How Should Be Interrupt Pathans Glorying Ahmed Shah Abdali?

[Raju]

>>Nice try. Some key differences though. Indira's actioins cannot in any way shape or form be considered 'leftist'. She didn't consider herself a 'leftist'. Hence I find you referring to her as one problematic.

What do you mean 'nice try' .. ?

Are you saying Stalin was entirely different .. a kindly soul ?

Indeed, but why 'get Indira assasinated' in November 1984? What possible purpose could it serve at that point in time? If you can't answer this conclusively, then it is just another conspiracy theory.

to further their geo-political goals in India and the region.

to increase economic leverage since Indira was blocking India's economic integration into west.

this is what increased Indira's paranoia.

[chatanga]

quoting raju "chatanga, you want to exist in a comfort zone where Sikhs have done no wrong"

not at all. i know that one very worng thing the sikhs did was to accept inclusion into hindustan. It was a very bad mistake.

And we are still paying the price 60 odd years later.

What kind of zone do you exist in raju?

im thinking the kind of zone that has no regards for any one or any community that doesnt aspire to your standards of beleiving in the indian state.

Only a state that deserves our loyalty will get our loyalty. Only an <banned word filter activated> would be loyal to a state that seeks to destroy him and his people.

[Raju]

quoting raju "chatanga, you want to exist in a comfort zone where Sikhs have done no wrong"

not at all. i know that one very worng thing the sikhs did was to accept inclusion into hindustan. It was a very bad mistake.

And we are still paying the price 60 odd years later

that is not an admission of a wrong .. I do have colourful analogies for such admissions but will reserve that for a later day whem emotions do not run high.

how is it that a human being can say with a straight face .. that *I have not sinned* ?

For a beginning ask the Chinese if the Sikhs did any wrong to them .. I can show you film clips where you have Sikh recruits of British Army patrolling the streets and doing things that do not exactly cover oneself in glory.

It is one thing to sit around and blame Hindus for all ills plaguing a group of people and it is another thing to at least be a bit humble while constantly mocking other groups of humans.

Learn to accept mistakes and then when you fling accusations at others, they become start sounding all the more credible. The world sits up to listen what's going on.

Mind you as I sit here I am not saying these words in a combative tone, but in a remorseful one wherein I see all manner of hatred being propagated without any attempt at introspection.

[cool water]

Talking of 60years later....it reminds me of the fool Master tara singh, he was possibly the worst sikh leader ever in our history. Millions of Sikhs suffered because of his ill judged leadership and actions. We cant afford to have idiots like him ever represent us again. Leadership should be given to those who have superiour intellect/wisedom

[Raju]

This world is just a temporary drama. The thing that really matters is what happens in the sachi dargaah of Akaal Purakh. In that dargah only people imbued with Naam are honoured and poor people like abdaali and indira gandhi, their faces are blackened and are sent to hell.

Othai sache he sach nibrai, chunn vakh kadde jajmalaiya.

thaoo na payinnn kuuriyaar, MOOH KALA DOJAK CHALLIYAA.

right now, we are living in the end of Kalyug. But as you know the Sun shines brightest before it sets.

peak of Kalyug was between 1600 and 1800.

[dalsingh101]

Try minding your own business!

The same way Columbus is celebrated as a hero for white Americans whilst he was the precursor to much genocide of native American Indians and the destruction of their culture is the same for Abdali and us.

Sikhs have enough on their plate to worry about stuff like this. Abdali will be a hero to pathans and a dusht for us.

[SunSingh]

Raju,

If Indira Gandhi made a mere error in judgment, than why was that error repeated on dozens of Sikh Gurdwaras SIMULTANEOUSLY??

[Raju]

Raju,

If Indira Gandhi made a mere error in judgment, than why was that error repeated on dozens of Sikh Gurdwaras SIMULTANEOUSLY??

Please do not make it out that I am defending Mrs. Indira Gandhi.

I have enough sins on myself and have no pressing need to carry Mrs. Indira Gandhi's sins on my shoulder as well.

& where have I said what she did was right .. have only asked folks to give a bit of leeway since politicians depend upon their advisors. And in Indira's case her intelligence agencies .. however flawed be their inputs. Her chief secretary R. K. Dhavan was himself indicted as having a role in her murder. below is a sample of how her intelligence bosses and advisors might tell her ..

So if they say .. hello Mrs. Gandhi this is the situation on the ground .. it's volatile .. so and so is hell bent on defying you .. he wants to humiliate you .. he is already in touch with a neighbouring country "P" .. and that neighbouring country "P" is already in touch with a superpower "U" and apparently "U" has rushed advisors to "P" to infiltrate field agents into the troubled Indian state.

Madam, .. we have also come to know from sources .. that the neighbouring country "P" is supplying heavy weapons and they are being stacked in places of worship of community "S".

Once they gather enough ammunition and stock up on weapons .. it is "P"s plan to engineer an event and create such severe law & order problems that they will use that pretext to declare their support to Independent state. Superpower "U" is also waiting in "P" it's ally to infiltrate agents who are highly trained in aiding and organising civil insurgency.

Madam .. please suggest what should we do now ??

what is a lone paranoid woman supposed to do then ?

If she errs on judgement and says something wrong then it can spiral out into something really large because of so many seen and unseen factors causing trouble. Ultimately all responsibility of anything done right or royally screwed up rests on her shoulders.

She might not have had a malicious intent .. that's all I am saying.

Now all you guys don't hang me for it.

[chatanga]

Raju, we are not hanging you for anything. You are hanging yourself. How? By giving us riduculuos scenarios of the west killing gandhi.

quote raju :"Mind you as I sit here I am not saying these words in a combative tone, but in a remorseful one wherein I see all manner of hatred being propagated without any attempt at introspection. "

You're damn right im hateful. I have evry right to be angry as well. If you think that being angry is wrong, then i dont think that you are human. Or at least a human with a conscince anyway.

We did NOT ask for this war. It was forced upon us. But if we defend ourselves suddenly we are the guilty party. Self-defence is not violence, it is inteligence.

[Muzumdar]

What do you mean 'nice try' .. ?

Are you saying Stalin was entirely different .. a kindly soul ?

I am saying that you are not comparing like with like. Let me spell it out for you:

Stalin was a Communist through and through and rose to power on a hard left platform.

Indira was a scion of a Congress dynasty that was centre right and never pretended to be anything else. She rose to power on the Congress right wing ticket, not some left wing agenda.

to further their geo-political goals in India and the region.

to increase economic leverage since Indira was blocking India's economic integration into west.

this is what increased Indira's paranoia.

What 'economic leverage' was achieved with the murder of Indira?

Why was economic integration dependent on Indira's death?

I agree that she was a thorn in the side of the US, but she was small fry compared to the real Cold War that was being fought in Afghanistan. Dead or alive, Indira was completely irrelevant to the barren wasteland of Afganistan where the war was being fought. Ipso facto, having her 'assasinated' would serve little purpose in the long or short term.