modern 3HO meditation

[N30S1NGH]

yeah off course i didn't meant dancing to non gurbani lyrics...i think the above video whats invoking movements in the video above, its feeling inside of gurbani sprouting out in movement. It's perfectably fine to express your emotions driven by gurbani that way as long sri guru granth sahib sargun saroop is not present because in maharaj's hazoori we must present ourselves in sehaj.

[Singh559]

Dude i have nothing against them. I will join with their trance in samagams but as long as they are not doing infront of sri guru granth sahib ji..with sri guru granth sahib ji sargun saroop hazar nazaar one must present themselves as sehaj be it if they are totally attuned to kirtan/katha/simran. Sehaj is paramount in maharaj's darbar...!!

I've been to a few Akhand Kirtani Jatha samagams and there is no excessive movement or "hyperventilation" like you have said. They were actually beautiful with GurSikhs reciting Gurbani from Guru Granth Sahib Ji and Dasam Granth Sahib Ji.

Don't you think there are bad applies in all jathas? That guy who gave out university brahmgyaan degrees is the one who tried to hijack the jatha if i'm not sure and supported excessive movement but AKJ doesn't condone it.

If I wanted to I could list bad things from all jathas, but what's the point?

Also - for the Gurbani tuk you posted about dancing it'd be good to see what Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale's katha says. I'm sure you'll find Sant Ji saying it doesn't condone actually doing bhangra.

Another thing, I agree Gurbani should be recited in Raag, but do you have a knowledge of Raag kirtan? Do you perform it? I personally feel I have no right to say this style of kirtan is right or wrong unless I personally do kirtan with a Gurmat instrument in proper Raag.

Again, like i've said before, I'm not from any jatha I just feel you were being slightly unfair.

[N30S1NGH]

The gurbani tukh i posted singh its within in context of one movement driven by gurbani not bhangra..now you are blowing out of proparotion.

Just so everyone is clear..please read this disclaimer-

i have nothing against akj trance simran nor i have any against 3ho hippy style trance singing of gurbani as long as there is - sri guru granth sahib ji sargun saroop is not present because we must present ourselves in sehaj infront of guru sahib.

Now that i made my self clear:

Gurbani tuk i posted was contextualizing with attitude- don't be so hard on yourself in gurmat- above video does not do any harm to anyone, their emotions are driven out/sprouting out by gurbani..they meant no harm to anyone but just enjoying themselves with just drop of anand from gurbani...we should leave it at that. .!!

[Consciousness]

I've been to a few Akhand Kirtani Jatha samagams and there is no excessive movement or "hyperventilation" like you have said. They were actually beautiful with GurSikhs reciting Gurbani from Guru Granth Sahib Ji and Dasam Granth Sahib Ji.

Don't you think there are bad applies in all jathas? That guy who gave out university brahmgyaan degrees is the one who tried to hijack the jatha if i'm not sure and supported excessive movement but AKJ doesn't condone it.

If I wanted to I could list bad things from all jathas, but what's the point?

Also - for the Gurbani tuk you posted about dancing it'd be good to see what Sant Gurbachan Singh Bhindranwale's katha says. I'm sure you'll find Sant Ji saying it doesn't condone actually doing bhangra.

Another thing, I agree Gurbani should be recited in Raag, but do you have a knowledge of Raag kirtan? Do you perform it? I personally feel I have no right to say this style of kirtan is right or wrong unless I personally do kirtan with a Gurmat instrument in proper Raag.

Again, like i've said before, I'm not from any jatha I just feel you were being slightly unfair.

Veer Ji you right in what you say but how come you never comment in support of 3ho whenever they are attacked by other users. Not all of them are bad..??

Kirtan should be done ONLY in raag because otherwise it is paap. Similar to correct pronunciation of santhia and without this knowledge you are hurting your guru ji by doing inappropriate pronunciation however in this case inappropriate non raag of kirtan. Do we want to be bemukh in front of our Guru?

So in the mean time if one does not have gian of raag or santhia it is best to listen to audios where the correct version is done.

Daas

Consiousness

[MrDoaba]

Lets all calm down and listen to some fine Raag Kirtan! I promise its Raag! :D

http://www.sikhsangeet.com/albumid791-Dr-Gurnam-Singh-%28Punjabi-University-Patiala%29-Gur-Shabad-Kirtan-%2862-Ragas%29.html

/\ /\ /\ Absolutely briliant!

http://www.sikhsange...ingh-Anhad.html

http://www.sikhsange...ljit-Singh.html

http://www.sikhsange...-Amritsar).html

[Singh559]

The gurbani tukh i posted singh its within in context of one movement driven by gurbani not bhangra..now you are blowing out of proparotion.

Just so everyone is clear..please read this disclaimer-

i have nothing against akj trance simran nor i have any against 3ho hippy style trance singing of gurbani as long as there is - sri guru granth sahib ji sargun saroop is not present because we must present ourselves in sehaj infront of guru sahib.

Now that i made my self clear:

Gurbani tuk i posted was contextualizing with attitude- don't be so hard on yourself in gurmat- above video does not do any harm to anyone, their emotions are driven out/sprouting out by gurbani..they meant no harm to anyone but just enjoying themselves with just drop of anand from gurbani...we should leave it at that. .!!

The Gurbani Tuk doesn't mention dancing though. According to Gurbani, laughing, playing, dressing and eating he is liberated. It doesn't say by dancing you are liberated. By listening to Gurbani we do get bliss and our mind dances, but it doesn't mean we physically dance to create temporary worldly endorphin that don't allow us to increase in our meditation/simran.

hasa(n)dhiaa khaela(n)dhiaa paina(n)dhiaa khaava(n)dhiaa vichae hovai mukath ||2||

Also, please don't assume things about me and try to paint me as being "too hard" or "too soft", it's a bit patronizing. Let's just stick to the subject please. Another thing, you can perform a search and see all the places where I've defended 3HO and still do.

@Consciousness - I know what you're doing and you've foiled yourself quite well. I will not be replying to any of your posts. :strong:

You reminded me of an old song when I used to listen to Punjabi music. :lol2:

[Consciousness]

The Gurbani Tuk doesn't mention dancing though. According to Gurbani, laughing, playing, dressing and eating he is liberated. It doesn't say by dancing you are liberated. By listening to Gurbani we do get bliss and our mind dances, but it doesn't mean we physically dance to create temporary worldly endorphin that don't allow us to increase in our meditation/simran.

hasa(n)dhiaa khaela(n)dhiaa paina(n)dhiaa khaava(n)dhiaa vichae hovai mukath ||2||

Also, please don't assume things about me and try to paint me as being "too hard" or "too soft", it's a bit patronizing. Let's just stick to the subject please. Another thing, you can perform a search and see all the places where I've defended 3HO and still do.

@Consciousness - I know what you're doing and you've foiled yourself quite well. I will not be replying to any of your posts. :strong:

You reminded me of an old song when I used to listen to Punjabi music. :lol2:

I seriously don't understand what you are on about.. And I'm not going to listen to that manmat panjabi song thank you very much!

[Mehtab Singh]

I am not sure why even mention AKJ?

[N30S1NGH]

Mehtab Singh,

I am all up for equal treatment for all including all jatha's and samparda's and groups. Title of this thread itself is misleading..i hope it was genuine mistake- a) first of all in the video they are not meditating rather singing gurbani jetang from sri dasam granth b) how this thread is presented is almost like- they are doing manmat by singling out 3ho.. on top of it call it modern 3ho meditaton which is bit unfair. I bought akj into this discussion because they do too go mast or engage in this type of trance (just search on youtube there are many videos you will find ...not tarmala guy but actual offical samgams with that kinda of trance) because as human naturally emotions does sprout out every now and then especially one singing gurbani- agam agad bodh. So if there is no uproar there towards them(despite of them doing in hazoori of sri guru granth sahib ji) in the panth there, there shouldn't be equally no upror in panth in regards to this 3ho video where sri guru granth sahib ji is not present.

I think main sticking point in this thread should be as kulbir singh said on gurmat bibek thread that they are not doing this in Hazori of sri guru granth sahib ji which is quite important as in front of maharaj- one should present himself/herself in sehaj. I have read many sakhiyas of some out of control mastane mahapursh acting in sehaj infront of hazoori of sri guru granth sahib ji.

I think even bhai kulbir singh ji from tapoban is against akj practice emotions going out of control and expressed vocally or movements infront of sri guru granth sahib maharaj hazoori.

Coming back to this thread as he mentioned-

There is a thirst for spirituality throughout the world. Before coming to Tatt Gurmat realm of spirituality, the Jeev, many times, has to go through different stages. As long as this dancing and Westernized Rock music kind of spiritual singing is not done at Gurdwara Sahib in the hazoori of Siri Guru Granth Sahib jee, I guess there is no harm in this. The ones who hear Gurbani and are moved by it, will someday be blessed with Tatt Gurmat. Even the ones who eat Degh of Gurughar definitely get Sikhi at some point in the future.

Guru Sahib, Gurmat Bakshan.

Kulbir Singh

I agree with him there totally..not sure about tat gurmat part but don't even what that means but overall i agree with him with his take on this thread..!!

Sorry my last post on this topic..i didn't mean to offend anyone.

[Mehtab Singh]

My only question was why mention any other Jathebandi at all? The title mentions 3HO because it IS 3HO folks indeed, and these guys are the modern Sikhs as they've embraced Sikhi coming from Western backgrounds. Meditation because they seem to be in a trance. I am not sure how the title shows 3HO in negative light.