Misl'S

[Not2Cool2Argue]

A (hopefully non-corrupitable) solution: We could have area misls or misl like groups in each area. For example in California its always like the Fremont Sangat or the Fresno sangat. or it could be gurudwara based

like the coventry gurudwara ppl. it doesn't have to be official, but usually ppl from same area/ same gurudwara hang out 2gther and know one another. So it could be an unofficial misl thing. And the ppl who are most involved could be the unofficial leaders. Like the fremont gatka teacher. And other area groups could be like pass on info to fremont sangat via the gatka teacher.

[gurdssingh]

I have no idea, my friend. I always thought the likes of Hari Singh Nalua and Jassa Singh Ramgharia were heroes and straight-up guys amongst Sikhs in those days.

The aforementioned WERE misl leaders, weren't they?

Hari Singh Nalwa was not a misl sardar, he was a great general of Maharaja Ranjit Singh's Sarkar-e-Khalsa / Lahore Darbar. Jassa Singh Ramgharia was a misl sardar. I have posted this before but just a quick history. He was a tarkhan and hence tarkhans and other artisans class themselves as ramgharia. Ramghaira refers to Jassa Singh Ramgharias residence in Amritsar. His fort was known a Ram Ghar hence he was known as Ramgharia. Jassa Singh was a great Misl Sardar. Ramgarhia bungas are at sachkand Sri Harmandir Sahib to this day.

Another great was Kapur Singh later known as Nawab Kapur Singh after being granted a jagir form the Punjab Sarkar (Mughals) leader of the Misls and suceeded by his adopted son Jassa Singh Aulhwalia the next leader of all the misls. Also Aulhwalia's use the name Aulhwalia as they were Kalal's (brewers), as they were from same baradhari they adopted the surname Aulhwalia, refers to Jassa Singh's native village 'Aulh'. All in all there were 12 or some don't class one so 11 misls. They were Sikhs, but it wasn't about just Sikhi to some as they also wanted to amase fortunes and did corrupt things, i.e money, women, intoxicants.

yea i thort that too, remember some misl leaders even sided with musalmaans wen it came to maharaja ranjit singh (if im wrong bowt this, then im sorry).

Kop Singh mussalmans were part of the Khalsa army. Even in Guru Hargobind Rai Jis army there were muslims. One famous story is of Painda Khan, he was a pathan mercenary who fought alomg side Guru ji but then did the dirty on him and switched forces to get more money from mughals, he was slian by guru ji. But loads of muslims have fought along side Khalsa army.

Maharaja Ranjit Singh's army was known as Khalsa Army but as Sikhs were small minority in Punjab, it had many Hindu and Muslim soldiers. Who were very loyal. Muslims occupied gret posts in the darbar like foreign minister Fakir Azizuddin very great loyal family (brother included), unlike dogras. also general of the rtillery was muslim, as was much of this regiment. You have to remember majority of punjab was muslim. As if you look at sanjha punjab it is more muslims than Sikhs and hindus combined. Off top of my head only misl who have history of siding with the enemy i.e. Afghan invaders were the Phulkian misl. I.e ancestors of Captian Amrinder singh of Patiala. (From Ala Singhs Pati comes the term Patiala). Any way there is bachan form Satguru Hargodind Rai Ji that the ancestors of Phul would rule mass areas which they did. Unfortunetly they were against Sikhs on occasions like SahibSingh of Patiala etc. Just read a few books on the period and you will get good knowldege. Not all muslims were bad, they fought Sikh cause. Not all Sikhs were good, they went against Sikh cause to fill their pockets.

[Guest KopSingh]

Kop Singh mussalmans were part of the Khalsa army. Even in Guru Hargobind Rai Jis army there were muslims. One famous story is of Painda Khan, he was a pathan mercenary who fought alomg side Guru ji but then did the dirty on him and switched forces to get more money from mughals, he was slian by guru ji. But loads of muslims have fought along side Khalsa army.

Maharaja Ranjit Singh's army was known as Khalsa Army but as Sikhs were small minority in Punjab, it had many Hindu and Muslim soldiers. Who were very loyal. Muslims occupied gret posts in the darbar like foreign minister Fakir Azizuddin very great loyal family (brother included), unlike dogras. also general of the rtillery was muslim, as was much of this regiment. You have to remember majority of punjab was muslim. As if you look at sanjha punjab it is more muslims than Sikhs and hindus combined. Off top of my head only misl who have history of siding with the enemy i.e. Afghan invaders were the Phulkian misl. I.e ancestors of Captian Amrinder singh of Patiala. (From Ala Singhs Pati comes the term Patiala). Any way there is bachan form Satguru Hargodind Rai Ji that the ancestors of Phul would rule mass areas which they did. Unfortunetly they were against Sikhs on occasions like SahibSingh of Patiala etc. Just read a few books on the period and you will get good knowldege. Not all muslims were bad, they fought Sikh cause. Not all Sikhs were good, they went against Sikh cause to fill their pockets.

y r u tellin me bowt how all muslims r not bad, muslim population of panjab, n how muslims helped r gurus like im dumb u mug? i do know that, i never said muslims were treacherous or bad etc

all i said was i remember hearing durin the misl period to maharaja ranjit singh time, there was some sikh misl leader(s) who didnt want ranjit singh to necessarily rule, so some of them sided with outside occupiyers, who are muslim! gods sakes, like u sed in your post it was phulkian misl, i dont kno if its them, if it is, then thats all i was talkin bowt.

[BA51NGH]

Guys the proble is could you agree onn the colour of <banned word filter activated> - no

one will say brown the otehr yellow another goldy .. once theres a divide its hard for it to be over looked ....

i like the idea!!! but is it workable ...

my opinion no -

Having one big jatha bandi is the same thing having small - what makes them powerful is people - people listened to the misls back then they dont care what is said today from the akal thakat ... we on here generally agree that langer should be eaten on the floor in the gurugar but i could list you of a 100+ that still have chairs etc

the simple point is we cant agree - if i say im gonna punish arminder for visiting the dera <banned word filter activated> the badals on my side ahowever if im gonna punish badal - badal will go make his own group . Im afraid to say most SIKHS look out for number one ....

People will simply question what gives him the right to punish me ... if were saying democracy - lagest family with greatset support will win not the person who should be ....

[DalbirSingh]

The misl sardars were small kings or monarchs setup with small warrior groups, main thing they did was overthrow the moghuls when they had internal disputes and started attack their own people, abducting women, the police went mad, kings went psychopath people had to overthrow them. The main thing todays organisation do is just pay the bills the electricity gas and maintenance bills.

In the official world we have democracies many of the kings had there own family members if you look at how huge some families are you think why they are not together for the good of the whole community some issues are huge to tackle. All about sorting out our own homes to co-operate in bigger groups for issues in a wedding we can crowd up huge halls and gurdwaras but in a normal thing it's hard to get a hold of a few people to sort out somebody.

Like a fight get the brothers and cousins all the family down for a thing. Even sorting out family disputes in the family before they make it to court etc. Before you rule you got to rule your mind first people are prisoners of thought to open the mind huge. Commitees and government are usually to sort things out we could do it ourselves instead of relying on other people. So we can govern ourselves and not be governed by others it means we stand up and take responsibilities for our own actions, clean up our own mess, fix things more then anything being independent.

Even nations have to do trades with other nations for economy we can't blame others for being ripped off if we are gullible got to do fair trades. In punjab the illiteracy issue is something we need to sort out. No one will fix anything we got to stand up and do everything ourselves even in Sikhi learning gianis are messing up parchar we have to fix it ourself do the parchar, learn the punjab do the kirtan and run the gurdwaras ourselves, get people married and so forth, instead of running away to other people like the secular government, when the government has problems they don't run to other people they fix it themselves.

Just like the Misls used to until they had problems when they started to seek help from others they became the slaves of others that is how the british took us over and then with indian independence for our own problems we went to central government and that's how we got attacked. We could have done all the anadpur resolution ourself internally instead of asking the central government for it which led to 1984 loads of people say we shouldn't ask for the sikh nation we are the sikh nation we only need recognise our own freedom and express it. As for corrupt politicians we have always sorted them out ourselves in our history we can't we now? The babas have always been there it is not about them but why people ran away from panthic gurdwaras what is all the mess up in panthic gurdwara politics the bribes, laundry, dishonesty so forth? In todays world everyone has to be independent and stand on their own two feet helping others when they can.

[VanHelsingh]

Hari Singh Nalwa was not a misl sardar, he was a great general of Maharaja Ranjit Singh's Sarkar-e-Khalsa / Lahore Darbar. Jassa Singh Ramgharia was a misl sardar. I have posted this before but just a quick history. He was a tarkhan and hence tarkhans and other artisans class themselves as ramgharia. Ramghaira refers to Jassa Singh Ramgharias residence in Amritsar. His fort was known a Ram Ghar hence he was known as Ramgharia. Jassa Singh was a great Misl Sardar. Ramgarhia bungas are at sachkand Sri Harmandir Sahib to this day.

Another great was Kapur Singh later known as Nawab Kapur Singh after being granted a jagir form the Punjab Sarkar (Mughals) leader of the Misls and suceeded by his adopted son Jassa Singh Aulhwalia the next leader of all the misls. Also Aulhwalia's use the name Aulhwalia as they were Kalal's (brewers), as they were from same baradhari they adopted the surname Aulhwalia, refers to Jassa Singh's native village 'Aulh'. All in all there were 12 or some don't class one so 11 misls. They were Sikhs, but it wasn't about just Sikhi to some as they also wanted to amase fortunes and did corrupt things, i.e money, women, intoxicants.

Thanks for the history lesson. :biggrin2:

[gurdssingh]

y r u tellin me bowt how all muslims r not bad, muslim population of panjab, n how muslims helped r gurus like im dumb u mug? i do know that, i never said muslims were treacherous or bad etc

all i said was i remember hearing durin the misl period to maharaja ranjit singh time, there was some sikh misl leader(s) who didnt want ranjit singh to necessarily rule, so some of them sided with outside occupiyers, who are muslim! gods sakes, like u sed in your post it was phulkian misl, i dont kno if its them, if it is, then thats all i was talkin bowt.

Ummh I think you have taken my post the wrong way, why do you tend to come across as obnoxious in some of your posts?

They didn't want Ranjit Singh to rule as he was also a misl sardar and annexed their territories.

EDIT

Also i don't know of misl leaders collabarating with muslims to prevent Maharaja Ranjit Singh expanding his empire. The misl sardars esp. from malwa area did with the British though.

[Guest KopSingh]

Ummh I think you have taken my post the wrong way, why do you tend to come across as obnoxious in some of your posts?

They didn't want Ranjit Singh to rule as he was also a misl sardar and annexed their territories.

so y waffle on about how guru hargobind had muslim fighting with him? unrelated stuff, we r talkin bowt misls

[gurdssingh]

yea i thort that too, remember some misl leaders even sided with musalmaans wen it came to maharaja ranjit singh (if im wrong bowt this, then im sorry).

so y waffle on about how guru hargobind had muslim fighting with him? unrelated stuff, we r talkin bowt misls

You quoted me when you replied. So just relating to your qoute in bold.'even sided with musalmaans'. I was just putting into context that muslims fighting with Sikhs is nothing new or bad. .

.