Should monay be allowed to preach sikhi?

[Guest mehtab]

The Guru Granth Sahib is not exclusive to Sikhs - it is a universal Granth open to all humanity. How can someone teach love and humanity if they themselves feel that they are 'more' Sikh than others? - this in my view is ego!

[V]

Agreed with quotes given by SOGGS ji .

'Gupti' Keertan/Paath from Guru Sahib, can be done by ANYONE. BUT not in Sangat.

You can do Kirtan for your own benifit, do Paath on your own, but doing paath i.e Akhand Path is STRICTLY for ONLY Sikhs. As for preaching, as Veer ji quoted, from what I understand it means - one who PREACHES - AAP NA KARE - who doesn't do it themself, will - AVAT JAVAT JANME MARE - i.e will be reincarnated over and over.

I agree with 'anon'

sikhi is a universal religion, does it really say "only the sardar can do this, only the sardar can do that, you cant do this because your a moona"?

Akal Takht has given hukam - is tha not end of discussion - or are we higher authoroty than Akal Takhat?

is that not like caste?

No - cause one who is following - only HE/SHE Cna preach

Guru Gobind Singh ji m

ade Amrit SANCHAR . Not PARCHAR . He didn't jsut PREACH - he did it as well!

the main issue in life is to become one with maharaj, that is done through kirtan. your problems are solved, by doing kirtan, why are people trying to stop people from doing kirtan, people have dukhi you know!

No1 is stopping anyone from doign Kirtan, do it yourself, in privacy - like you say - u should be Gupt :wub:

i challenge every gursikh on this site, that if you say only sardars can ONLY do kirtan on stage, why arent you stopping all these hindus/sikhs doing kirtan. i saw one guy, hes a moona, from hardiwar (his cassttee), now if this guy can play shabad, and i can tell you he's pretty good, why arent you doing all the mass demonstrations saying get him off, dont let him do kirtan.

He's not following MARYADA - it's liek saying 'he and she doesn't do this - so and so does this - why don't u stop him'

The local Sangat has to take action and be aware of the Maryada!

go on, write to the SGPC, go on, email t-series and say never let him sing again. his jatha consists of amritdharis, why arent they stopping him?

will hthey suffer or will we?

just because no1 is stopping them doesn't mean it'

s OKAY?!

heck, bhai chaman lal ji used to be a moona as well, i got his casstes from them days as well. no-one stopped him, but out of pyaar did he become a singh.

actually they DID!

he had to take Amrit! - i think he was given HUkam tha you can only continue if you take Amrit hence why he's an Amritdhari now

Bhai Chaman Lal Singh!

i say, no-one can stop anyone from doing kirtan, anyone who does try and stop someone are fools, because people have there own way of getting to maharaj (many paths lead to one, by the way,).

NO1s stpiing u from doing it!

do it - but not in SANGAT!

Didi Guru Gobind SIngh ji let the Singh who did Chaur Sahib ji on him, after he removed ONE WHITE HAIR - did he let him contineu with the Seva?

NO!

of course i dont do kirtan, i'd have to learn the vaajaa. but, i am not being hypocritical, if any moona does want to do kirtan, they should be allowed.

you've got this missunderstanding tha you CAN'T DO KIRTAN - no1s tellign you NOT to do so, just not in Sangat.. Bhai Sahi that refers to Moorakhs like me as well, who havn't been blessed with Amrit di Daat YET - it's just to continue striving for it :cool:

why cant they? its the same like "you cant have darshan of guru ji because your a moona", guru ji does not turn anyone away from his darbar.

No it's not the same. So are u saying Guru Gobind SIngh ji made the wrong decition when he didn't let the Bhai Sahib do Seva, after he removed ONE white hair from his beard?

but on the hyprocritical views, its wrong, because guru ji said, if you dont practise what you preach, its a sin. but i still think moona's should be allowed to do kirtan. a moona doing katha in life, i would say thats wrong, because katha is basically "do this, do that". thats, where being the singh would count because, thats what all the kathas i heard in life said. so it be stupid, if you saw someone like me saying "amrit peevo, nirmal rasna" and yet you see a moona saying this, yet he hasnt taken amrit. i would consider that funny, because the guy isnt practising what he preaches. doing this, is a very very very bad/big sin.

doing kirtan, yes its ok.

doing katha, no.

bhai sahib - you decide , but according to Akal takht - not in Sangat, baki tuadi Marji.

bhull chukk maaf karni Sangat ji

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[GurSa Singh]

Last vaisakhi, at the 'relaxed' Ramgharia Gurdwara there was a family who sang the shabad 'Waho, Waho Gobind Singh'. All the family had blatant trimmed hair and blatant trimmed beards. So when it came to them singing 'Peevo Phaul Khanday Da' it looked odd, it felt odd. It just looked hypocritical.

If there is genuine love for Guruji surely you take the step or aim to take the step to take on Guruji's roop.

Just my opinion.

[sikhi]

I agree with you guys that a Gursikh should only be able to do Paath/kirtan/katha for the Sanget.

But any one is allowed to read Bani but should be Gupt.

My question is what about Udasis, Nirmalas doing kirtan/Paath/katha in the Gurdwara for the Sanget.

As Udasis, Nirmalas are Sikhs, with a different roop to the Khalsa Singh.

[DhadiMania]

ok bhai chaman lal singh was ordered to take amrit, but what about this new guy from haridwar? he has a musla topi, glasses and moustache (well actually the topi is one of them afghan ones), so why is it no-one is saying anything to this haridwar guy? hes doing it to the sangat, not privatly as MR Singh was saying.

hang on a minute, if you do kirtan with the sangat, you benefit more, seeing that your doing this in front of sggs. if you do this in front of maharaj, then the rewards are bigger and better, because like the flood it sweeps everything away, like your dukh.

doing it by yourself is good, but not as big, because no-one is listening and plus the fact the rewards are like small raindrops.

if akal takhat has given this hukam, then thats fine, but why arent they targetting the haridwar guy? this haridwar guy travels alot as well. why is it people are so concerned themselves on people doing kirtan in sangat, if you wont take action?

Didi Guru Gobind SIngh ji let the Singh who did Chaur Sahib ji on him, after he removed ONE WHITE HAIR - did he let him contineu with the Seva?

mr singh, email me or pm me or say the story here on the forum. i am interested on this one. mr singh, so your saying that guru ji does not live in shabad?

bhai sahib, i dont do kirtan in sangat, but if akal takhat has given hukam, then they should crack down. heck i seen quite a few people on shabad kirtan (on alpha pun

jabi) doing kirtan. obviously the sgpc has seen this, so they should stick to the hukamnama and do something about it. plus the haridwar guy is famous (go to the local gurdwara shop, and i guarantee its there)

[V]

Firstly, I'd just to say tha I don't want to get this into a debate veer ji, as I'm sure you seee Akal Takht's Hukam much higher than our own opinions right?

ok bhai chaman lal singh was ordered to take amrit, but what about this new guy from haridwar? he has a musla topi, glasses and moustache (well actually the topi is one of them afghan ones), so why is it no-one is saying anything to this haridwar guy? hes doing it to the sangat, not privatly as MR Singh was saying.

I have no ide awho this 'Haridwar Guy' - a lot of respect ur giving to a person reading Gurbani

Anyway, I'll simply say - so ? it doesn't mean its RIGHT

the Anand Karj that just occured, where they took Maharaj to a PUB - is tha right, even tho most of the Sangat didn't complain (if i'm not mistaken)

was it right of taking Maharaj to a pub and do Anand Karj?

- becaue no1 complains doesn't mean IT's RIGHT!

ang on a minute, if you do kirtan with the sangat, you benefit more, seeing t

hat your doing this in front of sggs. if you do this in front of maharaj, then the rewards are bigger and better, because like the flood it sweeps everything away, like your dukh.

that's true - LISTENING to KIRTAN in Guru Sahib ji's Hazoori is also very Benificial

Also, I never said you can't do it in Guru Sahib ji'z hazoori, like doing Paath from Guru ji - do it on your own PRIVATELY - but do NOT inist upon doing it in Sanga - if you're not a SIKH.

That refers to me as well :wub:

doing it by yourself is good, but not as big, because no-one is listening and plus the fact the rewards are like small raindrops.

well no if you LISTEN in Sangat - you don't neessairly have to sit on the STAGE and do Kirtan - to get MORE 'necter'

if akal takhat has given this hukam, then thats fine, but why arent they targetting the haridwar guy?

CALL AND TELL THEM!

We can argue - the HUkam of Akal Takht is tha you can't take Guru Sahib to a HALL - a lot worse - a PUB. It was done just this last weekend in a Gurdwara in Milton keyns -

'who cares - If Akal takhat

does then let them do it themselves' - is THAT our THINKING of today?

Instead of sitting and complaing over people, why not REPORT IT TO AKAL TAKHT if they don't know of it.

Some Singhs had a long conversation with the committee of tha Gurdwara, and concluded tha they woudl report it to Akal Takht - they didn't jsut say -

'It's Akal TAkhts Business - let them find out for themselves'

this haridwar guy travels alot as well. why is it people are so concerned themselves on people doing kirtan in sangat, if you wont take action?

I have NO idea of who this Ragi is - but REPORT IT TO AKAL TAKHT - send a LETTER to Akal Takht - DOn't email them!

Sedn them a letter, or even better - mee them persoanlly and speak with them - yoou do know tha you CAN speak to Vedanti when you go to Akal Takht?

Didi Guru Gobind SIngh ji let the Singh who did Chaur Sahib ji on him, after he removed ONE WHITE HAIR - did he let him contineu with the Seva?

mr singh, email me or pm me or say the story here on the forum. i am interested on this one. mr singh, so your saying that guru ji does not live in shabad?

Daas was speaking about Guru Gobind Singh ji.

I was listening to a katha - which I THINK was by BHai Guriqbal Singh ji, where he said tha there was this Singh doign Chaur Sahib di Seva of Guru Gobind Singh ji Maharaj, and next day Guru ji Didn't allow him to, when he asked Why Guru ji said - think urself, the other guy said - ' I HAVN'T DONE ANYTHING'

And Guru ji said - U have ONE white hair in your beard yesturday - where is it!

bhai sahib, i dont do kirtan in sangat, but if akal takhat has given hukam, then they should crack down. heck i seen quite a few people on shabad kirtan (on alpha punjabi) doing kirtan. obviously the sgpc has seen this, so they should stick to the hukamnama and do something about it.

REPORT IT! they might NOT have seen/noticed him - they have a LOT of things to do you see.

plus the haridwar guy is famous (go to the local gurdwara shop, and i guarantee its there)

I have no idea who you are talking about - perhaps a name would be nice?

Now I suggest you mail Akal Takht a letter reporting him, and they WILL take it up.

Anyways, I don't want to continue, and lead this into a debate, hence daas will conclude by saying - please forgive me if I have offended you.

Do Contact Akal Takht if you find a 'hole' in the Rehit Maryada :cool:

bhull chukk maaf karni

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Gupti]

Its funny how people quote from the Akal Takht when it suits them.

There is a post elsewhere about 'Bhatra' Sikhs eating meat in the Gurdawara. Surely, if we go by Akal Takht Hukam, then this is fine as long as the meat is jhatka?

Also, I feel no warmth or belonging to the current Jathedars of Sikhi - the heretical SGPC. They have created a money making machine out of Sikhi and for that I will never forgive them.

Ask all Gurdwares to returnmoney given to them by monay if they really believe a non-Amritdhari cannot do kirtan.

The Guru Granth Sahib is not exclusive to Sikhs - it is a universal Granth open to all humanity. How can someone teach love and humanity if they themselves feel that they are 'more' Sikh than others? - this in my view is ego!

[V]

Its funny how people quote from the Akal Takht when it suits them.

There is a post elsewhere about 'Bhatra' Sikhs eating meat in the Gurdawara.  Surely, if we go by Akal Takht Hukam, then this is fine as long as the meat is jhatka?

Wrong. Akal Takht recently issued a hukamnama tha meat can NOT be served in Guru-ka-Langar!

There was some issue in Malaysia I think it was

Also, I feel no warmth or belonging to the current Jathedars of Sikhi - the heretical SGPC.  They have created a money making machine out of Sikhi and for that I will never forgive them.

yeah, some leaders are corrupt, but I tihnk it's wrong to accuse the whole SGPC, who in the 1920s freed Gurdware from Mahants!

Ask all Gurdwares to returnmoney given to them by

monay if they really believe a non-Amritdhari cannot do kirtan.

Seems like you didn't read my post correctly :wub:

Bhenji, I said that they can not to Kirtan in SANGAT.

a Mona gives money from his prem love, and I doubt any 'Mona' would want his money thrown back in his face :cool:

As for doign Kirtan - Ji saad ke karo Kirtan - but NOT IN SANGAT!

perhaps after bhog - in the house?

A 'mona' can do Seva, Best Seva - Joreya di Seva, Bhandeya di Seva- THAT'S THE Seva we ALL should be doing. THe Sevas tha take away 'MAI'!

The Guru Granth Sahib is not exclusive to Sikhs - it is a universal Granth open to all humanity. How can someone teach love and humanity if they themselves feel that they are 'more' Sikh than others? - this in my view is ego!

Rehit Bina nai Sikh kahavai!

Prihtam Rehat e jaan - KHANDEY KI PAHUL CHAKEY!

This clearly - catagorises me - tha I'm not a real Sikh - theres no sufch thign as being 'mroe Sikh or less Sikh'

Either you're a SIKH or you're not.

bhull chukk maaf

Waheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa

33;

Waheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!!

[Gupti]

Sorry Mr Singh, my post wasn't directed specifically at you. It was just a general diatribe.

Maybe the Bhatra example was bad, in light of what happened in Malaysia, but what about the general consensus about the consumption of meat?

It doesn't really matter, I feel that Sikhi is open to everyone, and if someone can do Kirtan as it was traditionally done (ie Raag) then they are upholding Guruji's honour.

[sikhi]

What about my question please, some one. I have been thinking about this question for some time now.

Here it is again

I agree with you guys that a Gursikh should only be able to do Paath/kirtan/katha for the Sanget.

But any one is allowed to read Bani but should be Gupt.

My question is what about Udasis, Nirmalas doing kirtan/Paath/katha in the Gurdwara for the Sanget.

As Udasis, Nirmalas are Sikhs, with a different roop to the Khalsa Singh.