Sikhi Naal Mazaak (images Included)

[Raju]

Mr. Raju many have replied to your question but it seems that you want a more practical answer. Ok. Here it is.

Dera Sacha Sauda is a intelligence agencies sponsored enterprise as are many others. Their prime job is to influence and ensure that people do not think of revolution but stay in and believe in peace and non-violence. This way their mind is not able to be revolutionised by thoughts freedom movement against the govt. If you look at the present condition of Indian society, widespread poverty, exlpoitation of masses, no redressal of grievences, no food security, no scope of justice, mass scale human rights abuses, rampant corruption. etc. etc. you will be amazed that there is no reaction from public. The reason is these govt sponsered deras. They help in keeping the minds of people away from common movement and their energy is directed to useless direction. People go to these deras for getting hope in face of their many problems.

The reason these deras are strong in Punjab also helps in keeping population support for khalistan in check.

apne, you will be surprised when you hear that these are the same accusations flung against Seventh Day'ers and JW's.

there are people who claim that these two 'New World' sects have been created by the intelligence agencies viz CIA so that the masses can be kept in control of the elites.

Coming back to topic, I was not exactly seeking a practical answer. But as I was typing down an article for this topic yesterday, I had an aha moment .. it suddenly struck me that the IBN debate on Sikhi was near the target afterall. In the sense Sikhs are insecure with Dera's because their numbers were already so few. THe Christians were not as insecure with JW's or Seventh Day'ers because they already had large numbers.

The emergence of Dera's would splinter and fragment what was already a small group of followers and thus the resultant insecurity.

Is this reasoning correct ?

[JHUJAARROO]

Mr. Raju many have replied to your question but it seems that you want a more practical answer. Ok. Here it is.

Dera Sacha Sauda is a intelligence agencies sponsored enterprise as are many others. Their prime job is to influence and ensure that people do not think of revolution but stay in and believe in peace and non-violence. This way their mind is not able to be revolutionised by thoughts freedom movement against the govt. If you look at the present condition of Indian society, widespread poverty, exlpoitation of masses, no redressal of grievences, no food security, no scope of justice, mass scale human rights abuses, rampant corruption. etc. etc. you will be amazed that there is no reaction from public. The reason is these govt sponsered deras. They help in keeping the minds of people away from common movement and their energy is directed to useless direction. People go to these deras for getting hope in face of their many problems.

The reason these deras are strong in Punjab also helps in keeping population support for khalistan in check.

apne, you will be surprised when you hear that these are the same accusations flung against Seventh Day'ers and JW's.

there are people who claim that these two 'New World' sects have been created by the intelligence agencies viz CIA so that the masses can be kept in control of the elites.

Coming back to topic, I was not exactly seeking a practical answer. But as I was typing down an article for this topic yesterday, I had an aha moment .. it suddenly struck me that the IBN debate on Sikhi was near the target afterall. In the sense Sikhs are insecure with Dera's because their numbers were already so few. THe Christians were not as insecure with JW's or Seventh Day'ers because they already had large numbers.

The emergence of Dera's would splinter and fragment what was already a small group of followers and thus the resultant insecurity.

Is this reasoning correct ?

jungle vich sheran di giniti kini hai

ate baki janwaran di kini

asi kadi ginti minti vich nahi pye

je pae hunde tan saanu muglan naal pyar naal reh ke hindu bakrian nu charana c

per asi tera bhana mitha lage te chale han te chalde han 1984 vi ajeha hi maamla c

je asi jhuk jande tan marde na

per asi sarirak maut nu maut nahi mande

jamir da marana yakinan maut aa

siane manukhan di giniti hamesha khat hundi aa mukhan di jiada

pani nu dol deo oh hamehan niwan val janda

uper chadhon lai jor lana painda

so are u agree with me

[apne]

Coming back to topic, I was not exactly seeking a practical answer. But as I was typing down an article for this topic yesterday, I had an aha moment .. it suddenly struck me that the IBN debate on Sikhi was near the target afterall. In the sense Sikhs are insecure with Dera's because their numbers were already so few. THe Christians were not as insecure with JW's or Seventh Day'ers because they already had large numbers.

The emergence of Dera's would splinter and fragment what was already a small group of followers and thus the resultant insecurity.

Is this reasoning correct ?

Raju as i had said sometime earlier, that you are possibly a Hindutva ideologist. They try to emulate the ways of various splinter groups in west and try to put that in their intellectual functioning. It is quite evident and visible when you try to compare Sikhi with christian movements and conveniently keep the so called hindu religion out. And becomes more visible when you try to mock the few numbers of sikhs.

It has been explained to you that Sacha Sauda is not a religious group or sect.

About your so called few numbers of Sikhs i will explain it you now how it works. We all know that during Ranjit Singh's rule the Sikhs formed only about 7% of total population of Kingdom. They were even less during the Misl period probably 4 - 6 %. But they were able to defeat the NWFP tribes, the most ferocious tribes in South Asia. How the Sikhs achieved that can be judged from the fact that the Americans and Pak army are having a difficult time to contain them.

It is a well understood fact that when it comes to action only a few people actually take active part in any struggle. Population numbers are good only when you have to count votes for elections. Numbers can only influence the outcome of a general election (which your bapu gandhi understood quite easily), they don't have any other use. Take the case of Indian population, a billion strong nation is unable to take it's claimed parts of J&K from a comparitvely inferior Pak.

When you compare the west with Asia, take any Euro country viv a vis India, it is self explanatory on the usefullness of large numbers.

Now lets us examine the usefullness of large numbers in religion. Hinduism has 900 million followers. But what is the outcome or advantage of this large numbers. For the past 1400 years, hindus have been subjected to slavery first by Muslims then by British. The present state of hinduism is like a comedy drama. There is no hindu nation in the world. They cry hoarse that there is 'hindustan', but it is in reality a derogatory term used by Muslims. What is the state of hinduism right now. All it's basic principles such as caste system, worship of idols, wearing of janeu, supermacy of Brahmins, the existence of four social class of people, Sati, cow worship, celibacy etc. (all basic doctrines) are nowhere to be seen or recognized. There is no historical proof of any existence of any Hindu God, they are acknowledged myths. The texts of Hindu doctrine are mythical stories written for entertainment. In the name of hinduism all that exists is blind superstitions (there was a claim recently that the workshop of 'ravan' has been found in sri lanka, where he built and kept flying planes; pushpak vimaan) lol. There is no cohesive structure. The beliefs and practises of hindus change with every 40 kms. It is like a hotchpotch of beliefs thrown together to form a common name which is nowhere uniform.

It is a well known fact that if the ten million sikhs had not opted to live with 500 million hindus during partition, the great hindus would have starved to death and unable to survive.

Dera Sacha Sauda is a cult of hinduism like many other movements. Majority of it's followers (1.5 crore) are Hindus and very few sikhs, muslims, christians. And i don't want to debate on media especially IBN and NDTV (both very anti-Sikh and anti-akali dal) On why the controversy erupted read Post #4 here. http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showtopic=37969&st=0

If Sikhs thought like hindus then they would claim sacha sauda to be sikh and increase their numbers, but what will it do? Make it contradictory like hinduism is today! The advantage of less numbers is that tommorow if you land anywhere in the world and find a Sikh there, he would look exactly like the Sikh in Punjab, the way Guru Gobind Singh wanted. And Sikhs everywhere share same set of beliefs and practises of Gurus, unlike any other religions.

[JHUJAARROO]

Mr. Raju many have replied to your question but it seems that you want a more practical answer. Ok. Here it is.

Dera Sacha Sauda is a intelligence agencies sponsored enterprise as are many others. Their prime job is to influence and ensure that people do not think of revolution but stay in and believe in peace and non-violence. This way their mind is not able to be revolutionised by thoughts freedom movement against the govt. If you look at the present condition of Indian society, widespread poverty, exlpoitation of masses, no redressal of grievences, no food security, no scope of justice, mass scale human rights abuses, rampant corruption. etc. etc. you will be amazed that there is no reaction from public. The reason is these govt sponsered deras. They help in keeping the minds of people away from common movement and their energy is directed to useless direction. People go to these deras for getting hope in face of their many problems.

The reason these deras are strong in Punjab also helps in keeping population support for khalistan in check.

apne, you will be surprised when you hear that these are the same accusations flung against Seventh Day'ers and JW's.

there are people who claim that these two 'New World' sects have been created by the intelligence agencies viz CIA so that the masses can be kept in control of the elites.

Coming back to topic, I was not exactly seeking a practical answer. But as I was typing down an article for this topic yesterday, I had an aha moment .. it suddenly struck me that the IBN debate on Sikhi was near the target afterall. In the sense Sikhs are insecure with Dera's because their numbers were already so few. THe Christians were not as insecure with JW's or Seventh Day'ers because they already had large numbers.

The emergence of Dera's would splinter and fragment what was already a small group of followers and thus the resultant insecurity.

Is this reasoning correct ?

mr raju

are u now satisfied

Mr. Raju many have replied to your question but it seems that you want a more practical answer. Ok. Here it is.

Dera Sacha Sauda is a intelligence agencies sponsored enterprise as are many others. Their prime job is to influence and ensure that people do not think of revolution but stay in and believe in peace and non-violence. This way their mind is not able to be revolutionised by thoughts freedom movement against the govt. If you look at the present condition of Indian society, widespread poverty, exlpoitation of masses, no redressal of grievences, no food security, no scope of justice, mass scale human rights abuses, rampant corruption. etc. etc. you will be amazed that there is no reaction from public. The reason is these govt sponsered deras. They help in keeping the minds of people away from common movement and their energy is directed to useless direction. People go to these deras for getting hope in face of their many problems.

The reason these deras are strong in Punjab also helps in keeping population support for khalistan in check.

apne, you will be surprised when you hear that these are the same accusations flung against Seventh Day'ers and JW's.

there are people who claim that these two 'New World' sects have been created by the intelligence agencies viz CIA so that the masses can be kept in control of the elites.

Coming back to topic, I was not exactly seeking a practical answer. But as I was typing down an article for this topic yesterday, I had an aha moment .. it suddenly struck me that the IBN debate on Sikhi was near the target afterall. In the sense Sikhs are insecure with Dera's because their numbers were already so few. THe Christians were not as insecure with JW's or Seventh Day'ers because they already had large numbers.

The emergence of Dera's would splinter and fragment what was already a small group of followers and thus the resultant insecurity.

Is this reasoning correct ?

mr raju

are u now satisfied

bakrian nu gu

[Raju]

what's your point J.

the Lions are being poached by neighbouring jungals ?

apne, you have said a lot of things.

But firstly you have accused me of being a 'hindutva ideologist'.

To all those in this forum who think I am a 'hindutva ideologist' and thus worthy of derision and contempt, I have suggested one uniform solution. Please consider me a 'hindutva ideologue' for all intents and purposes.

To all the haters I desire to be what they hate most.

In your eyes the hindus are weaklings of the highest order .. so that is what I want to be.

I don't want to be associated with the strong .. I desire to be associated with the weak.

Coming back to topic.

The reason I bought up this topic was with a specific purpose.

During a discussion on NDTV after the Dera Sacha Sauda issue had flared up there was a particular Sikh gentleman on the panel who disagreed with the rest of the participants who behaved like a mob. he was a mona and not with full swaroop.

Now after the show was over, a few of the participants went over and roughed him up.

At that time, I felt that this was more akin to wahabbi/talibanic behaviour or suppressing all dissent with force. Rather than the behaviour of a self-confident and self-assured group of people though harbouring a genuine grievance.

[apne]

Raju whether you want to be associated with strong or weak, does it matter? are you george bush?

I don't want to be associated with the strong .. I desire to be associated with the weak.

you smell of Gandhi, the donna carren of pan-hinduism and forerunner of the radical hindu.

You should stop relying on media, especially NDTV, IBN , etc. . They don't give a damn about truth but cater to hindu masses. Have you seen the superstitious programmes being telecast on them in the name of religion. They are a very biased people. The guy who was roughed up said inflammatory and degrading things about Sikhi. These type of people don't understand the sweet tounge but only a hard stick in their <admin-profanity filter activated>. If you have freedom of speech it does not mean you can say bad things about people in the name of reason.

Raju, personally i would like to kiss your sister in front of you and then see how you reason it out with me. For Sikhs, Sikhi=Guru=Mother, father, sister, flesh and blood. OK.

[JHUJAARROO]

what's your point J.

the Lions are being poached by neighbouring jungals ?

apne, you have said a lot of things.

But firstly you have accused me of being a 'hindutva ideologist'.

To all those in this forum who think I am a 'hindutva ideologist' and thus worthy of derision and contempt, I have suggested one uniform solution. Please consider me a 'hindutva ideologue' for all intents and purposes.

To all the haters I desire to be what they hate most.

In your eyes the hindus are weaklings of the highest order .. so that is what I want to be.

I don't want to be associated with the strong .. I desire to be associated with the weak.

Coming back to topic.

The reason I bought up this topic was with a specific purpose.

During a discussion on NDTV after the Dera Sacha Sauda issue had flared up there was a particular Sikh gentleman on the panel who disagreed with the rest of the participants who behaved like a mob. he was a mona and not with full swaroop.

Now after the show was over, a few of the participants went over and roughed him up.

At that time, I felt that this was more akin to wahabbi/talibanic behaviour or suppressing all dissent with force. Rather than the behaviour of a self-confident and self-assured group of people though harbouring a genuine grievance.

han insecurity sanu feel udon hoi c jadon bahmana dia chotian cutke glan vichon janeo

lahke ohna di sunat karke ohna dia dhia naal blatkar karke muslman bna lainde c

han udon sade satgur ne shhadat diti

per ih log akritghan bhul gae sab

[Raju]

The guy who was roughed up said inflammatory and degrading things about Sikhi. These type of people don't understand the sweet tounge but only a hard stick in their <admin-profanity filter activated>. If you have freedom of speech it does not mean you can say bad things about people in the name of reason.

the reason why I cited his case particularly was because he was a 70-yr old man, if not older.

I thought there were better ways to reason with such an old man rather than roughing him up. Probably our culture is different in that respect.

Do you watch American television ? So many people say so many things about Jesus .. he is routinely made fun of and Jews talk dirty about Christians in private and their Rabbis mock Christ all the time and use extremely vulgar language about him. In fact you can see Jewish comedians make fun of Jesus left, right and centre. Yet does it matter much to Christians.

And apne, your kissing my sister would hardly evoke any emotion from me. At the most I would think you are trying to flirt. But I guess what you meant was what my reaction would be if my sister's modesty was outraged etc. Didn't Guru Gobind Singh say 'chidiya te naal baaz ladaawa' (I shall make the meek sparrow fight the hawk), yet here everyone is fighting the meek and trying to be like the baaz. Everybody hates the meek hindu but secretly admires the 'macho' crud taliban (there are even Punjabi songs by Gurdas Mann saying he wants to be like taliban).

Just reverse the role of the old Mughal today and you get the Mughal wannabes.

Nobody wants to fight the just and right war. Everybody just wants to take the easy way out and side with the strong. Especially younger generation.

and apne you have reached my sister, when are my mother and father going to make an appearance in your posts. :gg: :lol:

han insecurity sanu feel udon hoi c jadon bahmana dia chotian cutke glan vichon janeo

lahke ohna di sunat karke ohna dia dhia naal blatkar karke muslman bna lainde c

han udon sade satgur ne shhadat diti

per ih log akritghan bhul gae sab

J,

why do you give so drastic examples. the sky hasn't fallen down on our heads.

peace

[JHUJAARROO]

J,

why do you give so drastic examples. the sky hasn't fallen down on our heads.

peace

nothing happened to you

tuhanu ki asar je tuhadi maa bahan di koi beijati kare

tuhadi ijat naal khele farak tan sanu painda

tusi hai hi isi miti de bne hoe

tuhadi anakh hi mar gi hai

hun ki kar sakde aa

tusi 20 sadi de mahan sikh bare galat galan kahian

ihi tan tuhadi frustration hai

tusi usnu marke v mar nahi sake

oh ajj vi sare sikhan de dilan vich jionda hai

[Raju]

nothing happened to you

tuhanu ki asar je tuhadi maa bahan di koi beijati kare

tuhadi ijat naal khele farak tan sanu painda

tusi hai hi isi miti de bne hoe

tuhadi anakh hi mar gi hai

hun ki kar sakde aa

Firstly respect every human. This makes us worthy in the eyes of the Lord.

War is somewhat like an internet argument. If you lost patience, then both can be lost.

brave warrriors never lose their patience.

do not mistake patience for cowardice.

no offence

& have a good day

bye