Betrand Russell On Sikhism

[crayzy]

Bertrand Russell was a great philosopher and free thinker and is said to have given Christianity (same applies to Islam and Judaism) a body blow and exposed its absurdities; but even this great man got stuck when it came to Sikhism! In fact he gave up and said "that if some lucky men survive the onslaught of the third world war of atomic and hydrogen bombs, then the Sikh religion will be the only means of guiding them.” Russell was asked that he was talking about the third world war, but isn't this religion capable of guiding mankind before the third world war? In reply, Russell said, "Yes, it has this capability, but the Sikhs have not brought out in the broad daylight, the splendid doctrines of this religion which has come into existence for the benefit of the entire mankind. This is their greatest sin and the Sikhs cannot be freed of it." What Bertrand was most impressed with was that Sikhism does not have a doctrine of evangelism that it does not go out to try to subvert and convert. In some ways he thought that Sikhs should go out and propagate their great faith.

Does anyone knoe where he wrote this, what article/book?

Thanks

edit: Ive searched a lot of his books and google, the only websites that mention Russell and Sikhism in the same sentence are Sikh websites. I'm beginning to think someone totally made this up

[Ishna]

I've done some extensive searching for this reference, including searching for the text in countless ebooks and downloads attributed to this author, and I have found no evidence. I think you are wise to regard it with suspision at this stage.

[natsilahk]

Completely made-up.

Sikhs have a tendency to do these things.

[crayzy]

It goes deeper:

From: "Atheist Society" < atheist_society@hotmail.com >

To: afreethinker@hotmail.com

Subject: Dear Ali we have a problem, please help!

Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2001 20:40:30 +0000

Dear Ali, please help us. We were very impressed with your website and agreed that religion in general is no longer needed, we can all be humanistic and live in peace and harmony. We are in the process of making a website which will hopefully help to destroy the religious doctrines which divide humanity. We were doing great with knocking out Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Baha'i, even Buddhism but we have gotten very stuck with Sikhism. This religion is (to put it nicely) "a big pain in the <admin-profanity filter activated>" (Please pardon the language) We have only found one site which tries (very poorly) to argue that even this religion is not needed, but the argument is irrational and very unscientific unlike the very rational arguments you use.

When we read the following from your website, we found what you said to be amazingly interesting: "Doubt Everything Find Your Own Light." "Last Words Dear friend, if you look for meaning in life, don’t look for it in religions; don’t go from one cult to another or from one guru to the next. You can expend all your life or look for eternity and will find nothing but disappointment and disillusionment. Look instead in service to humanity. You will find “meaning” in your love for other human beings. You can experience God when you help someone who needs your help. The only truth that counts is the love that we have for each other. This is absolute and real. The rest is mirage, fancies of human imagination and fallacies of our own making." By Ali Sina Why is this interesting? Because we found this religion of Sikhism to be in agreement with you! This is why we have a problem. We tried to look at their holy text (Adi Granth) but didnt find the usual absurdities we found in the other religious books. In fact its refreshingly inspiring and very good!? Maybe you can have some better luck.

We tried to visit a couple of websites and got more of a shock. Did you know that they believed in Democracy, freedom of speech, choice, expression, freedom of religion, pluralism, human rights, equality between men and women, equality of all people regardless of race, religion, caste, creed, status etc. 300 years before the existance of the USA! Theirs is the only religion which says in their religious scriptures that women are equal in every respect to men. They even had women soldiers leading armies in to battle against "you know who" (The usual suspects - Muslims!) Their history is a proud one, they fought in both World Wars. Even Hitler praised them for their bravery and Aryan heritage! Dear Ali, this religion is hard for us to try and criticise but you are an expert and may find some faults overlooked by us. In their holy book, there is a round earth, water is made from chemical elements, there is even mention of the evoution process, big bang and life on other planets! This is pretty crazy and amazing stuff, who would have thought that these New York taxi drivers (There are lots of Sikh taxi drivers in NY) would have such an amzing faith? We read up some information of what Bertrand Russell had to say about Sikhism, this is the man who destroyed Christianity (same applies to Islam and Judaism) and exposed its absurdities, but even this great man got stuck when it came to Sikhism! In fact he gave up and said "that if some lucky men survive the onslaught of the third world war of atomic and hydrogen bombs, then the Sikh religion will be the only means of guiding them. Russell was asked that he was talking about the third world war, but isn't this religion capable of guiding mankind before the third world war? In reply, Russell said, "Yes, it has the capability, but the Sikhs have not brought out in the broad daylight, the splendid doctrines of this religion which has come into existence for the benefit of the entire mankind. This is their greatest sin and the Sikhs cannot be freed of it."

Please bear in mind that Bertrand Russell was a great philosopher and free thinker. We have been trying for weeks now to find a way to fairly and rationally criticize and find fault with this religion but have failed. We even found out that there are many people converting to this religion in the USA and Europe as well as Russia (Mostly well educated and affluent white people). We tried to find some of their literature and see what kind of claims they make, but unfortunatley they have no missionary material as they do not have missionsaries! People become Sikh by learning usually by chance or by coming in to contact with them. They are currently the 5th biggest religion in the world and growing quite fast in the west and Russia. Please help us as we are stuck, to give you an example of they are all about we found the following websites: http://www.sikhnet.com (This is a pretty good site and helpful) http://www.hope.at/sikhism (This site is very easy to follow, check it out, they have a Womans section and a Martyrs section, it looks like that you are not the only one trying to expose the falseness of Islam, Sikhs scholars did it hundreds of years ago and got killed for it!) http://www.sikhs.org (This is the site that was on CNN when Sikhs in the USA were mistaken for Arabs and Middle Easterners and were attacked by mindless morons)

Please help us out, we cant make our website about religion being the cause of war and disharmony when we have this one and only religion which makes a hell of a lot of sense! lol (I thought Atheism had all the answers but were kind of stuck now.) We look forward to hearing from you, we respect your great views and want to promote them to everyone, thank you for your time, take care.

Dr. John Smith

yes..." john smith" was the best name the could come up with??? Our good doctor has bad grammar and a tendency for melodrama too...a bollywood fan perhaps...

This is shameful...who the heck would go to such lengths. Trying to promote the 'truth' of Sikhism by lying...fun

From: "Atheist Society" < atheist_society@hotmail.com >

To: afreethinker@hotmail.com

Subject: Dear Ali we have a problem, please help!

Date: Fri, 05 Oct 2001 20:40:30 +0000

apparently they have access to his hotmail account....to an atheist called "Ali"...

[Prem]

That is so pathetic. What a foolish person. What does it say about that individual? This kind of thing takes credibility away from Sikhs.

[Sabre Sword]

but even this great man got stuck when it came to Sikhism! In fact he gave up and said "that if some lucky men survive the onslaught of the third world war of atomic and hydrogen bombs, then the Sikh religion will be the only means of guiding them.”

Kinda reminds me of what A Renowned historian said:

Arnold Toynbee:

they are the burliest men on the face of the planet, tough and capable, and

slightly grim. If human life survives the present chapter of man's history, the Sikhs for sure, will still be on the map."

In some ways he thought that Sikhs should go out and propagate their great faith.

anyone who understands sikhi would kno that gursikhs will come to be at gods will.

those with such a preordained destiny will become sikhs.

people who make these so called characters andclaims are in the same class as those hindu right wingers that claim sikhi is a sect of hinduism, or those certain muslims that keep claiming guru nank dev ji sahib was a mohameden.

they just want bulster their numbers,

[Ishna]

I found that e-mail in my travels as well.

If you keep reading you'll find a response to "Dr John's" e-mail from "Ali". The response by Ali is actually somewhat derogatory (in my opinon), and it is challenged by by someone called "Ryan" who goes to a great length to disect "Ali's" negative comments and shed a little light about Sikhi.

I have not found a response to Ryan by Ali yet.

Also, "Dr John" doen't say that he is a Sikh, he implies that he is an athiest. His comments do seem a little too sympathetic to Sikhi though....

Ishna.

[crayzy]

wonder how he got his doctorate with his poor grasp of english grammar.

[Khalsa_Girl_1]

wonder how he got his doctorate with his poor grasp of english grammar.

151721[/snapback]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

:lol:

BAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA

actually...this quite serious...

think before you do things sangat ji.....

[Lion(LK)King]

Where did the talk of B Russell come from?

Look at "The excellence of Sikhism", a book which cites non-sikh's view on Sikhism, historians, journalists, politicians etc.

He gives reference to most of his quotes, but some of them he himself interviewed, such as an Swiss Professor page 120-122.

If you're really after the source (which will show that you are actually making an effort to reserach) then I suggest you go to his website.

http://www.sikhglory.alagshabadyug.org/contact.php

I recommend you either email him or phone him (his number is on the above link)

Tell him it's regarding the statements regardin B Russell, in chapter 8 "Excellency of Sikhism" page 120.

And he should definetly be able to answer.

Another myth I just read about was about BHai Khanaiya jee inspiring Sir Henry of Red cross, to find the REd Cross. This is not true, all he says is tha a few hundred years before the Red cross, Bhai Kanyia Ji, a Sikh, did exactly the same - selfless service. It does not say that he INSPIRED Sir henry to do so.

Again, I recommend everyone this book, and if you're out to find out where he got his info from, I recommend you call him (as Punjabis can be pretty dodgy with emails)

Also, please post what he says :lol:

P.s whether John Smith is real or not - his statements are for sure (most of thme atleast), the responses made by Ali Sina of Faithfreedom.org, are absurd and have no base whatsoever. He was again refuted by "Ryan", to which he did not respond. All of the mails sent back and forth were published on his website, until he re-made the site, and removed some sections, including that of John Smith's email, Ali SIna's response, and "Ryan's" response to his respons. I should have it somewhere on the computer.

Bhull chukk maaf