Boycott Lohri!

[Bijla Singh]

Mr. "dancing warrior" could you provide some references to prove that Lohri is part of Sikhi? How did it begin? What was the purpose? Why should we (Sikhs) celebrate it?

Thousands of years ago and even during the times of Gurus inequality was widely practiced. If lohri is about equality then it wouldn't have existed back then. If it has nothing to do with babies then what was the purpose of celebrating it back then? Guru Sahib rejected thousands of years of old practices such as worshipping idols and other demi-gods so your argument that lohri is acceptable because it is old is not rational.

[Balwinder Singh]

Lohri has no relation to sikhi..... its just people of a particular part of the world celebrate.

Its a local thing....not associated with sikhi at all (i think).

Like some festivals in west has no relation to chistianity but still people celebrate....cuz they are part of their culture.

[Khalsa4ever]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

I think we should first see why we celebrate something NOW. Halloween was originally a pagan festival to ward off evil spirits. Now it's just an excuse to eat candy.

I don't know much about Lohri. As far as I know, its much the same thing. It was originally a celebration of birth/fertility/radishes, but now it feels more like Halloween except with waay nastier candies.

...and IF it is no longer a sexist festival, THEN it is no longer anti-sikhi.

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

[davindervirk]

A female provides a king but without the queen there be no king

[anhad]

.......................................................................WaheGuru Ji Ka Khalsa, WhaeGuru Ji Ki Fateh.................................................................................

okey about Lohri.... Nobody knows for sure as to why it is celebrated.. but it was definitely not for favoring boys over girls...

One of the stories behind the celebration of this festival goes like this;

Somewhere between Gujaranwala and Sialkot in Pakistan now, there was a thick forest called Rakh. There used to live a Muslim Dacoit named Dulla Bhatti, the Robinhood of Punjab. He was brave, generous and provided maximum help to everyone in distress. During the reign of Jahangir, a middle class Hindu who was a jealous and a cunning man spread a rumor that his niece was very beautiful and would do credit to muslim harem. On hearing this, the mughal officers wanted to carry her off forcibely. The girls father was extreamly worried and sought the protection of Dulla Bhatti. Dulla at once got her married to a young Hindu boy at a simple ceremony in the forest.

He lit the sacred fire in keeping with the Hindu custom. Since there was no priest to chant the holy mantras, he broke into a hilarious song composed extempore to add some fun to the occasion. This song is sung even today on the occasion.

The song goes ;

Sunder mundriye Ho

Tera kaun bachera Ho

Dhulla bhatti wala Ho

Dulle dhi vaiahi Ho

Ser Shakar Pai Ho

Kudi de boje pai Ho

Kudi da lal pataka Ho

Kudi da salu pata Ho

Salu kaun samete Ho

Chacha gal dese Ho

Chache churi <admin-profanity filter activated> Ho

Jimindara luti Ho

Jimindara sado Ho

Gin gin paule lao Ho

Ik paula reh gaya

Sepai fadh kei lai gaya

Sepai ne mari it"

....................................................

There is no reason that it should be banned.. anyways no one is going to listen to your extreamist bull crap any ways.....

The reason why so many festivals have been created, is that back in the days there was no source of entertainment,,, like computers and tv's... Most of the people lived by working their <admin-profanity filter activated>’s off on farms... So festivals like Bhasakhi and Lorhi and many other.. almost every single festival in the world... flourished. so that people could have a day off.. of their bussy hardworking lives and get together and have a good time.... I mean after a century people wouldnt really care about Dhula Bhatti wale.... But the tredition went onn because people loved the happy atmosphere created by da festival....

Why do u think no festivals are created anymore.. Like new festivals because people have too much entertainment and don’t go to ‘malley’ to seek fun.....

Hope u get what im trying to say....

And again enough off the extremism crap......

[Guest Dancing Warrior]

Mr. "dancing warrior" could you provide some references to prove that Lohri is part of Sikhi? How did it begin? What was the purpose? Why should we (Sikhs) celebrate it?

Thousands of years ago and even during the times of Gurus inequality was widely practiced. If lohri is about equality then it wouldn't have existed back then. If it has nothing to do with babies then what was the purpose of celebrating it back then? Guru Sahib rejected thousands of years of old practices such as worshipping idols and other demi-gods so your argument that lohri is acceptable because it is old is not rational.

Kindly refer to where I have stated it is a part of Sikhi? It is not a part of Sikhi but it is a Part of Panjabi Culture, and always will be. It is harmless it is symbolism of a rich tradition. In our Parvar we celebrate it regardless of any event , today in the west building a small fire, singing sometimes silly folk songs, eating seasonal food may seem outdated but it brings our family, friends together who we may not have seen much of, it brings children together who ask about its meaning, it brings the senior folk together who then talk about home, Panjab, their youth, straggles and achievements. Priceless.

Burning witches or Pagans in European has nothing to do with Lori. It believed it was the early type of Pagans who started these traditions in the Indus Valley. At that time the fire was considered revolutionary magical and godly simply because man could now manipulate metals, cook meats, forge weapons, change the environment around them. Mortality rates were less because of the heat and warmth of the fire. the western word Sha’man is derived from India and that period. It was he who was in charge of producing such fires or miracles as they knew it. By striking the stones he created sparks which created fire so the people thought the stones were magical, sacred, giver of life so they worshiped them it is believed that this is where the worship of the Lingam started has the masculine producer of life. The ground was considered motherly feminine as all life came from it that’s why even today countries have a feminine namesake. Both the masculine and feminine were equal one could not survive without the other. The Shaman dressed in nothing apart from animal skin, smeared in ashes, matted hair it is believed that this is where the worship of Shiva came in. The early Pagans worshiped Shiv and Shakti as metaphors and symbols of the life giving environment around them. As the early ancestors they done pretty well because they laid the foundation of what became the first Civilisation on earth.

As time passed many Hindus also worship in similar ways to the very first ancient pagan tradition. We did not burn them at the stake as they did in Europe we are far more understanding and civil then that, or are we?

[randip singh]

It is you that have painted yourself as a fanatic fool, i can not take credit for this

No friend....your prejudiced mind has painted me as a fanatical fools. You cannot understand two basic points:

1) I believe in democratic values - euality, freedom , justice for all.

2) From what I have read in Sikhism, the values seem to back democratic values up.

To reafirm my point....Indian authorities seem to agree with me:

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2004/20040113/ldh1.htm

Meanwhile, the District Health Department has spread the message that this festival of 'dulha-bhatti' should not be celebrated by the families when some baby boy is born, rather the birth of a girl should also be celebrated. Dr S.N.Tiwari, in his message to the masses said both son and daughter were equal without whom society can not move.

Dr Tiwari said that sex determination and abortion of a female foetus was unethical. The district administration was keenly observing on the matter and the guilty would be severely punished.

I still believe we should definitely boycott Lohri (not ban it), until such time donkey headed people who think that the celebration of boy births take precedence over girls.

Also this paper :

http://nrcw.nic.in/shared/report/81.pdf - Identifying and Controlling Female Foetecide and Infanticide in Punjab

has identified Lohri as a catalyst in this.

Initiate state regulation to discourage opulent celebrations such as the

birth of male child, lohri, namkaran, mundan ceremonies and marriages.

(for instance if more than 100 guests have been entertained in the

celebrations then it should be mandatory to file an income tax return).

The authorites want to dicourage such things too.

The ball is in your court Dancing Warrior.....you may wish to live in a sugar coated world where all Punjabi rituals are purer that purer.....but I don't.

Regards

[Guest Dancing Warrior]

It is you that have painted yourself as a fanatic fool, i can not take credit for this

No friend....your prejudiced mind has painted me as a fanatical fools. You cannot understand two basic points:

1) I believe in democratic values - euality, freedom , justice for all.

2) From what I have read in Sikhism, the values seem to back democratic values up.

To reafirm my point....Indian authorities seem to agree with me:

http://www.tribuneindia.com/2004/20040113/ldh1.htm

Meanwhile, the District Health Department has spread the message that this festival of 'dulha-bhatti' should not be celebrated by the families when some baby boy is born, rather the birth of a girl should also be celebrated. Dr S.N.Tiwari, in his message to the masses said both son and daughter were equal without whom society can not move.

Dr Tiwari said that sex determination and abortion of a female foetus was unethical. The district administration was keenly observing on the matter and the guilty would be severely punished.

I still believe we should definitely boycott Lohri (not ban it), until such time donkey headed people who think that the celebration of boy births take precedence over girls.

Also this paper :

http://nrcw.nic.in/shared/report/81.pdf - Identifying and Controlling Female Foetecide and Infanticide in Punjab

has identified Lohri as a catalyst in this.

Initiate state regulation to discourage opulent celebrations such as the

birth of male child, lohri, namkaran, mundan ceremonies and marriages.

(for instance if more than 100 guests have been entertained in the

celebrations then it should be mandatory to file an income tax return).

The authorites want to dicourage such things too.

The ball is in your court Dancing Warrior.....you may wish to live in a sugar coated world where all Punjabi rituals are purer that purer.....but I don't.

Regards

Randip,

You are scrabbling for ammunition, but your arsenal is lacking any great bag. It makes no dent in what I stated. You are going round in circles in your boat , try using both paddles instead of using just one to go forward, You need a balanced, tolerant out look, you claim to be ambassador to all these but have proved again and again that you are not.

You are not convincing me I suggest you try to convince yourself. Lastly this is my last post on this topic I have said what I needed to say on it. Let the people decide where they go with this rather then just relying on what’s been debated here.

So to finalise good people of earth, don’t be told That, There and Then as with any thing to do with truth ask What, when and why.

Oh and Randip you never had the mythical ball to start with

Happy hunting

[randip singh]

Randip,

You are scrabbling for ammunition, but your arsenal is lacking any great bag. It makes no dent in what I stated. You are going round in circles in your boat , try using both paddles instead of using just one to go forward, You need a balanced, tolerant out look, you claim to be ambassador to all these but have proved again and again that you are not.

You are not convincing me I suggest you try to convince yourself. Lastly this is my last post on this topic I have said what I needed to say on it. Let the people decide where they go with this rather then just relying on what’s been debated here.

So to finalise good people of earth, don’t be told That, There and Then as with any thing to do with truth ask What, when and why.

Oh and Randip you never had the mythical ball to start with

Happy hunting

Hi Dancing warrior,

I am not scrambling at all.....on the contrary, you challenged me to produce evidence and I have........... the second paper which I quoted above and post here again:

http://nrcw.nic.in/shared/report/81.pdf - Identifying and Controlling Female Foetecide and Infanticide in Punjab

You stated :

It is harmless it is symbolism of a rich tradition.

I say it is not.This paper (and other articles) convinced me that such medieval festivals must be boycotted that promote Sexism. So far I have heard no evidence from you? Produce one article that condradicts this and I may start changing my mind. Until then I say boycott Lohri.....until the donkeys start realising that the birth of all children should be celebtrated and not just males.

Best Wishes

[davindervirk]

DID YOUR GURU'S CELEBRATE IT?