Hindu Sikh Unity, The Game

[mann_kaum_layee_qurbaan]

DISCLAIMER:

First and foremost, please don't hijack this thread with Hindu bashing and name calling. So all the people who wish to destroy all hindus and destroy India, just ignore this thread and move on. I support sikh sovereignty but not with the destruction of any religious group or country.

Just wanted to share some interesting trends I have been observing in the Indian media and the recent events in Punjab.

As in 1978 when the Nirankari head hurt the sentiments of the Sikhs, we again see that a head of a particular dera has caused much pain to the sentiments of the sikh community. Back in 1978 nd now, the Nirankaris are considered a sikh "sect." Many Nirankaris even consider themselves sikhs, as do naamdharis etc etc.

What is interesting to note is that if the 1978 incident was between the sikhs and a sikh sect, why is it that the media always makes it out to be an issue between Sikh and Hindu unity? What do Hindus have to do with these incidents if they have nothing to do with Hinduism?

Are these sikh "sects" really Hinduism's way of dilluting Sikhism and when Sikhs resist, it hurts the sentiments of the Hindu masses?

This needs to be explored by our sikh intellectuals.

Because what we are seeing now is that the BJP is pressuring the Badal Akali Dal to protect their Hindu vote bank. One must question, why is the so called sikh "sect" and the sikh issue have anything to do with Hindu votes? Are Hindu voters only satisfied when Sikhs accept sects which dillute their identity with Brahman practices? Why does the Hindu Sikh relationship always come up when so-called sikh sects have a bone to pick with mainstream Sikhi or the other way around?

If Sikhs fight deras which attack Sikh ideals and scripture and if Sikhs resist, why does hindu-sikh unity suffer? Are these deras and sects really a front by Hinduism to enter Sikh thought and lifestyle?

What does Hinduism have to do with Nirankaris and Sacha Sauda Dera etc etc?

Why was the 1978 Nirankari - Sikh clash turned into a war to save Hindu - Sikh unity? When did Hinduism become synonomous with Nirankaris?

Why is the Sacha Sauda clash considered a threat to Hindu - Sikh unity? What does Hinduism have to do with Dera Sacha Sauda?

Or do these deras and cults have everything to do with Hinduism?

Curious minds want to know.

[sikh supreme]

Basically these dera's add their own twist to Sikhi forming sects or what not. People are weak they want human figures to guide them, but they do not know the human figures they have today are very corrupt because of kalyug. These baba's and so called sants do not live a humble pious life. They have luxary cars, houses, and use and abuse many women.

Would not say its a hindu conspiricy to dilute sikhism, could be a brahmen/congress agenda though. However the fault lies mainly on the Sikh organistaions (like SGPC) who are not doing enough to promote Sikh ideology from school level and showing them what is right and what is wrong. People who are not informed start to do backward supersticious practises. Hindu-Sikh unity can be mentained if people on both sides know their boundaries of religious interferance of each other.

[Jai Tegang!]

good observation by the poster...

after observing and interacting with hindus, indian media, just everyday indians, you will notice there is a resistance to Pure Sikhi, the Sikhi Of Das Guru sahibaan and Sri Guru Granth Sahib ji.

no one is stupid enough to say it out right....but sutble hints, both subconcious and otherwise, always point to this.

you will notice labels like "fundamentalist" extremist", "rigid", "orthodox" are usually applied to people who are simply following the tenents. While more friendlier labels like "moderate", "secular" are given out to those who pick and choose; following the points that the majority also likes, and ignoring the points the majority *might* have problems with.

everyone loves how Guru Granth Sahib ji treats bhagats from all backgrounds equally...but fighting for justice, standing up, being armed, looking different by keeping kesh...these things the majority subconously doesn't like, because it threatens something in their world.

our hindu neighbours might show respect for our contributions and those of our Guru Sahibaan, but deep down there remains animosity. No matter how hard one tries to suppress it, this animosity will manifest in some form or another.

when anti-sikh groups, like cult deras, emerge, you will see passive acceptance and support from hindus, be it through newspapers, civic bodies...

obviously hindus(or atleast that section of hindu society that supports this. Can't say if all hindus hold these subconcious feelings) don't want to directly challenge our ideals. they get their chance when parasitic sects attack sikhi (like nakli-nirankaris, radha-soamis, bhaniarawla, ram rahim).

all these emerge from sikh backgrounds and feed off of innocent/naive sikhs.

so coming to mqlk's point....

sikhs fighting these parasitic cults *does* harm hindu-sikh unity....because in their mind, sikhs who have shed certain teachings are more suitable for hindu society, and pose less of an afront. dera cults lead exactly to this type of a sikh. Hence, fighting these cults will *obviously* harm hindu-sikh unity.

[Guest Narinder Singh]

I believe that Sikhi, in its purest form is the biggest threat to the Hindu ideology and belief system (if one can even call it that).

Just think back to what Guru Sahib did in 1699.

Fateh.

[Singhovsky]

many articles on www.dalitvoice.org explain what is going on

[SaRpAnCh]

The plan is to make is to merge the Sikhs of Panjab into Hinduism through this way,if a Sikh aserts the truness of his faith and adheres to all the values of Sikhi ,they are automatically independent of all Hindu Rituals and the entire Hindu religion.This does not fit in with the Ideology of the Hindutva terrorists.Their aim is to merge Sikhi with Hinduism any Sikh who opposes this merger is a terrorist or Paki Agent.

They specifcially prmote caste - a Hindu value in to Sikh families to cause division and spilts within Hindu comunity.Sikhs claim and most Sikh groups claim that only so called low caste Sikhs go to deras or Babas - due to 'discrimination',this is not true as far as I am personally concerned ,Sikhs of ALL 'CASTES' go to deras and baba's.

The deras are designed to finish of the enitiy of Shabad Guru and replace it with a Human Guru ie: Namdhari Guru Jagjit,Narkhdhariya Gurbachna,Darshan Das,Ram Raheem,Bhanyarehvala,Ahsutosh and so on.These lot are actiley supported by the Hindutva forces as they are NOT a threat to their evil ideology like true Sikhi is which preaches open freedom and equality and freedom of choice of religion.So by attacking the very core - Shabad Guru and replacing it with these human gurus - defeats 'Sab Sikhon Ko Hukam Hai GURU MANIO GRANTH', I say again 'GURU MANIO GRANTH' without the Guru Granth Sahib Ji being accepted as the sole supreme and only immortal Guru one cannot be a Sikh and if one rejects this he/she if not a Sikh by practice but can only be by name if they say.

So once Shabad Guru is out of the way they make the sheep followers believe in the Human Gurus who incorporate Sikhi with Hinduism to merge the two all in all the game is detach Sikhs from Sikhism - Guru Granth Sahib replace it with a Human Guru Deravadh,promote the Dera then slowly incorproate Hindu ideals within it and rituals and before anyone notices - there are no Sikhs left!

Any true Sikh is a threat to Hindutva and Deravadh,thats why the issue of Sikh Hindu unity is brooguht up as anyone in Hinduism can be a reincarnation of a certain God while in Sikhi we have one sole Guru.

I was not going to comment on this topic - but yeah thats what I have to say