Sukhmani Sahib

[parmjit62 0]

wahe guru ji ka khalsa-wahe guru ji ki fateh

I have read that when Guru Arjun dev was writting sukhmani sahib it had sto[ped in the middle and it is said that guru ji went to Baba sri chand ji and urged and then with his blessing the bani stated again.

Is this true or not please let me know

[MokhamSingh 726]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

I have heard in Katha and read in some books that Guru Ji requested Sri Chand to compose Gurbani. SC Ji just altered the siharia in the Salok of seventeenth Ashtpadhee. Guru Ji's reason was to show respect to the son of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharajh.

Guru Ji would never suffer from writer's block it was just a symbol of respect.

Sri Guru Ramdas Ji Maharajh said to SC that their long beard was for dusting the charan of Mahapursh such as yourself. Again it must be understood that it takes a mighty person to show such nimrtah (humble).

Some Sikhs will strongly disagree with the above but it all boils down to personal sharda.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

[KSINGHPHG 1]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

I have heard in Katha and read in some books that Guru Ji requested Sri Chand to compose Gurbani. SC Ji just altered the siharia in the Salok of seventeenth Ashtpadhee. Guru Ji's reason was to show respect to the son of Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji Maharajh.

Guru Ji would never suffer from writer's block it was just a symbol of respect.

Sri Guru Ramdas Ji Maharajh said to SC that their long beard was for dusting the charan of Mahapursh such as yourself. Again it must be understood that it takes a mighty person to show such nimrtah (humble).

Some Sikhs will strongly disagree with the above but it all boils down to personal sharda.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫਤਹਿ

[Guest shastr]

sukhmani sahib didnt stop, its dhur ki bani, nobody can stop it. but maharaj was writing sri sukhmani sahib, and they completed 16 astpadis. and at that time, baba sri chand ji came to meet maharaj at amritsar. it was the nimarta of maharaj that they asked baba sri chand ji to uchaar bani and they would have it added in sri sukhmani sahib. as maharaj said that this would be an honor since baba ji is the son of dhan dhan guru nanak dev ji maharaj, whos gaddi had been passed down onto guru arjun dev ji maharaj. and at that time baba sri chand ji said no no, they cannot add bani as they are not guru, and they do not have authority, these bachans show the nimarta of dhan dhan baba sri chand ji as well. but upon guru ji asking again, baba ji said to put pita ji's pankti's from mool mantar as the salok. and thats why, the 17th salok of sri sukhmani sahib is from mool mantar, but since maharaj had written it in jap ji sahib, guru arjun dev ji changed the bihaari into a sihaari, cuz in gurbani, and guru granth sahib ji, the same 2 panktis never repeat. if bani does repeat, there is always something changed about it. and this was to show respect of maharaj guru nanak dev ji.

but yea, sukhmani sahib has kirpa of both guru arjun dev ji and baba sri chand ji. some frown at the name of baba ji, or think that baba ji has no shakti or something, but this is guru nanak dev ji maharaj's saputar we are talking about here. its a very very big deal to be born into the house of maharaj guru nanak dev ji. so baba ji needs to be given utmost respect.

[K. SINGH DEEP 15]

sukhmani sahib didnt stop, its dhur ki bani, nobody can stop it. but maharaj was writing sri sukhmani sahib, and they completed 16 astpadis. and at that time, baba sri chand ji came to meet maharaj at amritsar. it was the nimarta of maharaj that they asked baba sri chand ji to uchaar bani and they would have it added in sri sukhmani sahib. as maharaj said that this would be an honor since baba ji is the son of dhan dhan guru nanak dev ji maharaj, whos gaddi had been passed down onto guru arjun dev ji maharaj. and at that time baba sri chand ji said no no, they cannot add bani as they are not guru, and they do not have authority, these bachans show the nimarta of dhan dhan baba sri chand ji as well. but upon guru ji asking again, baba ji said to put pita ji's pankti's from mool mantar as the salok. and thats why, the 17th salok of sri sukhmani sahib is from mool mantar, but since maharaj had written it in jap ji sahib, guru arjun dev ji changed the bihaari into a sihaari, cuz in gurbani, and guru granth sahib ji, the same 2 panktis never repeat. if bani does repeat, there is always something changed about it. and this was to show respect of maharaj guru nanak dev ji.

but yea, sukhmani sahib has kirpa of both guru arjun dev ji and baba sri chand ji. some frown at the name of baba ji, or think that baba ji has no shakti or something, but this is guru nanak dev ji maharaj's saputar we are talking about here. its a very very big deal to be born into the house of maharaj guru nanak dev ji. so baba ji needs to be given utmost respect.

Please quote source of Saakhi.

[Guest shastr]

the source is katha sukhmani sahib done by giani thakur singh ji. its the longer version of sukhmani sahib katha with 72 or 73 files.

[K. SINGH DEEP 15]

If there is documentary proof in Sikh literature about this SAKHI.

If so please quote. I do not rely upon Kathha done by any so called

Sants or So called Mahapurashs because afterall they are also SIKHS

and Gurbani says :-

"Bhullan ander sabh ko , abhull Guru Kartaar"

Moreover there are so many told stories by so called Sants or So

called Mahapurashs which have no authentic historical proof.

Please never think that I do not respect TAKSAAL or Taksaal related

Legend Gursikhs. I have very close and familiar relations with so many

Taksaal Kathhawachaks and Taksaal, duiring my stay of 2.5 years at

SRIHARGOBINDPUR which is just 20 Km. from CHOWK MEHTA and I

have enjoyed that stay and visited Taksaal so many times and

has been discussing with Gursikhs and gained knowlrdge on so

many aspects about SIKHI.

Bhul chuk khima,

Waheguru ji ka Khansa Waheguru ji kiFateh

[Guest shastr]

i can tell from ur post, u have not gained much knowledge about sikhi if thats the view u have about sants and mahapurshs. "oh they are also sikhs".

u quote gurbani pankti's but gurbani also says "sant raam hai eako" sant's and mahapurshs are one the same level as the lord.

gurbani also says "meri bhandi bhagat chudavai, bandai bhagat and chotai mohe". meaning wat god does, the bhagats can change, but wat the bhagats do, not even maharaj can change that. why? because gobind pao bhagat da pukha. maharaj is ageyakaari of the saints and mahapurshs. so no, they are not only sikhs, but they are saints, they are brahmgianis. and in gurbani, it says many many times, that maharaj and his saints have no differnce. in gurbani many times, it says saints are the heights beings of all.

maybe you should listen to katha and try to learn something about saints and learn wat gurbani says about bhagats and saints, instead of trying to figure it out for urself?

oh and if ur asking about proof written in proof so that you can belive something, then im sorry, there is no such thing when it comes to this situtaion. brahmgiani's tell this sakhi in katha, but u have not heard that. and if you dont believe it, then im sorry, thats ur personal choice. wat the saints say, thats wat matters. wat the saints do, thats wat counts. the saints bachans are wat matters, not our own personal thinking. as this is wat is written in gurbani.

sorry if that sounded rude or something, uneducated people like myself dont know any better.

[K. SINGH DEEP 15]

My dear brother,

I just asked you the historical truth but you are just relying upon a kathhawachak

and have written an essay an SANT and MAHAPURASH. I can also write like that but

my true Guru (Guru GRANTH Sahib ji ) do not allow me to make unnecessary debate

over any topic and tells us :-

"Bed parhehe aru baad vakhaanehe , Ahela janam gavaavahe."

But my true GURU also tells me the definition of SANT and MAHAPURAKH :-

"Hamro bharta bado bibeki aape SANT kahaavehe."

and

"Es jag meh ek purakh he hor sagli naar sabaaee."

and

"Har jesa purakh na labhaee , sabh dekhyea jagat mai tole."

Here Gurbaani or Shabad Guru ,is teaching us that our bharta mean AKAAL PURAKH

or SATGURU himself is the SANT.

There is only one PURAKH in world and that is Akaal Purakh or SATGURU and remaing

all are females (mean souls ).

There is no PURAKH like HAR (AKAAL PURAKH) or SATGURU in this world.And if there is no

purakh, question does not arise about MAHAPURAKH.

My dear brother when Gurbaani says that there is no PURAKH , then how a fool like me

can believe that some human being other than SATGURU can be called as SANT OR

MAHAPURAKH.

For your kind information SANT or MAHAPURAKH like words or adjectives

have never been used for great Gursikhs during life time of 10 GURU SAHIBAN (who have

been teaching the gurmat through Gurbani) like BHAEE LEHNA JI ( who became later on

GURU ANGAD DEV JI) , BABA BUDDHA JI,BABA AJITTA (randhawa )JI, Bhai Jetha ji (who

became later on GURU RAAM DASS JI )BHAI GURDAS JI, BHAI BIDHI CHAND JI, BHAI

MANJH JI, BHAI SALO JI, BHAI MATI DAS JI,BHAI DAYALA JI, ALL PUNJ PYARE,BHAI SANGAT

SINGH JI, BHAI MANI SINGH JI, BABADEEP SINGH JI and so many such GURSIKHS whose

list can never end.

When during life time of Guru sahibaan SANT or MAHAPURAKH words have not been used for

any Gursikh ; what is the necessity or cumpulsion now to use these words for our spritual

preachers or legend Gursikhs( who are kathhani karani de poore).We must call them as

"BHAI SAHIB JI " or BABA JI ( If he is old aged ).

My dear brother what ever i am telling, is based upon study of Gurbani ( continuous sehaj pathh

since last 27 years) after having obtained Santhya from the Gursikhs at Nathalpur and also from

Baba Ajit Singh ji Nathalpur wale who was very much respected by GYANI Gurbachan Singh

ji BHINDRAWALE, Gyani KARTAR Singh ji BHINDRAWALE, AND Gyani JARNAIL Singh ji BHINDRAWALE.

GYANI (SANT ) JARNAIL Singh ji BHINDRAWALE immeditely after taking over as jathedar of DAMDAMI TAKSAAL visited Nathalpur to take blessings of BABA AJIT SINGH ji Nathalpur wale who asked GYANI

(SANT ) JARNAIL Singh ji BHINDRAWALE " aa baee Gyania ,ban gaye Jathedaar Taksaal da. Dekhi kade

sant na akhvaaee apne aap nu te sadaa ek nimaana SIKH ban ke raheen." And I have so many

witnesses of this incident.

Please forgive me if I am wrong and accept if you find it right in light of Gurbani.

Bhul chuk Khima,

Waheguru ji ka Khalsa Waheguru ji ki Fateh.

[Guest shastr]

so in other words, ur alergic with the word sant, or mahapursh. and dont try that sweet talk on me dear brother, ur not as smart as you think.

gurbani says there are sants, but you say there are no sants. so why does gurbani use the word sant over and over again??

true guru says to follow the sants, but you say there are no sants, then who do we follow??

true guru says to wash the feet of sants, but you say there are no sants, then tell me whos feet we wash?

true guru says to pakha sewa to the sants, but you say there are no sants, then who we do pakha sewa to??

gurbani says follow the jeevan of the sants, but you say there are no sants, then who do we folllow??

wat does this line here mean?

sMqw sMgiq imil rhY jip rwm nwmu suKu pwie

wat does this shabad mean?

soriT mhlw 5 ]

hm sMqn kI rynu ipAwry hm sMqn kI srxw ]

sMq hmwrI Et sqwxI sMq hmwrw ghxw ]1]

hm sMqn isau bix AweI ]

pUrib iliKAw pweI ]

iehu mnu qyrw BweI ] rhwau ]

sMqn isau myrI lyvw dyvI sMqn isau ibauhwrw ]

sMqn isau hm lwhw KwitAw hir Bgiq Bry BMfwrw ]2]

sMqn mo kau pUMjI saupI qau auqirAw mn kw DoKw ]

Drm rwie Ab khw krYgo jau PwitE sglo lyKw ]3]

mhw Anµd Bey suKu pwieAw sMqn kY prswdy ]

khu nwnk hir isau mnu mwinAw rMig rqy ibsmwdy ]4]8]19]

and wat does this pankti mean?

sMq kw inMdku prmysuir mwrw

and wat does this pankti mean?

sMq jnw imil pweIAY rsnw nwmu Bxw

and wat does this pankti mean since akal purkh is the only sant?

sMq shweI rwm ky kir ikrpw dIAw imlwie

if nobody is a sant, wat does this pankti mean?

iqau sMq jnw kI nr inMdw krih hir rwKY pYj jn kyrI

if there are no sants, wat does this mean?

Awvhu sMqhu imil nwmu jpwhw

there are thousands of panktis in gurbani that talk about sants. why does maharaj use the word sant if there were no sants?

[MokhamSingh 726]

As well as hearing this sakhi in Katha , I also read the same in pothi number three Sampradahi steek of SGGS Ji Maharajh by Gyani Kirpal Singh.

[K. SINGH DEEP 15]

SATGURU is SANT and SATGURU KI SANGAT is Sant.

Let us do Satguru DI SEVA ,SANGAT di seva ,SANGAT de charan dhona,

SANGAT vich vichardian uchian suchian roohan de jeevan nu follow karna,

Satguru de jeevan nu follow karna, Satguru de shabad roopi hukam nu

mun ke ous nu jeevan vich apnaaona, GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI de sikh banna

na ke kise dere or institution de sikh . But we must RESPECT ALL THE sikhs ,

Gursikhs and institutions who are spreading the message of GURU GRANTH SAHEB JI

ratherwe must encourage such Institutions and Gursikhs by tano mano dhano.

Please let us not stick to any version or mis conception and if some GURMAT based

things come across our way, we should amend our version and that will improve

our life style and this IS the only way of SIKHI da PARCHAAR that we implement

the things first upon ourselves and than we need not to tell others.

BHUL CHUK KHIMA

waheguru ji ka khalsa waheguru ji ki fateh

[Guest shastr]

satbachan ji satbachan

[mohinder pal 118]

Hello K.SIngh Deep Ji,

Please donot be Katarwadi(Sharia-Wadi). Without Sant(Puran and Gurmukh), Gurbani's Real Menaing cannot be understood. Even Sant Singh Ji Maskeen said in one of his Katha that Even though He had learnt the meanings of the SGGS from various sources but He was not able to get that Real Taste(Amrit Ras) which is stated in Anand Sahib(Anand Bheya Meri Maye, Satguru me Paeya). That means Even though He was one of important Katha Vachak in Sikh History and Title of SANT was given but still He was not Puran Sant.

WHen baby is born, Parents teach him/her about the sorroundings, Enviornment,. Bad and Good, Education, Knowledge. He/She is not born with all that knowledge. SImilarly, We cannot understand SGGSji simply by reading daily and not following its path(Lack of Meaning Knowledge.

Even Bhagat Prahlad Realized God only because he recieved Gur Mantar and Methodology of Naam Jap from NARAD(Sant). Papan Ganika realized god when Sant gave her Parrot. Bhagat Ravidas ji Realized God when he recieved blessing from Guru Ramanand ji. Bhagat Trilochan is Realized God when He got Sangat of Bhagat Kabir Ji.

Please read Bhagat Mala, Then You'll realize that without Proper Sant, Guru, Mahapurash, God cannot be realized. They Know the God's Path, they have those eyes to see. THey make the path easy to realize.

[K. SINGH DEEP 15]

Sikhs learn NAAM JAP from PUNJ PEYARE during AMRIT SANCHAR and

Nam ,Gurmantar,Deekheya and Rehat is taught by Punj Pyare in the

presence of GURU GRANTH SAHEB JI. No body SINGLY is authorised

by GURU GOBIND SINGH JI for NAAM DAN,giving GURMANTAR and

methodology of NAAM JAP and no body should dare to do so like

NARAD ji /Swami Ramanand ji or BHAGAT RAVIDAS JI or BHAGAT KABIR JI

At present time only PANJ PYARE ARE are authorised to do so after

PIOUS HUKAM of Guru Gobind Singh ji on 1699 VISAKHI.

People who do not understand the reality and stick to SANT and

MAHAPURAKH like adjectives are actualy encouraging the GURU DOKHIS

(in unknowing way) to use such words with their name too and in this

process we are facing BHANYAREWALA, GURMITA (RAM RAHIM) NOORMEHALIYA

etc.

GURU PYARYO , GURU EK HAI DHAN SRI GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI.

SANT PUNJ hein (Punj pyare oh vee GURU ki hazoori vich, MAHAPURAKH

vee EK hi hai te oho hai AKAAL PURAKH:-

" Eh Baani Mahapurakh ki nij ghar vasa hoe."

I am neither alergic nor hateful from any word or explanation but any thing against the

teachings of GURBAANI wich have been taught to me by GURU GRANTH SAHIB JI during

sehaj paathhs in last 27 years are undigestable to me for which Iam sorry.

Now Iwill not submit any reply on this topic.

BHUL CHUK KHIMA.

waheguru ji ka khalsa WAHEGURU JI KI FATEH