Stock Market = Gambling?

[Guest Narinder Singh]

Just because a lot of you chose to buy and sell in the stock market it doesnt make it right. You can call it an investment if youd like, but in reality you could care less about your so called investment if it didnt make you money or "$$$" as you like to put it.

If i bet on the Houston Rockets to beat he Utah Jazz because ive done my research by looking at the stats of each player on each team, and am pretty sure the Houston Rockets are going to win the series, what would you call that?

And yes, primarly the rich and self proclaimed elite of society invest in the stock market, thats why its socially accepted.

Fateh.

[singh2k]

its no different than doing research on a game of poker, gain knowledge, and play wisely.

its gambling

[Heera Singh]

if u say so..

i guess i'm a gambler then..

[japmans]

well.. i don't think there's gonna be agreement on this, but here we go:

you gamble everytime you do ANYTHING.

you gamble when you cross the street.

you gamble when you turn the stove on.

you gamble when you flush the toilet...cuz it might get clogged!

you gamble when you interpret gurbani...who's the say your interpretation is the correct one?

you gamble when you go to sleep, for you may never get up.

you gamble when you plug in your appliances, for a short circuit could set your whole house on fire.

you gamble when you light a candle during a power outage for the same reason as above.

so.... stop gambling? or are we perhaps being too black and white as to what gambling is.

because:

you gamble when you decide on a profession in life. there's no guarantee you're going to do well. it's all kirpa in the end. If i was in plumbing, for example, i could spend thousands on an education, hours on practising, and still make mistakes every time i do a job. I gambled away all that time and money, thinking it would result in my making an honest living.. and i lost.

I see the point...that you're just investing money that you don't have an immediate effect on. Consider the analogy.

there are capital resources, and human resources.. i.e, projects are capital intensive, or labour intensive.

a)

you lend money to a friend. you are one of 15000 friends who lent 1 thousand dollars,of which all the proceeds will be put into operating the business.... and the friends that you lent to promise that you will get your whole principal back..and if they do very well...well, they'll thank you for beleving in them, and the generosity, and give you an extra lil cut.

b)

you are a construction worker. You are one of 15000 workers on a large project. The project is wildly successful, and you get a raise at the end of the project.

the argument could be made that the friends' shop would be successful without your 1,000 dollar contribution. the argument could also be made that your work as a construction worker could easily be compensated for by the other 14999 workers.

therefore, from a very analytical point, they're both wrong.

1, because they're both earning money they had no direct business getting. Why should the construction worker get a raise? he should only be paid for the job he did. None of this extra business... therefore, he should refuse the raise? i doubt anyone would suggest this to be the case.

2, Remember that when we talk about doing seva, we talk about doing it with man, tan, and dhan.. part of the "tan" includes things like dasvand, or time and effort... Now i'm not suggesting that seva and earnings are the same thing, but just considering the general concept. If the definition of "tan" for seva purposes is both physical as well as money, why is this definition different for conducting an honest living? Why the double standard?

And just as you said "jus cuz you lot do it, doesn't make it right", i will say the following:

just cuz you DON'T do it, doesn't mean it's wrong.

[japmans]

btw...

considering your analogy of the rockets vs jazz:

who is the target market?

what are the revenues and expenses?

what is the historical risk premium?

how do you quantify the general risk of "investing" in a sports team like that?

and furthermore, how would you define your expected return compared to that of the general risk that's undertaken in such an "investment"? (i put them in quotes, cuz you think it's the same thing as a stock)

have you run a regression of winners in the past?

what are the competing teams offering as products?

have you looked at fundamentals in your analysis?

how do you plan on diversifying your risk away?

Don't you agree there's a massive difference?

Corporations are long-term entities, and sports teams can change on a year to year basis. Very rarely are such massive restructurings engaged into that companies entire focus, missions, and goals change year-to-year. In fact, that's a prime candidate for a company you SHOULDN'T invest in..talk about instability.

if you invest in such instable, short-term instruments (i.e, the rockets), well then consider yourself a gambler (and kinda stupid).

[smartsingh24]

i'd say that the stock market can become gambling only when u risk putting too much of ur own money into an investment. If it gets to the point where your livelihood is affected by the decisions you make at the stock market, you have a problem. If you're receiving free stock optioins from a company you work at, no worries, it isn't gambling. The middle ground is where it gets tough. Japmans gave a good guide.

[Heera Singh]

japmans hot!

[Guest Narinder Singh]

Thanx for that essay Japmans (most of which was completely pointless and off topic).

We can nit pick and rationalize anything to make ourselves feel better.

As i said before, anything the rich and elite take part in is considered acceptable (that goes for almost everything), where as a game of poker or hitting up a few slot machines isnt.

Fateh.

[japmans]

chalo.. clearly you disagree.

For my education, could you please point out which parts were not important and were irrelevant? Help me become a more focussed debater, please.

I was pretty sure most of the stuff i said was on topic, but if you disagree, please show me where so i can improve in the future.

Thank you

Vaheguru

[wjkk wjkf]

Friend of mine was having the same kinda discussion with me so I thought I'd ost the q's on here

1. Where do people get the money from to invest in stocks?

2. Are they not satisfied with what they are earning because of their job?

3. People don't have enough money to fulfill their increased needs?

I won't bother going into how much time people waste on this so called "research".

One sad truth about us humans is that we'll always defend what we do. The day we stop doing that our jeevans will become a lot simpler.

Just count your blessings folks.

char paisian khatar kamliya wangu hath perr na marro.