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plants do feel pain, just because it doesnt scream dont mean it doesnt feel pain

it has a athma

it is a joon in 8.4 million life forms

if something has a athma, it can and will feel pain if u eatit

theres a shabad that talks about a sugarcan being chewd on and it is screamming too

u breathe in life forms

u step on them

u eat them as plants

if u rtruly do not want to kill any lifeform watsoeever

stop breathing

stop eating

it wud b impossible

we are not jains

this is not the marag to mukhthee

sikhi is also sensible

maa is not eaten because, first of all, were killing the animals parent, the children are left without parents, etc.

and second

it is bad for anyone who wishes to do bhgthee, becomes almost impoosible

thas it

not because of cruelty for the pain we ar giving nit when we kill it

even plants feel that pain

but god has made a design

plants as a joon must feel that pain as a ounishment for past karms

its a huge play, a cycle

now to say im going vegan

is not possible

unless u die

because ure killing animals as u breathe

as u walk

everywhere

and singh veer je has also given a completly understandable point

for humans to survive, we can use other speicies for our advantage

to recite kirtan, we use the skin of goats for tablas, etc

we use the body parts of animals for many thing

leather cases for kirpans, which were used by purtaan singhs

many things such as these

so werre purtaan singhs wrong for killing animals for there skin,e tc?

eating meat is baf for bhagthee

and we dont wanna kill somethnig for no reason, we can get proten from milk, daal, sabjee, etc.

and now soya

but to become vegan is totally pointless, as u have missed out on the truth and are falling into bharm, like the jains

bhula chuka maf

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to say veganism is pointless cant be right, especially if you are saying that you shouldn't eat meat based on the fact that it messes up bhagti.

Think about it, if the same cow that you cant eat because it will make your mind loose focus, how can you drink the milk the cow produces? How will the milk from teh same cow that you cant eat because of its bad effects on the mind, not have the exact same effect on your mind that the meat will have?

I never thought of this before, but reading GDD's post made me think, if eating meat from a cow is bad for bhagti, how is drinking the milk form the exact same cow, not bad for your bhagti?

and to say that a person is following into the same bharm as jains by doing this, seems wrong to me as well. By saying this, are you than also saying that Sant Baba Harnam Singh was falling into this same bharm when he would look down at the gorund before taking every step he could to avoid killing any insects that may be on the ground? Even though you may not agree with it, you should understand that each person has a distict set of beliefs with stuff like this.

In the same way you are saying UntitledSingh is falling into bharm for doing this, others may say that you are fallling into bharm for not eating things like renit, glycerin, gelatin and unfertilized eggs.

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Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa! Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

hahaha this is outrageous, there absolutely IS logic in saying that if a one is a civil engineer, then by building roads, one indrectly supports robbers, slaughterers, abusers, etc. But S1ngh Veerji was just giving an example. He's right. Do what you want to do, don't force others. Once you've said you believe this is right, why go crazy trying to make everyone agree? it aint gona happen, sorry bro.

murakh di bhull chukk di khimma bakshni, Jiyo.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa! Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~eDiTeD~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ohhhh *yay* my current tukk is Mum Pratpaarang Jai Tegang blush.gif

105715[/snapback]

Sat Sri Akal

Firstly I would like to clear one thing up, I am not telling you guys not to take animal products, i'm just telling you the facts. But when you guys attack my beliefs I will not stand there, I will try to explain my self. Secondly "there absolutely IS logic in saying that if a one is a civil engineer, then by building roads, one indrectly supports robbers, slaughterers, abusers, etc." Indirectly is the key word, if you buy animal products that is directly. If i think about it I could have persuaded OJ Simpson to kill his wife "indirectly", by causing an accident on the 91, which made him get angry and kill his wife. No logic. Remember I dont want to offend you I just want to explain my self, so no hard feelings man.

Sat Sri Akal

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plants do feel pain, just because it doesnt scream dont mean it doesnt feel pain

it has a athma

it is a joon in 8.4 million life forms

if something has a athma, it can and will feel pain if u eatit

theres a shabad that talks about a sugarcan being chewd on and it is screamming too

u breathe in life forms

u step on them

u eat them as plants

if u rtruly do not want to kill any lifeform watsoeever

stop breathing

stop eating

it wud b impossible

we are not jains

this is not the marag to mukhthee

sikhi is also sensible

maa is not eaten because, first of all, were killing the animals parent, the children are left without parents, etc.

and second

it is bad for anyone who wishes to do bhgthee, becomes almost impoosible

thas it

not because of cruelty for the pain we ar giving nit when we kill it

even plants feel that pain

but god has made a design

plants as a joon must feel that pain as a ounishment for past karms

its a huge play, a cycle

now to say im going vegan

is not possible

unless u die

because ure killing animals as u breathe

as u walk

everywhere

and singh veer je has also given a completly understandable point

for humans to survive, we can use other speicies for our advantage

to recite kirtan, we use the skin of goats for tablas, etc

we use the body parts of animals for many thing

leather cases for kirpans, which were used by purtaan singhs

many things such as these

so werre purtaan singhs wrong for killing animals for there skin,e tc?

eating meat is baf for bhagthee

and we dont wanna kill somethnig for no reason, we can get proten from milk, daal, sabjee, etc.

and now soya

but to become vegan is totally pointless, as u have missed out on the truth and are falling into bharm, like the jains

bhula chuka maf

105718[/snapback]

Sat Sri Akal

No offense, but you are bringing up useless points like leather cases, we can make cases our of anything, and even fake leather, we can make tablas out of another kind of material. By the way Hindus drink milk, they dont eat cow because they think it is holy, which has nothing to do with me. And the most popular point you had was Plants, veer ji, can you look me in the eye and say there is no difference between an animal and a plant. Plants dont suffer pain, they have a completly different nervious system, and the important thing they are not concious, they have no brains. lol. And when you say we are killing animals when we breathe, those are not animals, those are just tiny organisms, like bacteria, as complex as plants. This is how I see it, there is not much differnce between a dog and a pig, but why do people eat the pig. Because its ugly? One more thing, the mother cow is killed in the end, and the female calf takes it place.

Remember I never ask my self if meat eating is right or wrong, I just know that the way they do it today has to be wrong, where animals are in cages their whole lives.

I want more input from everyone. Please help me if i am taking the wrong path, and encourage me if i am on the right one.

Sat Sri Akal

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if the calf of the mommmy cow is gettin its full of milk why cant we have the extra???

and besides what do u guys get from arguing like this all the time hes a vegan who cares right its a good rehit not a bad thing, all this knowledge doesnt really matter, just kamai matters....if GDD is more focussed as a vegan then thats good just dont cut out the degh!!!

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WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA

WAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

DEAR

UNTITLED SINGH

ALL THE POINTS YOU HAVE MENTIONED ABOUT TREATMENT OF ANIMALS ARE TRUE BUT YOU FAILED TO MENTIONED ABOUT THE PLIGHT OF OXES HORSES CAMELS ELEPHANTS AND DONKEYS

MALE CALVES ARE CASTRATED AT AN EARLY AGE ENDING THEIR SEXUAL

LIFE SO THEY CAN BECOME OX.THEY ARE FORCED TO PULL OVERLOADED CARTS OR PLOUGH FIELDS.THE FARMER CONSTANTLY HIT STICK IN THEIR PRIVATE PARTS.THEY SUFFER FOR THEIR WHOLE LIFE IN THE WHEN THEY BECOME USELESS THE FARMER SELL THEM TO BUTCHERS. SIMILAR IS THE PLIGHT OF OTHER TAMED ANIMALS

MANY FARMERS IN INDIA USE OXES FOR PLOUGHING FIELDS. SO WHAT

YOU ARE GOING TO.WOULD YOU STOP EATING FOOD.ALL THESE CONCEPTS

OF AHIMSA VEGETARIANISM ARE BASELESS.FROM CENTURIES HUMAN CIVILISATION EXISTED ON ANIMALS SUFFERING.

BHUL CHUK MAAF

KANWARDEEP SINGH

Mod Note : Virji do not use CAPS next time. thanks :doh:

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I respect Untitled Singh 100%

I think you going vegan is great and shows compassion. Don't listen to those who say going vegan is pointless.

I'm a vegetarian but you being vegan shows more dicipline to me and Sri Guru Gobind Singh Ji once said something along the lines of... A Sikh is not Important to me, his rehaat (dicipline) is.

_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _

Bhul Chuk Maaf Karna

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WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA

WAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

DEAR

        UNTITLED SINGH

          ALL THE POINTS YOU HAVE MENTIONED ABOUT TREATMENT OF ANIMALS ARE TRUE BUT YOU FAILED TO MENTIONED ABOUT THE PLIGHT OF OXES HORSES CAMELS ELEPHANTS AND DONKEYS

        MALE CALVES ARE CASTRATED AT AN EARLY AGE ENDING THEIR SEXUAL

LIFE SO THEY CAN BECOME OX.THEY ARE FORCED TO PULL OVERLOADED CARTS OR PLOUGH FIELDS.THE FARMER CONSTANTLY HIT STICK IN THEIR PRIVATE PARTS.THEY SUFFER FOR THEIR WHOLE LIFE IN THE WHEN THEY BECOME USELESS THE FARMER SELL THEM TO BUTCHERS. SIMILAR IS THE PLIGHT OF OTHER TAMED ANIMALS

      MANY FARMERS IN INDIA USE OXES FOR PLOUGHING FIELDS. SO WHAT

YOU ARE GOING TO.WOULD YOU STOP EATING FOOD.ALL THESE CONCEPTS

OF AHIMSA VEGETARIANISM ARE BASELESS.FROM CENTURIES HUMAN CIVILISATION EXISTED ON ANIMALS SUFFERING.

                                                BHUL CHUK MAAF

                                                      KANWARDEEP SINGH

105745[/snapback]

No offense but you guys keep bringing up indirect things. If i eat meat cuase i am supporting killing the animal or drink milk cause i am supporting stealing the milk, that is a direct action. If i buy a vegitable, i dont know if they use oxe, in the US i think they use machines, but in India how can i be responsible for the farmer hitting the oxe. There is only so much i can do.

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WAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA

WAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

BUT IN THE USA THEY USE DEADLY PESTICIDES.WHICH IS RESPONSIBLE FOR KILLING OF MILLIONS OF HARMLESS INSECTS BIRDS AND WILD ANIMALS

BY BUYING THESE YOU ARE SUPPORTING IT. SO PLEASE BUY AND EAT ORGANIC

PRODUCTS.

BHUL CHUK MAAF

KANWARDEEP SINGH

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