baba gurbachan singhji and bhai randheer singh ji

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

bs never heard it

i'm with singh ji mugadh on this one

[Gupt_Singh]

alot of ppl compare not believing in rag malla to what guru har rais son did in aurangzebs court.

whilst personally im pro rag malla and dont want to get into a debate, i respect people who are anti aswell.

not believing rag malla is different to what guru har rais son did cuz his son PURPOSEFULLY altered gurbani to make himself look better. if its over ragmalla, the person HONESTLY believes its not gurbani for whatever reason, and htey are not doing it for personal gain.....so its totally different.

ragmalla is important cuz its gurbani......but to be honest.....its not such a HUGE HUGE HUGE HUGE deal......it is gurbani yes but it doesnt change any of the fundamentals of sikhi and it doesnt really have an extremely important message as regards to getting mukti like say japji sahib does.......now im not saying its unimportant, im just saying its got a different message.

u wont go to jaam just cuz u dont believe ragmalla if its an honest mistake/or otherwise.........

[Sarbloh Soulja]

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

good post soulja, lol, i think we all need to stop talking about raagmaala, etc

[navjotsingh]

khalsa soulja, ok lets just say were talking about a person here ok, say were talkign about ur dad. Thats like sayig i love all of my dad and i beliave hes all real but not his hands, does that make sense, so it does make a difference. On top of that no one made us incharge of saying wats bani and wats not bani.

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

veer navjot, no raagmalla is not going to make a difference all it taches is raags, i'm not saing i'm for or anti, so i'm not included here..

i believe that if u believe it or not, its not going to efect ur sikhi so plz dont' discuss such matters

[navjotsingh]

How can u say raag malas not a big deal, its bani isnt it. How is this different from anyother bani :T:. You are not the one to decied wat a big deal is and wats not a big deal. It is in the guru granth sahib so you should belive in it, and for the ppl that say its not bani dont you bow down to guru granth sahib? and raag mala is part of it, so you are bowing down to raag mala but dont belive in it or do you say it in ur ardaas i bow down to everything in the guru granth sahib besides raag mala :umm: that absolutley makes no sence at all. DO u guys think all the damdam taksaal san ts were idiots or sumthing the ones that were saying it is bani :umm: so if you wanna go against bani and think ur superiour and think you can claim wat bani is and wat bani isnt, then yo are lost.

[GABROO KHALISTAN DAH]

navjot, plz stopt aking things tot he extreem end of the spectrum.

I'm not taaksali, i'm not akj, i'm not sikh.

Nore did i say i dont' believe in raagmaala, all i'm trying to say is that it is only to do with raags, it does'nt teach u ne thing but raags, tell me how deeply ur sikhi would be effected if raagmaala wuz non-existant?

Admin Note: Sangato, please do not restart this raag mala debate. You can continue this topic, but raag mala has been discussed enough, neither side has anything new to contribute, and panth has decided it can or cannot be read. So there is no use debating it again and again.

[bravekhalsa]

moorakh mughad how did you know man! I m a RSS agent don't u know? I m here to create problems lol!

Back to my original question. All you guys don't get it in your head. These ridiculous examples of Baba Raam Rai and bowing to your guru and not bowing to raagmala and are all the taksal people wrong if they believe in ragmalaa and wat not! YOU GUYS WASTE YOUR TIME TOO MUCH!.... ALL I ASKED WAS HAVE YOU HEARD THE STORY I POSTED? if not then forget about it. IF YOU HAVE THEN WATS YOUR THINKING ABOUT IT? do you think its true that BHAI SAHIB BHAI RANDHEER SINGH JEE WAS IN PAIN AT HIS END TIME CUZ HE DIDN'T READ RAAGMALA!

I don't care wat your stand on ragmala is. You can be pro or against it. WE have wasted enough time discussing that issue.

have you people heard that story above about Bhai Randheer Singh Jee? If you have do you think it was actually true?

(people don't even try to start the raagmala discussion here)

Some people are just BLIND I GUESS wen I said don't even try to start the raagmala thing!

I don't want to know if you are pro raagmala or not. regardless of my original plea of not starting a debate about ragmala has been ignored by lot of people. NO ONE WANT'S TO KNOW YOUR PERSONAL OPINION ABOUT RAGAMALA!!!!GET IT IN YOUR HEAD PEOPLE!

sorry for being harsh...

[Confu Singh]

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

In relation to the question by bhaji about Bhai Randheer Singh - who are we to know whether they were in pain or not? None of us was there so its hypothetical.

In terms of whether ANY individual who has done naam all there life can stumble or falter, there are many examples in Gurbani and Ithihas of people who have.

A note to the admin team - i dont know if any one has posted this about Raag Mala, but it does have a spiritual meaning according to Baba Gurbachan Singh ji Khalsa who wrote a whole book on it. According to this, it is NOT simply a collection of raags. If this point has been discussed please forgive me.

Admin Note: No, this issue has not been discussed. It can be discussed in a civil manner under a different topic please. We do not want to discourage free speech but we also do not want to create animousity or fighting over useless things. It is our stance and akal takhts that raag mala can be read and cannot be read and either side is correct. Please respect others opinions. However, I would like to hear what you have to say on this topic, under a different thread.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[me moorakh mugadh]

moorakh mughad how did you know man! I m a RSS agent don't u know? I m here to create problems lol!

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

i have no problem with u and anyone only pls respect everyonce sentiment and emotions beacuse here are many who love babajee in first u should had not wrriten all this veerje :umm:

take care guru sahae