Chairs

[good]

Wjkk wjkf ,we need help !

I am a Sikh from Edinburgh and we have 8 red cinema style seats with cup holders in the Darbar Sahib!

What can we do to get them removed. pls Help us!

[VanHelsingh]

Wjkk wjkf ,we need help !

I am a Sikh from Edinburgh and we have 8 red cinema style seats with cup holders in the Darbar Sahib!

What can we do to get them removed. pls Help us!

Its not a laughing matter but when you stated the seats had cup holders, I cracked up!!! Sorry.....

But seriously they could be for disabled people or elderley members of the congregation?

[Bundha]

Good,

you need to get organised. First get as many people who are like minded then set an approach that first asks the committee why the seats are there, any chairs need to be outside the darbar sahib.

First we had chairs, now we have cinema style seats with cup holders, we have also heard of a sofa in the darbar sahib, we fools are on a slippery slope, just like the masands.

Soon the cup holders will have cups of tea, because the person sitting in the chair cannot get up !!!!

People will be slouching in the sofas infront of Akaal Saroop Guru Granth Sahib Ji

These are truly dark times.

[HeatSikhingMissile]

In colder climates as people age, joint problems that our forefathers never dealt with have now become high number with many health problems where the older person cannot sit on the ground due to knee/osteopathic/hip/joint problems etc. Are they to be shunned from the Gurdwara? If it's 8 seats at the back of the hall it is most likely for such people with these issues.

[VanHelsingh]

@ Bundha - I suppose its best to get rid of them altogether.

Although I do wonder how disabled people or the elderly can be part of the sangat. Any suggestions? I see some Gurudwara's have TV screens in the langar hall which beam pictures from upstairs. However that's not the same as being part of the actual sangat is it?

[dalsingh101]

A Gurdwara I know has box type seats at the back and disabled and very old people on crutches use them regularly. I see no problem with this.

If aamh people try using them, then pull them up about it if it bothers you.

[Bundha]

There are a number of things you can do.

Just have the benches outside the darbar sahib. A gurdwara near us has done this, with cushion benches and heaters blowing warm air, very comfortable.

Why not make a long dug out at the back of the darbar sahib, fit benches and carpet it properly and maybe add heating so that the elderly can sit in darbar sahib but at the same level as the rest of the sangat.

Have them seated in a room next to the darbar sahib but have large windows for full view and speakers for sound.

There are many things that can be done, but we do not think it through, we now have sofas and cinema chairs, what next ?

[GuptMember]

Is it me or is this becoming more and more of an issue in recent times? I wonder how this situation of people not being able to sit on the floor was dealt with back in the days or even nowadays in India. I haven't seen a Gurdwara in India that have cinema seats in the darbar hall!!! There will be some legit people who have problems sitting on the floor and there will be other who will act/think they have problems, but they are only fooling themselves!

[gurdssingh]

I personally feel it depends on the persons physical abiltiy. What would our Guru JI's do if someone was incapable of sitting on the floor, reject them from darbar sahib? How about someone in a wheelchair young disabled or old bajurgh? Are they not allowed darshan of maharaj? Even if they had all the sharda and goodwill in the world, proper decent people, as they were incapable of of sitting on the floor or getting out of their wheelchair, we would deny them the right to enter and do darshan (homage) to baba ji's hazoori?

If its a king who has akaar (ego) and feels its his right to sit on a throne then yeah, give um a slap.

But those who can't physically and you deny them or make them feel akward by sitting at the back well think for yourself. By the way alot of people who look healthy but have back problems and can't sit on the floor but on a chair also reject them? Also why are the kirtani jatha allowed to sit at a higher level on a stage than the sangat? Not higher than Maharaj but the incapacitated sangat members are also at a level lower than baba ji.

[Only five]

The placement of chairs in Darbar Sahib gives way for manmat people to sit on chairs and disrepect Guru Sahib. Then if the person is approached and questioned, why doesn't he sit on the ground like rest of the sangat. He/she will disregard the person and say i can't, when it's completely visible the person can. This would cause a conflict and escalate into problems. So to avoid dilemmnas like this, the Gurdwaras should not put any chairs in Darbar Sahib. What they should do is put wheelchairs in the back, out of Darbar Sahib and when an old person who is unable to sit on the ground can take one and wheel it in. He/she can take a spot against one of the walls, where he/she is not directly infront of the other sangat.

Fat people complain all the time that they can't sit on the ground. Should they be allowed to sit on the chairs, due to their own selfish behavior of stuffing their faces. What about those that will bring up excuses of I got a bad knee. I can't sit for to long on the ground. I got a bad hip, I got a bad ankle, I got etc, etc. The excuses are not going to end.

The kirtan jatha. Are those that sitting on chairs, educating the sangat about Sikhi? This is a long held tradition that the person that is telling you a about Gurmat or giving you wisdom, sits higher than the learner. It's about giving respect and instilling values.