Fear For A Naxalite Attack On Takht Sri Patna Sahib?

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

There are numerous Guerilla/Socialist Movements, that you could find books on

Zapitistas

Black Panther Party

Maoist

etc

Also, I would not be surprsied if Naxals became Anti-Khalistan when many involved in the movement abandoned the recognition of the movement as a struggle to free all liberated people from the shackles of Indian slavery, and fell victims to Indira's ploy to make it a Sikh-Hindu conflict.

thats very interesting

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

many babbars were former naxalites

some naxalites (not all) betrayed many sikh militants (i am not saying the babbars betrayed anyone)

naxalites are by their very nature anti khalistan - they believe in an united india but one which is nearly communist but more socialist.

tohra was close to the naxalites

surjeet singh comrade (anti khalistan) was known to have a gang of naxalites at his disposal. he was close to tohra

what do sikh's believe in?

it's funny how we have "Sikh" peoples names as anti-khalistani. there are many who arent comrades but are anti-khalistan

anyhow...

i been tryin to read more about the movement(Nex) and there are different sources providing different information/stories. reminds me of something most non-sikhs go through to learn about khalistan etc lol

i have questions:

1. is Naxalbadi in East or West Bengal? (makes a huge difference to me)

2. Is East Bengal still supporting the west(which is part of india)...kinda like "east and west" punjabi eh?

3. why do they want to change the whole india/or united india?? (dont sikh (khalistanis) want a separate state/nation where Delhi and other parts which consists of most of the india in a way?funny thing is sikhs are divided on this too..." the boundaries of khalistan?" )

4. what will they/Nax get out of it if india did become socialist? (answer it so the young ones here can know something as well. it's been yrs since i have studied socialism etc at collg)

bhul chuk muaf karni

wjkk wjkf!

[Muzumdar]

I will not respond to hawk13 as he has provided no sources and his ramblings are generally incoherent and based on what can only be described as a complete lack of education.

As for the others, I will try my best to simplify and contextualise a highly complex subject.

Before I do, first and foremost, we should remember to separate the Naxalite movement from the Khalistani one. They are two separate things. They only overlapped in Punjab due to circumstance.

Dashmesh regiment

Naxalites are not anti-Khalistan as a rule: they simply want to transform India. However, as I have said, while the struggle was in its early stages, some Naxalites did pass a resolution supporting the Sikh separatists based on the fact that the ASR was essentially a document of socialist demands (ie decentralisation of power).

An India under the Naxalites would be a very different India to what we see today. The first thing that they would do, like Mao and Chavez, would be to educate everyone and try to raise them out of poverty (China has a 90% literacy rate). These can only be described as good things.

Singhavelli

Also, I would not be surprsied if Naxals became Anti-Khalistan when many involved in the movement abandoned the recognition of the movement as a struggle to free all liberated people from the shackles of Indian slavery, and fell victims to Indira's ploy to make it a Sikh-Hindu conflict.

The Naxalites, for the most part, were indifferent to the Khalistan movement. The simple fact of the matter is that most Sikhs are also anti-Khalistan for a whole host of reasons.

Kaur khalistani

what do sikh's believe in?

Well this is part of the problem with the Sikh Nation; certain sections of it cannot, or are unwilling to, accept that there are numerous perceptions, beliefs and ways of looking at things and that all Sikhs are, in essence, individuals, with their own brains and have diverse opinions.

So to say that ‘Sikhs believe in x y or z’, in the political sphere, is pointless because we all have different opinions.

is Naxalbadi in East or West Bengal? (makes a huge difference to me)

So, of all the research you did, you didn’t bother reading the link I gave you. My link clearly states in the first line that Naxalbari is a village in West Bengal. For the second time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naxalite#History

2. Is East Bengal still supporting the west(which is part of india)...kinda like "east and west" punjabi eh?

This is a meaningless question. It is like saying: ‘do Londoners support the congestion charge?’. Some do, some don’t, others don’t care.

why do they want to change the whole india/or united india??

Like I have already said, the Naxalites are an INDIA-WIDE organisation, they are not concentrated in the Punjab and have had relatively little impact there compared with the rest of India.

Please just read the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naxalite

dont sikh (khalistanis) want a separate state/nation where Delhi and other parts which consists of most of the india in a way?

Yes, they are fantasists.

what will they/Nax get out of it if india did become socialist?

‘They’ will get to restructure the country along Socialist lines: free health care, redistribution of wealth, education for all, the abolition of caste distinctions etc etc (in theory).

Perhaps you should get your books out again.

[hawk13]

I will not respond to hawk13 as he has provided no sources and his ramblings are generally incoherent and based on what can only be described as a complete lack of education.

As for the others, I will try my best to simplify and contextualise a highly complex subject.

Before I do, first and foremost, we should remember to separate the Naxalite movement from the Khalistani one. They are two separate things. They only overlapped in Punjab due to circumstance.

Dashmesh regiment

Naxalites are not anti-Khalistan as a rule: they simply want to transform India. However, as I have said, while the struggle was in its early stages, some Naxalites did pass a resolution supporting the Sikh separatists based on the fact that the ASR was essentially a document of socialist demands (ie decentralisation of power).

An India under the Naxalites would be a very different India to what we see today. The first thing that they would do, like Mao and Chavez, would be to educate everyone and try to raise them out of poverty (China has a 90% literacy rate). These can only be described as good things.

Singhavelli

Also, I would not be surprsied if Naxals became Anti-Khalistan when many involved in the movement abandoned the recognition of the movement as a struggle to free all liberated people from the shackles of Indian slavery, and fell victims to Indira's ploy to make it a Sikh-Hindu conflict.

The Naxalites, for the most part, were indifferent to the Khalistan movement. The simple fact of the matter is that most Sikhs are also anti-Khalistan for a whole host of reasons.

Kaur khalistani

what do sikh's believe in?

Well this is part of the problem with the Sikh Nation; certain sections of it cannot, or are unwilling to, accept that there are numerous perceptions, beliefs and ways of looking at things and that all Sikhs are, in essence, individuals, with their own brains and have diverse opinions.

So to say that ‘Sikhs believe in x y or z’, in the political sphere, is pointless because we all have different opinions.

is Naxalbadi in East or West Bengal? (makes a huge difference to me)

So, of all the research you did, you didn’t bother reading the link I gave you. My link clearly states in the first line that Naxalbari is a village in West Bengal. For the second time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naxalite#History

2. Is East Bengal still supporting the west(which is part of india)...kinda like "east and west" punjabi eh?

This is a meaningless question. It is like saying: ‘do Londoners support the congestion charge?’. Some do, some don’t, others don’t care.

why do they want to change the whole india/or united india??

Like I have already said, the Naxalites are an INDIA-WIDE organisation, they are not concentrated in the Punjab and have had relatively little impact there compared with the rest of India.

Please just read the link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naxalite

dont sikh (khalistanis) want a separate state/nation where Delhi and other parts which consists of most of the india in a way?

Yes, they are fantasists.

what will they/Nax get out of it if india did become socialist?

‘They’ will get to restructure the country along Socialist lines: free health care, redistribution of wealth, education for all, the abolition of caste distinctions etc etc (in theory).

Perhaps you should get your books out again.

U called me a uneducated I accept u need source biggest proof is TINNAMMEN CHOWK MAASSARE IN 1989 OF CHINESE STUDENTS WILL U JUSTIFY IT YES,AND CHANGE OF L NAME OF LENINGRAD TO PETERBURG . DO NOT PROPAGATE ANTI RELIGION REJECTED IDELOGY .SEE THE CHENSE HISTORY OF CULTURAL REVOLUTION OF 70S WHEN RED GUARD CLASHED WITH CHENSE ARMY RESULT UR MAD MAO WAS PUT BEHIND BARS AND DIED IN DETENTION . SEE THE RECENT ASK ANY CHENSE ABOUT MAO THEY JUST BREAK THE HEAD OF FANS OF MAO.U NEED SOURCE WHAT HAPPENED IN RUMANIA IN1989 WAS SHOWN IN WORLD MEDIA WHERE A BLOOD THRISTY LEFTIST HEAD OF THE STATE WAS PUBLICLY EXECUTED. DO NOT SHOW MIRAGE TO YOUNG MINDS. WHY PRO NAXAL HINDI SPEAKING ARE KILLED BY LEFTIST ARMED GROUPS LIKE NSCN . IAM A HUMBLE SINGH NOT HAVE EGO AND NEVER SHOW MIRAGE LIKE U .NSCN AND ULFA R LEFTISTS GROUPS OF NORTH EAST.U NEED SOURCE U CAN GET THE DETAILS OF TRIAL OF SERIAL KILLER OF RUSSIA WHO USED TO EAT HUMAN FLESH HE disclosed that during forcible industrialisation of SOVIET UNION many farmers were turned in to factory workers and famine like situation was created and some farmers restored to eating human flesh that is the result of ur leftist rule. BIGGEST SOURCE IS FAMOUS SIBERIAN PRISON OF RUSSIA WHERE ONE MILLION ANTI COMMUNISTS WERE KEPT THIS WAS DISCLOSED BY GORVOCHOV THE FORMER SOVIET PRESIDENT SEE THE BIOGRAPHY OF HIM HE LOST HIS ENTIRE FAMILY TO COMMUNISTS.

[hawk13]

MY friend MAZUMDHAR SHOULD GO INTO THE TRIAL OF1993 OF UNIVERSITY TEACHER OF RUSSIA FROM WHOSE REFERIGIATOR human heads were recovered secondly sikh movement is not dead it has assumed political shape very soon u will the see good results .My friend mazumdar do not have answers and call me an uneducated man yES Iam as a most humble singh who believes in GURU JI teaching not like MAZUMDAR WHO NEVER BELIEVE IN GOD.BUT I STILL REGARD HIM MY FRIEND AND HAVE NOTHING AGAINIST HIM I JUST SPOKE THE TRUTH IN MOST BEFITTING MANNER

[Muzumdar]

U called me a uneducated

No. I said that you write your posts as though you are uneducated. I have no idea whether you are or not.

I accept u need source biggest proof is TINNAMMEN CHOWK MAASSARE IN 1989 OF CHINESE STUDENTS WILL U JUSTIFY IT YES,AND CHANGE OF L NAME OF LENINGRAD TO PETERBURG .

For the last time, Naxalite ideology is specifically involved in INDIA. What this means is that the Naxalites have never been to Russia, China, Australia or The Democratic Republic of Congo or any other random country that you are mentioning.

DO NOT PROPAGATE ANTI RELIGION REJECTED IDELOGY

I'm not propagating anything. I'm not even a Naxalite or a Socialist. I'm just trying to present a truthful picture of the movement. You are just trying my patience.

SEE THE CHENSE HISTORY OF CULTURAL REVOLUTION OF 70S WHEN RED GUARD CLASHED WITH CHENSE ARMY RESULT UR MAD MAO WAS PUT BEHIND BARS AND DIED IN DETENTION .

Mao was not a Naxalite.

.U NEED SOURCE WHAT HAPPENED IN RUMANIA IN1989 WAS SHOWN IN WORLD MEDIA WHERE A BLOOD THRISTY LEFTIST HEAD OF THE STATE WAS PUBLICLY EXECUTED.

Ceauşescu was not a Naxalite.

DO NOT SHOW MIRAGE TO YOUNG MINDS.

I think you'll find that you are the one with the mirage, smoke and mirrors.

WHY PRO NAXAL HINDI SPEAKING ARE KILLED BY LEFTIST ARMED GROUPS LIKE NSCN .

Incoherent rambling.

HE disclosed that during forcible industrialisation of SOVIET UNION many farmers were turned in to factory workers and famine like situation was created and some farmers restored to eating human flesh that is the result of ur leftist rule.

Are you talking about Stalin? That was called Stalinism, not Marxist-Leninism.

MY friend MAZUMDHAR SHOULD GO INTO THE TRIAL OF1993 OF UNIVERSITY TEACHER OF RUSSIA FROM WHOSE REFERIGIATOR

I hate to break it to you, but the Soviet Union officially collapsed in 1991 so anything after is the work of your capitalist overlords. But don't worry, I won't go into a rant about how capitalism is evil and start shouting like you.

secondly sikh movement is not dead it has assumed political shape very soon u will the see good results

Yeah, I mean with people like you at the helm, how can we fail! (Note: sarcasm).

BUT I STILL REGARD HIM MY FRIEND AND HAVE NOTHING AGAINIST HIM I JUST SPOKE THE TRUTH IN MOST BEFITTING MANNER

Grow up. Stop taking things so personally. Just because I rip your arguments to pieces, it doesn't mean I don't respect you or that I don't like you.

You are my brother.

[V]

I hate disturbing the peace in this thread....

We will be fooling ourself if we trust these bastards leftists H.S SURJEET WAS THE ONE OF THE FOUNDER OF NAXALITE MOVEMENT.

I don't know much about naxalites; but I do know that H.S Surjeet wasn't a bad bunda. The man was actually involved in finding a solution in the heat of the early 80's; and did find a solution to the problems, that the Sikhs agreed to - but was later on rejected by Indira Gandhi.

Quote from a research paper I wrote on 84:

Harkishan Singh Surjeet, belonging to the Communist Party, which was involved when opposition parties were brought in to negotiate, told Mark Tully that a settlement was again reached early 1983, but Mrs Gandhi again ditched it. He narrates: “three times in six months an agreement was reached and three times the Prime Minister backed out. Each time the interest of Indus of Haryana weighed more heavily with her than a settlement with the Sikhs.”486

486 Mark Tully & Satish Jacob; ‘Amritsar: Mrs Gandhi’s’ Last Battle (London, 1986) PP 91

As far as I've read I've never found any references that indicate that he was a dodgy bunda :D

Please get your facts straight.

Also Hawk veer ji; you seem to have an issue with leftist concepts - what is all the "kirt karo; wand shako" about?

What is the Langar/Pangat about? What is the Daswand about? What is the "get rid of your ego" all about?

isn't it the right wing that focuses on the "individual" and "classism"?

Read Guru Granth Sahib Ji; and Sikh history; you'll find out how much Marx writings remind of Sikhi. Yes Marxists are atheist. So what? If we think of ourselves as "keere"; then it doens't matter where we get it from; as long as we get it - the knowledge. Wasn't Guru Nanak Dev Ji and Marx talking about the same class equality?

Let's see ourselves as lowest of the low; only as such can we learn from everyone; if our hunkar is saying; "APA TA EHNEY BUDEY HA" - "we've got it all"; then we won't learn from anyone - whether it's the school teacher or if it's from Satguru himself

[kaur_khalistani_lioness]

So, of all the research you did, you didn’t bother reading the link I gave you. My link clearly states in the first line that Naxalbari is a village in West Bengal. For the second time: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naxalite#History

Muzumdar im sorry again i was being lazy, and i dont rarely check wikidperdia information....just because it wasnt really something that was recognized as a source in my research classes...so my mind jut skipped that unconsciously.(plus, if i may use a valid excuse, it was really late and i was tired/sleepy)i was using Google to get answers for some of my questions. there was just to much to read and i didnt have time, so i took the easy route to get info and answers. thats the point of forums innit?

but thank u so much for taking your time to write all u have and being patient with me.

i dont know about anyone else but im learning a lot from this discussion. nevr really got a chance to hear anyone elses views properly or get into a discussion on Naxiliets except what i heard here and there.

so most of it is making me expand my mind a lil

thank u all=)

[guptveer1469]

*edit*

i'm embarassing myself

[Muzumdar]

kaur khalistani

but thank u so much for taking your time to write all u have and being patient with me.

Pleasure.

Sunny

i dont agree with the methods of naxalites

Good for you. Nobody is asking you to agree with anything.

.. they fight for something that isnt theirs !

They are fighting for human rights, and human rights belong to everyone.

isnt it muzumdar bro?

Isn't what?

the sikhs were fighting for THEIR HOMELAND - which belonged to them

Well, if we are going to get technical, no, they were not fighting for the homeland that once 'belonged to them'. The homeland that once 'belonged to them' stretched from Kabul to Nepal (Ranjit's Sikh Kingdom) and would most certainly have included Nankana Sahib and Lahore.

The Sikh freedom fighters of the 80s didn't include Lahore or Nankana Sahib in their plans because they didn't want to upset their Pakistani overlords.

The Sikh movements of the 80s didn't know what they were fighting for geographically or constitutionally and that is why they ultimately failed.

but does whole Hindustan (not india - coz pakistan and khalistan is india) belong to those naxalites??

You don't understand Socialism. It is not about land, it is about how people are able to live in perfect equality within a land.

they have no right to fight for that

So you are saying they have no right to fight for equality, justice and an end to poverty? What kind of a person are you?

... thats what i dont get..

Well if you don't get it, perhaps you should zip it and stop making comments on something you know nothing about. By all means ask intelligent questions, but stop passing judgment on a topic you clearly have no clue about.

and as hawk brother pointed our we can't compare them to sikhs in 80s coz they are far superior in numbers

According to what statistics?

, even with their numbers don't dare to have a real encounter with police or army

Got any evidence to back that claim up? No, didn't think so.

Do you know where Naxalite fighters live today, in 2008? They live in the jungles and forests of India, because they are hunted down by police and the army. Does that remind you of anything?

no offend intended

You're not offending me, you're just embarrassing yourself with your silly comments.