Why aren't British Sikhs as active/engaged as their Canadian counterparts in politics?

[YOYO29]

3 hours ago, Ranjeet01 said:

If say for example we get another 5 or 6 Sikh MPs and maybe have one MP in the cabinet.

What are we to gain by this?

It's good thing to have your people at powerful positions. This might come in handy someday for Khalistani Sikhs when opportunity arises for Sikh State in Punjab.

[YOYO29]

13 hours ago, TejS said:

Their pride and identity stems from Islam and Islam only. Without it, they have no heritage to be proud of, and I think that is also another reason they double down on it. 

Only glory an average Muslim in South Asia seek through Islam is that he is happy to be born into "only true religion" of the world.

[Ranjeet01]

1 hour ago, YOYO29 said:

It's good thing to have your people at powerful positions. This might come in handy someday for Khalistani Sikhs when opportunity arises for Sikh State in Punjab.

We will see what these powerful Sikhs will do if the opportunity arises.

[Ranjeet01]

3 hours ago, YOYO29 said:

European take pride in pre Christian European history but due to some mysterious reasons we South Asian Muslims are not taught about our pre Islamic past. Historic figures such as King Porus merely get any mention in our text books. We are not taught about Indus Valley civilization or about pre Islamic Indian culture. Since hatred between Hindus and Muslim is so strong we hate everything associated with them. So it would be wrong to say that we don't have any rich pre Islamic past. We have as much claim on pre Islamic civilization of India as Hindus or other people living in India. It's just that we don't care about it and deliberately ignore it due to Hindu Muslim schism. Perhaps if entire India had converted to Islam we might not had this attitude towards pre Islamic Indian civilizations. Just like when entire Europe converted to Christianity. They get to keep their pre Christian heroes. Same thing in Indonesia. If 1/3 of Europe had converted to Christianity and rest of them stayed loyal to natives European religions. European Christians might have same attitude towards their pre Christian past as South Asian Muslims do towards old sub continent civilizations.Since Europeans are all Christians and Indonesians are almost all Muslims and they don't have any of rival group living among them so they don't have to disown their old culture.We South Asian Muslims and Hindus have rivalry or mutual hatred so naturally we would be cautious to own our pre Islamic Indian cultural civilizations.And there may be a factor of assimilation to Hindusim.Had we not insisted so much on our otherness we might have ended up being reabsorbed into Hinduism. Much like how some people on this forum have aversion to anything Sanskrit or old Indian civilization.There everything starts with Sikhi 500 years ago.They are not much interested beyond that.

 

 

 

 

 

You make some good points there. 

When there is no dar-ul-harb to go against maybe the pre-islamic past is more appreciated. 

You don't appreciate what you have until it's gone.

I think Sikhs are interested in pre-Sikh history. It's that we prioritise our more recent history because it has more of a direct impact on us. 

We do appreciate aspects of ancient Indian civilisation but we realise we have something better. 

[TejS]

8 hours ago, YOYO29 said:

Only glory an average Muslim in South Asia seek through Islam is that he is happy to be born into "only true religion" of the world.

Absolutely not, although yes they do view being Muslim as being superior to others. But you have South Asian Muslims that love to claim being descended from Mughals and being the rulers of South Asia. Some will trace their lineage back to Arabs, Persians, Afghans and claim their historical achievements. In fact, I remember a friend telling me that he was descended from an Arabian tribe that would later go on to conquer Andalusia and therefore he prided himself on that. In reality, he was a Pakistani Punjabi Muslim who then got his DNA results back to be only proved wrong and his ancestor's lies to be caught. 

[TejS]

15 hours ago, YOYO29 said:

hmm what kind of tendency do you see in Dalit or other low caste Sikhs in Punjab ? Do they take as much pride in Sikhi as Jutts ? The way i see things,Jutts are at the top of Sikh pecking order in Punjab. Rest of low caste Sikhs are just there to maintain dwindling majority status.What do you say ?

I think the Sikh pecking order is kind of parallel to the Muslim pecking order. The Khatris are like the Arabs from what I've seen with extended family. They are extremely hyprocitical in that they often participate in practices going against Sikhi kind of like how Gulf Arabs are big on affluent and degenerate lifestyles. The Jatts are probably akin to the Turks/Iranians and place their Jatt heritage above Sikhi, and so there's that. Same goes for Rajputs. The rest of the Sikhs tribes are fervently religious like South Asian Muslims. Mazhabi/Dalit Sikhs are often the most strict practicing Sikhs. They don't break rules. Their only source of pride is Sikhi, and I admire them for that. 

[YOYO29]

9 hours ago, TejS said:

Absolutely not, although yes they do view being Muslim as being superior to others. But you have South Asian Muslims that love to claim being descended from Mughals and being the rulers of South Asia. Some will trace their lineage back to Arabs, Persians, Afghans and claim their historical achievements. In fact, I remember a friend telling me that he was descended from an Arabian tribe that would later go on to conquer Andalusia and therefore he prided himself on that. In reality, he was a Pakistani Punjabi Muslim who then got his DNA results back to be only proved wrong and his ancestor's lies to be caught. 

Yes some people do but not all that's why I used 'average' word. All the big castes like Jutts, Raj puts,Gujjars etc don't claim Arab heritage. Some small castes do. And yes there have been migration from Arabia Iran and central Asia so definitely some people can claim their ancestory from them but not all of them. But some Indian I have encountered on Facebook have this habit of picking some random guy or small caste in Pakistan which claims to be from outside South Asia and then made sweeping statements like see these paki deny their Hindu roots. It's not good to Generalize a nation of 200 million on the claims of some small castes who would probably won't make 2 %

[YOYO29]

9 hours ago, TejS said:

think the Sikh pecking order is kind of parallel to the Muslim pecking order

Thanks for at least admitting the truth. Some Indians like to mock far away ethnic groups without looking at their own backyard. I think Indians should be the last people on earth to criticize others for discrimination when they practice worst form of discrimination to their fellow citizens i.e Dalits. Indian should end this holier than thou attitude when they have so much going on in their own home. 

[TejS]

3 hours ago, YOYO29 said:

Yes some people do but not all that's why I used 'average' word. All the big castes like Jutts, Raj puts,Gujjars etc don't claim Arab heritage. Some small castes do. And yes there have been migration from Arabia Iran and central Asia so definitely some people can claim their ancestory from them but not all of them.

This hasn't been my experience. I have Jatt Muslim friends who claim Arab heritage, some even go as far to claim Syed, and Rajput Muslims claiming Afghan. Genetic tests show that Pakistani Muslims have pretty much no foreign ancestry or ancestry that is not found in their non-Muslim counterparts.

I have seen and heard about the fabricated family trees that my Pakistani friends tell me are a source of pride for their families for generations. The truth is that they are fake and false. Even Bulleh Shah, an Arain, ridicules his family for believing that they are Syeds. 

[YOYO29]

24 minutes ago, TejS said:

his hasn't been my experience. I have Jatt Muslim friends who claim Arab heritage, some even go as far to claim Syed, and Rajput Muslims claiming Afghan. Genetic tests show that Pakistani Muslims have pretty much no

Well I haven't met any Jutt who claims Arab ancestry . I live Pakistan and my experience is different from you. In fact I had a Jutt warraich teacher in my high school. In one of his lectures he did mention about his Hindu ancestry. He wasn't ashamed of his Hindu ancestors. None of my friends from other castes claim Arab ancestry. Apart from syed and qureshi castes no one I know who claim Arab ancestry. But yes you're are right about some people fabricating their family trees especially fake syeds. A lot of people have fabricated their family trees to make it look like that they are syeds . As syeds being descendent of Muhammad enjoy a privileged position in society so people changed their caste to syed in 18th or 19th century. Today it is not easy to deceive ppl.