Sikhism Is The Only Religion....

[Brian.Singh]

SIKHISM IS THE ONLY RELIGION THAT HELPS YOU MEET AKAL PURAKH, NO OTHER RELIGION DOES THAT, THEY TELL YOU TO DO THIS AND THAT, BUT NOT HOW TO CONNECT ONE WITH AKAL PURAKH.. :e:

BAKWAS BAND KAR

SINGH IS KING, AND BE THE BEST A KAUR PRINCESS. :D

[N30S1NGH]

Namstang, you mentioned Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji. If you really agree with him then you should study his jeevani. Sant Kartar Singh Ji mentioned that Sant Gurbachan Singh and Sant Sundar Singh Ji used to be Sadhus in their previous births and did lot of bhagtee but to attain Mukhtee they had to take one more birth in Sikhi and only after taking Amrit (Gurmat Naam from Satguru) they could get to where they wanted. It is very simple logic: If ways to merge with Waheguru had already existed then why did Guru Sahib start Sikhi? Why did he even come and stayed in physical form for 240 years? Equating Sikhi to other religions such as Islam and Hinduism is an insult to Sikhi. While these two religions and their scriptures are rejected in Gurbani you are claiming them to be equal to Sikhi. Your reasoning shouldn't be based on old sampardas but on Gurbani. Show reference from Gurbani that one can get muktee without Satguru and obtaining Naam. Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

If we use your logic then one can say the same thing about sri guru gobind singh ji being dustat daman ( didnt had mukhti) had to come back and take amrit from panj pyares. would you say then dusth daman was indeed not mukht he had to come back as sri guru gobind singh ji take amrit from panj pyares ?

Very flawed indeed.

Guru Sahib himself mentioned: Mein Hoo Param Purkh ko dasa, dekhan aoe jagat tamasaha.

Guru Sahib were karaks along with his sons panj pyares and other bhramgyanis of the panth who were nit avtars. They already mukht. They come to this world to see tamasha and take part in maharaj lella and perform their rules.

Sant Sunder Singh Ji and Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji and other great mahapursh were all part of 72 nit avtars.

Why did he even come and stayed in physical form for 240 years? Equating Sikhi to other religions such as Islam and Hinduism is an insult to Sikhi. While these two religions and their scriptures are rejected in Gurbani you are claiming them to be equal to Sikhi. Your reasoning shouldn't be based on old sampardas but on Gurbani. Show reference from Gurbani that one can get muktee without Satguru and obtaining Naam

I remember an vichar with you long time ago, where i gave you great examples- raja janak being labelled as gurmukh by bhai gurdas ji.

you tell me in your views, if raja janak is considered as sikh? if yes, then i rest my case if not then kudos you you challenging bhai gurdas ji stance.

[Brian.Singh]

*EDITED*

[Pakandi baba]

Satguru according to bani. Bani also tells us that "bin satgur kinai na paiyo bin satgur kinai na paaiya". No one has found Vahiguru without the Satguru. So how has anyone found Vahiguru without Guru Nanak?

Well this verse comes to mind veera - ''Do not say that the Vedas and the Kateb (Bible, Quraan, etc.) are false. Those who do not reflect and contemplate them are false'' (sggs 1350)

The instructions of the Gurbani is not only for those who read Vedas, Bible, Quraan, and so on. It's also for the Sikhs who read Sri Guru Granth Sahib! It's not that the Gurbani is only telling others not to practice such "useless" rituals or Karamkaand, it's also telling the Sikhs as well. If a Sikh does "Karamkaands" than why wouldn't a Brahmin be helped along with his "Karamkaands", or a Muslim or a Christian or a Yogi with his? In truth, the Gurbani's instructions are for the good of all mankind; including Sikhs as well.

The Gurbani's message is that there is no purpose in merely rolling the beads nor the tongue reading scriptures or singing the praise of God without true love, devotion, concentration and intuitive understanding. The purpose of scriptural texts is to prepare the person emotionally and intellectually for pursuing the Spiritual Life. Therefore, they must be pursued with faith, belief, and willingness to follow their Divine teachings, without which the scriptural study will amount to only scholarship or unmeaning ritual.

Thus, the purpose of reading or listening to scriptures is to develop Divine Understanding, and then act upon it. If that does not happen, then, there is no difference between a human being engaged in reading or listening to scriptures and a beast engaged in filling his belly.

So to each person of whatever religion, the Prophets of that religion are Gurus to them. - Although only contemplation on the One God is going to get us to Sach Khand!

I find it to be real blasphemy when you equate Sach Khand with the 7 heavens of Islam. Islam, the religion of Muhammed who consummated marriages with 9 year olds and said it's fine to rape the wives of captives in front of them, has the capability of revealing Sach Khand? Give me a break. Sach Khand is much above heaven and real blasphemy is committed when you try and call those lowly heavens as Sach Khand.

So why does the verse in my post above hightlight the Kuran is not untrue? Is this not the path for muslims to Sach Khand?

BTW - Guru Nanak Mahraaj was NOT an incarnation of Vishnu or any other hindu diety! :D

LET GOD DECIDE WHICH IS THE BEST RELIGION TO REACH HIM....

DONT GET INTO THIS MEANINGLESS DISCUSSION BUDDIES...USE UR TIME AND ENERGY FOR SOMETHING CREATIVe

enuff is enuff...THERE IS NO PLURAL OF RELIGION...AND THAT RELIGION IS BETWEEN THESE BRACETS ( )AND NO RELGION takes u to God....alll religions need to b dropped and u have to go nude even ur bana will not be of any help and u have to take ur kachare off as well....in stark nude..and then only something is possible.....

fyi

[Balwinder Singh]

Namstang, you mentioned Sant Gurbachan Singh Ji. If you really agree with him then you should study his jeevani. Sant Kartar Singh Ji mentioned that Sant Gurbachan Singh and Sant Sundar Singh Ji used to be Sadhus in their previous births and did lot of bhagtee but to attain Mukhtee they had to take one more birth in Sikhi and only after taking Amrit (Gurmat Naam from Satguru) they could get to where they wanted. It is very simple logic: If ways to merge with Waheguru had already existed then why did Guru Sahib start Sikhi? Why did he even come and stayed in physical form for 240 years? Equating Sikhi to other religions such as Islam and Hinduism is an insult to Sikhi. While these two religions and their scriptures are rejected in Gurbani you are claiming them to be equal to Sikhi. Your reasoning shouldn't be based on old sampardas but on Gurbani. Debate on "Avtars" has already taken place. Hukam of Akal Purakh must have a reasoning. He doesn't just wake up and decide to do something without any reason. Think about why Sikhi or the third Panth was started. Simply because other religions had failed and fog of ignorance was only eliminated when Sikhi appeared. Show reference from Gurbani that one can get muktee without Satguru and obtaining Naam. Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh

How do u describe budha....was he not jeevan mukat?

Also, saints like kabir came before Guru Nanak..... they were not jeevan mukat or their path was different from Nanak? Saints like Mansoor,Paltu, Bheekhan....they had their gurus and they were jeevan mukat.

[Singh132]

Satnaam is primal name out of all because this name also exist in para bani(higher state) along with other resosance of vahiguroo ie- ongggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg or oammmmmmmmmmmmmmm(nasal difference) sounds the same in resonance.

Who needs RSS when we have you? Are you trying to suggest that Gurmantar is the equal of OMMMMMMMMM and ONGGGGGGGGG? Why Did Guru Sahib even bother revealing any Gurmantar if other naams are just as effective? It was pointless then? Gurmat Naam is that naam revealed by Guru Nanak. Satnaam is the same thing.

Your understanding of "kritam naam" doesn't fit in the shabad. Look at the shabad and all the "naam" Guru Sahib has listed. In the end, Guru Sahib says, Satnaam is the highest of all. The defintion you pasted is actually more in line with my interpretation that all these naams listed below are based on Vahiguru's actions and qualities. But Satnaam is above all these. Just read the shabad to see what Kirtam Naam and Satnaam are. They are quite different as the shabad is expressing.

ਮਾਰੂ ਮਹਲਾ ੫ ॥

ਅਚੁਤ ਪਾਰਬ੍ਰਹਮ ਪਰਮੇਸੁਰ ਅੰਤਰਜਾਮੀ ॥

ਮਧੁਸੂਦਨ ਦਾਮੋਦਰ ਸੁਆਮੀ ॥

ਰਿਖੀਕੇਸ ਗੋਵਰਧਨ ਧਾਰੀ ਮੁਰਲੀ ਮਨੋਹਰ ਹਰਿ ਰੰਗਾ ॥੧॥

ਮੋਹਨ ਮਾਧਵ ਕ੍ਰਿਸ੍ਨ ਮੁਰਾਰੇ ॥

ਜਗਦੀਸੁਰ ਹਰਿ ਜੀਉ ਅਸੁਰ ਸੰਘਾਰੇ ॥

ਜਗਜੀਵਨ ਅਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਠਾਕੁਰ ਘਟ ਘਟ ਵਾਸੀ ਹੈ ਸੰਗਾ ॥੨॥

ਧਰਣੀਧਰ ਈਸ ਨਰਸਿੰਘ ਨਾਰਾਇਣ ॥

ਦਾੜਾ ਅਗ੍ਰੇ ਪ੍ਰਿਥਮਿ ਧਰਾਇਣ ॥

ਬਾਵਨ ਰੂਪੁ ਕੀਆ ਤੁਧੁ ਕਰਤੇ ਸਭ ਹੀ ਸੇਤੀ ਹੈ ਚੰਗਾ ॥੩॥

ਸ੍ਰੀ ਰਾਮਚੰਦ ਜਿਸੁ ਰੂਪੁ ਨ ਰੇਖਿਆ ॥

ਬਨਵਾਲੀ ਚਕ੍ਰਪਾਣਿ ਦਰਸਿ ਅਨੂਪਿਆ ॥

ਸਹਸ ਨੇਤ੍ਰ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਹੈ ਸਹਸਾ ਇਕੁ ਦਾਤਾ ਸਭ ਹੈ ਮੰਗਾ ॥੪॥

ਭਗਤਿ ਵਛਲੁ ਅਨਾਥਹ ਨਾਥੇ ॥

ਗੋਪੀ ਨਾਥੁ ਸਗਲ ਹੈ ਸਾਥੇ ॥

ਬਾਸੁਦੇਵ ਨਿਰੰਜਨ ਦਾਤੇ ਬਰਨਿ ਨ ਸਾਕਉ ਗੁਣ ਅੰਗਾ ॥੫॥

ਮੁਕੰਦ ਮਨੋਹਰ ਲਖਮੀ ਨਾਰਾਇਣ ॥

ਦ੍ਰੋਪਤੀ ਲਜਾ ਨਿਵਾਰਿ ਉਧਾਰਣ ॥

ਕਮਲਾਕੰਤ ਕਰਹਿ ਕੰਤੂਹਲ ਅਨਦ ਬਿਨੋਦੀ ਨਿਹਸੰਗਾ ॥੬॥

ਅਮੋਘ ਦਰਸਨ ਆਜੂਨੀ ਸੰਭਉ ॥

ਅਕਾਲ ਮੂਰਤਿ ਜਿਸੁ ਕਦੇ ਨਾਹੀ ਖਉ ॥

ਅਬਿਨਾਸੀ ਅਬਿਗਤ ਅਗੋਚਰ ਸਭੁ ਕਿਛੁ ਤੁਝ ਹੀ ਹੈ ਲਗਾ ॥੭॥

ਸ੍ਰੀਰੰਗ ਬੈਕੁੰਠ ਕੇ ਵਾਸੀ ॥

ਮਛੁ ਕਛੁ ਕੂਰਮੁ ਆਗਿਆ ਅਉਤਰਾਸੀ ॥

ਕੇਸਵ ਚਲਤ ਕਰਹਿ ਨਿਰਾਲੇ ਕੀਤਾ ਲੋੜਹਿ ਸੋ ਹੋਇਗਾ ॥੮॥

ਨਿਰਾਹਾਰੀ ਨਿਰਵੈਰੁ ਸਮਾਇਆ ॥

ਧਾਰਿ ਖੇਲੁ ਚਤੁਰਭੁਜੁ ਕਹਾਇਆ ॥

ਸਾਵਲ ਸੁੰਦਰ ਰੂਪ ਬਣਾਵਹਿ ਬੇਣੁ ਸੁਨਤ ਸਭ ਮੋਹੈਗਾ ॥੯॥

ਬਨਮਾਲਾ ਬਿਭੂਖਨ ਕਮਲ ਨੈਨ ॥

ਸੁੰਦਰ ਕੁੰਡਲ ਮੁਕਟ ਬੈਨ ॥

ਸੰਖ ਚਕ੍ਰ ਗਦਾ ਹੈ ਧਾਰੀ ਮਹਾ ਸਾਰਥੀ ਸਤਸੰਗਾ ॥੧੦॥

ਪੀਤ ਪੀਤੰਬਰ ਤ੍ਰਿਭਵਣ ਧਣੀ ॥

ਜਗੰਨਾਥੁ ਗੋਪਾਲੁ ਮੁਖਿ ਭਣੀ ॥

ਸਾਰਿੰਗਧਰ ਭਗਵਾਨ ਬੀਠੁਲਾ ਮੈ ਗਣਤ ਨ ਆਵੈ ਸਰਬੰਗਾ ॥੧੧॥

ਨਿਹਕੰਟਕੁ ਨਿਹਕੇਵਲੁ ਕਹੀਐ ॥

ਧਨੰਜੈ ਜਲਿ ਥਲਿ ਹੈ ਮਹੀਐ ॥

ਮਿਰਤ ਲੋਕ ਪਇਆਲ ਸਮੀਪਤ ਅਸਥਿਰ ਥਾਨੁ ਜਿਸੁ ਹੈ ਅਭਗਾ ॥੧੨॥

ਪਤਿਤ ਪਾਵਨ ਦੁਖ ਭੈ ਭੰਜਨੁ ॥

ਅਹੰਕਾਰ ਨਿਵਾਰਣੁ ਹੈ ਭਵ ਖੰਡਨੁ ॥

ਭਗਤੀ ਤੋਖਿਤ ਦੀਨ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਲਾ ਗੁਣੇ ਨ ਕਿਤ ਹੀ ਹੈ ਭਿਗਾ ॥੧੩॥

ਨਿਰੰਕਾਰੁ ਅਛਲ ਅਡੋਲੋ ॥

ਜੋਤਿ ਸਰੂਪੀ ਸਭੁ ਜਗੁ ਮਉਲੋ ॥

ਸੋ ਮਿਲੈ ਜਿਸੁ ਆਪਿ ਮਿਲਾਏ ਆਪਹੁ ਕੋਇ ਨ ਪਾਵੈਗਾ ॥੧੪॥

ਆਪੇ ਗੋਪੀ ਆਪੇ ਕਾਨਾ ॥

ਆਪੇ ਗਊ ਚਰਾਵੈ ਬਾਨਾ ॥

ਆਪਿ ਉਪਾਵਹਿ ਆਪਿ ਖਪਾਵਹਿ ਤੁਧੁ ਲੇਪੁ ਨਹੀ ਇਕੁ ਤਿਲੁ ਰੰਗਾ ॥੧੫॥

ਏਕ ਜੀਹ ਗੁਣ ਕਵਨ ਬਖਾਨੈ ॥

ਸਹਸ ਫਨੀ ਸੇਖ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਜਾਨੈ ॥

ਨਵਤਨ ਨਾਮ ਜਪੈ ਦਿਨੁ ਰਾਤੀ ਇਕੁ ਗੁਣੁ ਨਾਹੀ ਪ੍ਰਭ ਕਹਿ ਸੰਗਾ ॥੧੬॥

ਓਟ ਗਹੀ ਜਗਤ ਪਿਤ ਸਰਣਾਇਆ ॥

ਭੈ ਭਇਆਨਕ ਜਮਦੂਤ ਦੁਤਰ ਹੈ ਮਾਇਆ ॥

ਹੋਹੁ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾਲ ਇਛਾ ਕਰਿ ਰਾਖਹੁ ਸਾਧ ਸੰਤਨ ਕੈ ਸੰਗਿ ਸੰਗਾ ॥੧੭॥

ਦ੍ਰਿਸਟਿਮਾਨ ਹੈ ਸਗਲ ਮਿਥੇਨਾ ॥

ਇਕੁ ਮਾਗਉ ਦਾਨੁ ਗੋਬਿਦ ਸੰਤ ਰੇਨਾ ॥

ਮਸਤਕਿ ਲਾਇ ਪਰਮ ਪਦੁ ਪਾਵਉ ਜਿਸੁ ਪ੍ਰਾਪਤਿ ਸੋ ਪਾਵੈਗਾ ॥੧੮॥

ਜਿਨ ਕਉ ਕ੍ਰਿਪਾ ਕਰੀ ਸੁਖਦਾਤੇ ॥

ਤਿਨ ਸਾਧੂ ਚਰਣ ਲੈ ਰਿਦੈ ਪਰਾਤੇ ॥

ਸਗਲ ਨਾਮ ਨਿਧਾਨੁ ਤਿਨ ਪਾਇਆ ਅਨਹਦ ਸਬਦ ਮਨਿ ਵਾਜੰਗਾ ॥੧੯॥

ਕਿਰਤਮ ਨਾਮ ਕਥੇ ਤੇਰੇ ਜਿਹਬਾ ॥

ਸਤਿ ਨਾਮੁ ਤੇਰਾ ਪਰਾ ਪੂਰਬਲਾ ॥

ਕਹੁ ਨਾਨਕ ਭਗਤ ਪਏ ਸਰਣਾਈ ਦੇਹੁ ਦਰਸੁ ਮਨਿ ਰੰਗੁ ਲਗਾ ॥੨੦॥

ਤੇਰੀ ਗਤਿ ਮਿਤਿ ਤੂਹੈ ਜਾਣਹਿ ॥

ਤੂ ਆਪੇ ਕਥਹਿ ਤੈ ਆਪਿ ਵਖਾਣਹਿ ॥

ਨਾਨਕ ਦਾਸੁ ਦਾਸਨ ਕੋ ਕਰੀਅਹੁ ਹਰਿ ਭਾਵੈ ਦਾਸਾ ਰਾਖੁ ਸੰਗਾ ॥੨੧॥੨॥੧੧॥

Guru Gobind Singh says very clearly:

ਬਿਨ ਹਰਿ ਨਾਮ ਨ ਬਾਚਨ ਪੈ ਹੈ ॥

ਚੌਦਹ ਲੋਕ ਜਾਹਿ ਬਸਿ ਕੀਨੇ ਤਾ ਤੇ ਕਹਾਂ ਪਲੈ ਹੈ ॥੧॥ ਰਹਾਉ ॥

ਰਾਮ ਰਹੀਮ ਉਬਾਰ ਨ ਸਕਿ ਹੈ ਜਾ ਕਰ ਨਾਮ ਰਟੈ ਹੈ ॥ ਬ੍ਰਹਮਾ ਬਿਸ਼ਨ ਰੁਦ੍ਰ ਸੂਰਹ ਸਸਿ ਤੇ ਬਸਿ ਕਾਲ ਸਭੈ ਹੈ ॥੧

Clearly Guru Sahib is saying with Naam no one is saved. But then he goes on to say that no one is saved by repeating "Raam, Raheem." How can you be saved by repeating "Brahama" or "Bishan Bishan" if they too are under control of death and time?

So as bhagat kabir sakhi when bhagat kabir met his gurdev- ramanad night time upon his gurdev ishnan time, kabir ji lying on the stairs when his gurdev accidently hit him and said mantar, he recited upon that mantar for long time and got gyan turiya avastha.

If Kabir Jee reached this avastha, then why did he need to become a Sikh of Guru Nanak? Why then wasn't ALL his bani included? It was all revealed then if it is in "turiya avastha". It is a fact recorded in "Kabir Mansoor Granth" that he and Guru Nanak met.

You haven't answered ANY of my points with references from Gurbani or even commented on them. I repeat: "If you say that Guru Nanak is only for Kaljug, are you suggesting that if this jug ends, Gurmat will no longer be relevant? Why has Guru Sahib said THIS is the time for Salvation and Kaljug is greatest? If Gurmat revealed by Guru Nanak is just another dharam and he has done this before, why is this the best time? It just doesn't make any sense. Gurbani is clear on the issue: "eko dharam driray sach koi. Gurmat poora jug jug soi". Only ONE dharam teaches Sach. That is Guru Nanak's Gurmat, which is PERFECT in EVERY jug. What you are preaching is blasphemous to Gurmat."

All these philosophies are great but are worth NOTHING if they don’t have any basis in Gurbani.

You keep going back to those bhagats like Raja Janak who came before Guru Nanak: refer to my original post. They were blessed ONLY by Guru Nanak. Gurbani tells us that.

Pakandi Baba,

Well this verse comes to mind veera - ''Do not say that the Vedas and the Kateb (Bible, Quraan, etc.) are false. Those who do not reflect and contemplate them are false'' (sggs 1350)

This is a wrong translation. Mat means "not”"but in this context it means "path/religion". Just like we have "Gur-mat" these "mat" are false. Other places where Gurbani tells the same thing is:

ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਇਫਤਰਾ ਭਾਈ ਦਿਲ ਕਾ ਫਿਕਰੁ ਨ ਜਾਇ ॥ ਅੰਗ 727

ਬੇਦ ਕਤੇਬ ਸਿਮ੍ਰਿਤਿ ਸਭਿ ਸਾਸਤ ਇਨ੍‍ ਪੜਿਆ ਮੁਕਤਿ ਨ ਹੋਈ ॥ ਅੰਗ 747

Koran cannot lead to salvation. In fact I think those that follow the Koran on points like accepting slaves and destroying non-believers are bound for hell.

Balwinder Singh,

How do u describe budha....was he not jeevan mukat?

Buddha is NOT jeevan mukat. Gurbani clearly tells us in Japji Sahib that Buddha is in Giaan Khand. "ketay Sidh Budh naath kaytay". Buddhists don't even believe in God so how can they reach Sachkhand. Budhaa is in Giaan Khand and clearly not in Sach Khand.

[Balwinder Singh]

Balwinder Singh,

How do u describe budha....was he not jeevan mukat?

Buddha is NOT jeevan mukat. Gurbani clearly tells us in Japji Sahib that Buddha is in Giaan Khand. "ketay Sidh Budh naath kaytay". Buddhists don't even believe in God so how can they reach Sachkhand. Budhaa is in Giaan Khand and clearly not in Sach Khand.

Dear Singh ji,

Please try to understand what guru ji is saying here in Japji. He is not listing us the people who are in gyan khand. He is telling us that when somebdy reaches gyan khand then he sees that there are thousands and thousands of budhas (BTW budha doesn't mean Gautam Budh, budha mean one who is one with the existence), Thousands and thousands of sidha, Thousands and thousands of nath,Thousands and thousands of earths,Thousands and thousands of skies.

Guru ji here listed Earth and sky....do u think they(earth and sky) are also in gyan khand?....try to understand...Guru ji is just saying that the whole existence will be revealed in gyan khand. I hope I made it clear.

Also, Buddist beleive in God....but in other way. When somebdy asked Gautam Budh about God....He didn't say anything because He knew that.....as soon as one start saying about God ....it becomes a "false statement".

Even Guru nanak said that it immpossible to describe God. He cannot be described by words. Its an experience....like u cannot describe sweetness of sugar....or beauty of nature.

I hope i made my point clear.

[Singh132]

ਧਰਮ ਖੰਡ ਕਾ ਏਹੋ ਧਰਮੁ ॥

ਗਿਆਨ ਖੰਡ ਕਾ ਆਖਹੁ ਕਰਮੁ ॥

ਕੇਤੇ ਪਵਣ ਪਾਣੀ ਵੈਸੰਤਰ ਕੇਤੇ ਕਾਨ ਮਹੇਸ ॥

ਕੇਤੇ ਬਰਮੇ ਘਾੜਤਿ ਘੜੀਅਹਿ ਰੂਪ ਰੰਗ ਕੇ ਵੇਸ ॥

ਕੇਤੀਆ ਕਰਮ ਭੂਮੀ ਮੇਰ ਕੇਤੇ ਕੇਤੇ ਧੂ ਉਪਦੇਸ ॥

ਕੇਤੇ ਇੰਦ ਚੰਦ ਸੂਰ ਕੇਤੇ ਕੇਤੇ ਮੰਡਲ ਦੇਸ ॥

ਕੇਤੇ ਸਿਧ ਬੁਧ ਨਾਥ ਕੇਤੇ ਕੇਤੇ ਦੇਵੀ ਵੇਸ ॥

ਕੇਤੇ ਦੇਵ ਦਾਨਵ ਮੁਨਿ ਕੇਤੇ ਕੇਤੇ ਰਤਨ ਸਮੁੰਦ ॥

ਕੇਤੀਆ ਖਾਣੀ ਕੇਤੀਆ ਬਾਣੀ ਕੇਤੇ ਪਾਤ ਨਰਿੰਦ ॥

ਕੇਤੀਆ ਸੁਰਤੀ ਸੇਵਕ ਕੇਤੇ ਨਾਨਕ ਅੰਤੁ ਨ ਅੰਤੁ ॥੩੫॥

Even Dr. Sahib Singh has translated Budh as Budh-Avtar because this the meaning that fits the context. Not "budhi valay". This description of Giaan Khand is telling what is in the Khand. Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh's explanation of this pauri also mentions these as descriptions of what is in the khand.

But let's approach the Buddha another way. Who was his Guru? We know that Gurbani is very firm that Vahiguru is "gur parsaad" and "bin satguru kinai na paiyo bin satugur kinai naa paiya." So who was his Guru? Once again, Gurbani tells us that Satguru is one and that Satguru is Guru Nanak. Buddha did not have any naam. So how could he have reached Sach Khand?

The question is simple: if other paths lead there, then why not reform them? Why did Guru Nanak create a totally new path of Gurmat? The reason is that no other path can lead to Sach Khand.

[Balwinder Singh]

Even Dr. Sahib Singh has translated Budh as Budh-Avtar because this the meaning that fits the context. Not "budhi valay". This description of Giaan Khand is telling what is in the Khand. Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh's explanation of this pauri also mentions these as descriptions of what is in the khand.

Its not telling us what in the khand. Its telling us the understand which we will get if we reach in this khand. These realms are realms of experience and understanding.

Can u answer why earth and sky are in this khand? Also can u answer why khand (planet),mandal and barhmand are also listed in sachkhand? earth is also planet...right?

Its just an understanding or experience....there are no words to explain it.....still guru ji was so compassationate that he tried his best it in words. Dont go by plain words....try to go deep into it.

But let's approach the Buddha another way. Who was his Guru? We know that Gurbani is very firm that Vahiguru is "gur parsaad" and "bin satguru kinai na paiyo bin satugur kinai naa paiya." So who was his Guru? Once again, Gurbani tells us that Satguru is one and that Satguru in Guru Nanak. Buddha did not have any naam. So how could he have reached Sach Khand?

By the same logic I can ask u....who was the guru of Nanak?

Gurbani also sometimes mentions satguru when it means God. Same way as Ram is used in gurbani when it refers to God. Also Guru Gobind Singh Say:

Add Ant Eke Avtara, Soyi Guru Samjayo Hamara

The question is simple: if other paths lead there, then why not reform them? Why did Guru Nanak create a totally new path of Gurmat? The reason is that no other path can lead to Sach Khand.

Guru Nanak told us the path to sachkhand.....how many of us reached there???? For the same reason new religion come into being because people lke us "misinterpret" old religions...and make them useless filled with blind rituals.

Gurumatt was there at the time of kabir, ravidass, baba farid....because they also followed their Guru and their guru's mat . it was there in the time of bheekhan and gulal.

[Singh132]

I won't argue further on your interpretation of that pauri in Japji Sahib because it's based on experience. Bhai Sahib Randhir Singh has said that it is a description of Giaan Khand but if you don't agree or have your own interpretation, that's fine.

By the same logic I can ask u....who was the guru of Nanak?

Gurbani also sometimes mentions satguru when it means God. Same way as Ram is used in gurbani when it refers to God. Also Guru Gobind Singh Say:

Add Ant Eke Avtara, Soyi Guru Samjayo Hamara

Who was the Guru of Guru Nanak? Very good question. Guru Nanak was the Guru form of Vahiguru but he too upheld the rule that Vahiguru is Gur Parsaad. Guru Sahib's being called to Sach Khand to receive naam from Vahiguru himself shows that Guru Nanak took Vahiguru as his Guru. When he disappeared into the Vein this is what happened. Otherwise what was the need if there is no need for a Guru? But Guru Nanak wanted to uphold the rule that everyone needs a Guru so even he went through the formal process of taking on Vahiguru as his Guru. Guru Granth Sahib contains the shabad where Guru Nanak describes how he was called to Dargah of Vahiguru and given naam.

But once again, who was Buddha's Guru? What naam did he have? If there is ONE Satguru and that Satguru is Guru Nanak, according to Bani, then how could Buddha have gone to Sachkhand?

Gurumatt was there at the time of kabir, ravidass, baba farid....because they also followed their Guru and their guru's mat . it was there in the time of bheekhan and gulal.

The Guru of Bhagat Kabir, Bhagat Ravidas and Bhagat Farid (Sani) were all Guru Nanak and they in their lifetimes met Guru Nanak and became his Sikhs. All the Bhagats in Guru Granth Sahib were Sikhs of Guru Nanak and met him in their lifetimes.