a conventional manner. However, the fifth copy was penned on a table as he had some problem in his knees.

As rightly mentioned, it would require an individual to reach a particular avastha before they can make comments about Guru Sahibaan being the same as Akal Purakh or not. Gurbani has clearly stated several times that there is no difference between the Guru and Vaheguru. We cannot force anyone to believe in something, however, we only encourage others to have faith in Gurbani. Rather than trying to question what Gurbani states, how about trying to get to a level where you can actually grasp the deeper meanings behind what is said?

Some say prounounce terminal sihari and unkar where this makes sense from context and language being used, others say completely ignore, what do you do?

i heard off a few ppl that guru gobind singh ji sed dat we shldnt trust sikhs wearing black patka/pagh as it is color of the enemy? This true?

as per Damdamit taksal's rehat maryada you can only wear black/blue/white/safron color's in turban and clothing's i dont see an issue here

Just wondering on which criteria admins are locking topics? seems that admin will say something on the topic and then lock even when discussions are ongoing. this site is a place for people to discuss different views and debate thats the only real way to learn

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?/topic/69437-i-dont-know-y-people-say-gurus-are-god/ link to the topic that was locked again i only ask what criteria is used because this thread didnt seem to be going off topic, and the replies were generally respectful as for some people bringing down others on this site i agree it happens, i agree we should all learn to co-exist what i generally do no like is people pushing their views on others e.g my way or the highway, sikhi is personal to each and every individual and should be respected as so!

This is a Sikhi forum. Sikhs do not believe this stuff.

The word study cannot be interchanged with contemplation when discussing Gurbani. Study means to apply the mind to acquire knowledge. In Gurbani's case, the mind cannot understand Gurbani on its own. The mind is missing the most important ingredient to attain knowledge from Satguru, which is Satguru's kirpa. After studying science a person can attain knowledge that will be helpful in the future. With Sikhi a person needs to contemplate over Gurbani. Contemplation requires a person to go beyond studying. It requires a person to step deep into the shabad and actually feel the Shabad. People like 3HO, udhasis, Missionaries, etc like Sarbjit Singh Dhunda study Satguru and they miss on the true essence of Satguru's teachings. Studying is when a person looks from the window in. They scratch the surface and have some knowledge as to the point their mind can understand. Contemplation is when the person has placed both feet on the Guru's path and now is ready to accept the deep understanding Satguru is about to present. Many people study Gurbani, but they never actually contemplate over Gurbani. We always hear Sikhs speak about a Shabad a Gyani or someone else spoke about and how they don't agree with what the Gyani or other person is saying. Or they take many different Shabads and then put them together to make a theory of their own. So no doubt many people study Gurbani. Many people on forums study Gurbani. Dr. I.J. Singh is the lead studier at Sikhchic. Guruka Singh is the lead studier at Sikhnet There is also a lead studier here, but lets keep this professional. They never actually contemplate over Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji Maharaj. With contemplation every nerve in your body starts to sing the tuk, Shabad, or paat; the person is trying to understand. With Contemplation the mind bows many times and submits to the beauty, sweetness, and infinity greatness of the shabad. When contemplation takes place there is no desire to understand. The understanding comes with Satguru's kirpa and the desire is to follow Hukam. Last example to grasp the difference. Satguru is the living Guru, does the living Guru ever act like a book? With a book you need to apply the mind and then keep constantly applying your knowledge to understand the next part. When it comes to Gurbani, we need to listen carefully. Satguru speaks to you. So contemplate (listen to the truth with contentment) when reading Gurbani. Lastly this is not word play. Studying and contemplation have two completely different meanings when it comes to Sikhi.

if you wear black you are a muslim

same here

I totally agree with panthicunity veer- more time is being spent on outward rituals(rituals are not bad as long as right balance is striked) in regards to sri guru granth sahib ji sargun saroop instead of striking a right balance between sargun rituals to upheld satkar of sri guru granth sahib ji, vichar of gurbani and meditating on nitneem and shabad guru. But on a bright side of things i can proudly say resources are widely available and one has to realize and look for them, amount of sikh spiritual material available online and in library is pleasantly surprising. We have close to ten different written teekas of sri guru granth sahib ji/bhai gurdas ji available for gurbani vichar with them offering historical(uthanka), grammar(vikayaran), bhav arth (initial thought behind reciting gurbani pangkitias, anrtiv arth(spiritual arth) aspect of gurbani in sri guru granth sahib ji on top of that- we have sri guru granth sahib larivar audio katha done by sant gyani gurbachan singh khalsa bhindranwale 35 times all have slightly different variations as depending on audience and their depth and also gurbani antriv arths is connected with human consciousness, as soon as human consciousness transcendent towards vahiguroo- perception of spiritual arth of gurbani gets more deeper and transcendent with it. I think in real life things are different but cyber sangat especially youths are slowly realizing importance of doing vichar of gurbani but there is quite bit of improvement we can still do as sangat for example- Have you wondered? why controversial topics gets more hit than deep theological concepts gurbani take on vahiguroo ji, one's own mind, ,soul, one's natural discriminatory power(bibek to filter good from bad) as hans filters moti from garbage.

A Sikh Does not believe in this stuff. -full stop. Yes there are many weak people out there that fall for this stuff and start seeing exorcists and pandits or what have you. But if a sikh ever doubts that someone may have cursed him or done some voodoo crap, then that sikh should just adhere to the gurbani abit more and have the utmost faith in it. -Then nothing can come near, the sikh becomes untouchable by these fallacies.

They do mock. It' the way most of the punjabis are. They want to know what paath you do, how often you do it. I mean they know very well that you probably do paath,which is why they ask. Otherwise, they would say or tell you ''thu paath kariya kar''' I mean what if you say 'NO', then what are they going to say- They are just gonna tell you that you should. If you know they are being cheeky and mocking, then you could just say ''sometimes or when I can'' if they are just curious, then you should quickly answer ''hanji'' and immediately followed by ''thusi vi karde,??'' then ask ''how often or when'' -- This is sure to make them think before asking next time !!!

WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa WaheGuru Ji Ki Fateh Is there a link (if there is one) to download a pdf version of Sri Kalghidhar Chamatkar? I've scrolled through the forum and didn't come across one. Can anyone share it if they have it? Thank You

I recently bought laptop for my mom and i want to install a good anti-virus. I don't want to get free programs as her laptop usually ends up corrupted after a while. Is there any cheap (under 40$) anti-virus program that you can recommend?

Wait for reviews ?? man AC3 is gonna best the other ones easily i for one cant wait for it