Revenge / Justice

[Guest Gupt11]

Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa

Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

I have come to ask the advice and understanding of my older veers on a situation of revenge / justice. I'm an amritdhari Sikh and recently there have been doubts in my mind which I feel really frustrated about and need some conclusion to.

When I was around 9+1/2 years old, I use to live around in a terraced house estate etc and unlike nowadays I would obviously play outside with my friends etc. I don't know what to call this, either bullying or straight out childish acts but I was doing my own thing infront of my house, and this group of older (atleast 3-5 years older) hindu lads came and grabbed me. I was outnumbered quite badly as it was like 7 of them and me alone. They took me into an ally and 1 of them held me back to a wall while this larger lad continously hit me on my chest and stomach. I asked what I had done and back then I use to swear a lot I guess and said what the f*** they were doing this for etc and they said that I stared at one of there friends in a weird way or something? I dunno, I was just really angry at the time and I didn't know who they were or where they had come from.

So err, I went inside to my house - I didn't cry or anything nor was I seriously hurt but the whole ordeal had kind of really annoyed me and did have a slight impact, wether it's too hindus or what I don't know nor do I care. I'm not gonna say I hate ALL HINDUS NOW or something.

Anyways, I'm over 20 now slightly and i've grown up and all, don't take crap from anyone no more. 1 of the boys from there, the main "leader" ? As you might call it - the guy who I think kind of initiated that whole thing has turned up at a place I work at. He doesn't know it's me and I have kind of outgrown him ? I dunno - but i've seen him twice now in the last few days and I feel like just grabbing him and putting him through a whole tonne of pain.

What I want to ask you is, would my revenge be justified in accordance to Sikhi? Please try think this from not only my view but from a general view.. 7 guys grab 9 year old beat him without reason. 9 year old grows up, has found 1. Should I/He take revenge?

All sorts of weird things are going into my mind, he's obviously seen me at the place I work at, I can't just go an batter him while i'm there. If I was guna do anything I'd cover my face etc (although I wouldn't be able to take my dastaar off really). He comes to the place around 10pm. I'd wait for him and turn off the cameras at the work place and just grab him, beat him and walk off in another direction so he doesn't know that i'm from the shop. This seems to be the "safest" way.

All of the above i've said, perhaps i've said it in anger or confusion. So please hear me out and tell me how I should feel about this opportunity.

Please veerjee's and bhenjee's don't put something out there like "What would Guru Gobind Singh Jee Do?"

Hope to hear something soon. Sorry for typing it out long, but the situation is such that I don't want to miss any details.

Vaheguroo Je Ka Khalsa

Vaheguroo Je Kee Fateh

[VanHelsingh]

As far as I know, Guru Ji said that striking out in self-defence was the only way such actions could be justified. Obviously you could argue there is justification for what they put you through, but its not worth it especially if the fella in question reports it to the police. Then you'll be a Sikh with a criminal record which is never a good thing.

In your mind its such a huge issue but to others, it'll seem petty and opportunistic. I do understand about revenge and handing out "justice" to those that deserve it, but brother, if you took revenge for something like this it would only make you look foolish. I'm pretty sure you'd feel good about it but long-term, its not worth the hassle.

There is one person in my life who I dream of destroying with my bare fists, every second of the day. Its eating me up inside. Like you I think of situations where I could hide in the shadows, and then drag the paapi into an alley and just go for it. Anyway I've come to learn that I should leave such decisions to Waheguru. If I deserve peace from having my tormentor punished, God will punish that individual for me. I know its easy to say this (trust me), but if you have belief in Waheguru then it should be a bit easier to leave everything in His hands.

There's a saying in Punjabi that divine justice isn't like a dog, i.e. if you kick a dog it attacks you in return immediately. Divine justice takes its time and only arrives when Waheguru decrees it should. Its not a knee-je_rk reaction like a dog-bite. You know what I mean?

Anyway that's what I think.

[Mehtab Singh]

I would take a few Singhs with me, gang up on him, tell him who I was, and that I remember everything, and then make him feel ashamed of himself and tell him that he is a coward, and that we Sikhs don't attack a single unarmed man as a group. I would tell him that today the tables have turned, today its my turn, and I can break every bone of yours but I won't, because my Guru taught me to forgive, my Guru taught me rules of war. I would use this opportunity to make this Hindu (who probably hates Sikhs) change and start respecting Sikhs. In any case, I would not get violent and I would definitely not touch him as then it turns into a police case. At the end, walk away with either him apologizing to you, or you having told him off like no one ever did.

You could do this, or you could do what Kaljugi said.

[Guest Guest]

I would have thought most people probably "bullied" or upset, or had one or two fights with other kids when they were very young. You probably upset a few other kids too, maybe without even realising it. It's part of life and growing up. I'd be pretty weirded out with someone if they still held that grudge 10 years later.

[Guest Gupt11]

Thanks to all of you veer jee's, given me some great things to think about and there isn't anything I disagree with. Damn it, kinda wanted to hear "YES GO GET HIM"- Jke, Deep down I know that'd be wrong ofcourse. I'll see if he keeps coming to the store or whatever, might give him a piece of my mind or whatever.

Anyways, Thanks! Gurfateh

[whyhellothere]

Revenge is anger (krodh), god does not like the demon Krodh- it is evil, if it wasn't it wouldn't be one of the 5 thieves.

I know it sounds typical saying leave it to god but really that's what you should do. Obviously it's your life, your karma so its your choice but you'd be adding greatly to your karma, not getting rid of it like you prob have been up till this day.

Whatever happens to us is gods hukam, we gain karma and get rid of it. Getting punched was you getting rid of your karma from evil deeds you;'ve done in this life or your previous lives (more likely). Do you really want another beating or slap in the face in the future which is what you'll be getting if you carry out this poisonous act of violence.

When you think about it, it was:

-Your fault you got punched (karma from this or previous lives)

- You erasing this karma, by taking the beating.

-Gods hukam (everything is, it's put there to help you find god even if you don't think it is, (sometimes it seems like it most defintaely is not) it pushes you towards him in some way)

-A test, god wants to see if you're ready/ worthy of meeting him, your tests will be hard, sometimes torture, but the reward is a billion plus times better).

-A show that god loves you, by just giving you pleasure, you will not find him, hardly anyone remembers him in times of happiness (happiness that is actually false.) Wwe turn to him in times of pain/ helplesness and back then and right now you are helpless- helpless against them and now helpless against Krodh/revenge/ego- these demons/illnesses will not go away on their own, you need to force them out with his Grace.

I hope you make the right decision Ji.

Vaheguroo Jee Ka Khalsa

Vaheguroo Jee Kee Fateh!

I have come to ask the advice and understanding of my older veers on a situation of revenge / justice. I'm an amritdhari Sikh and recently there have been doubts in my mind which I feel really frustrated about and need some conclusion to.

When I was around 9+1/2 years old, I use to live around in a terraced house estate etc and unlike nowadays I would obviously play outside with my friends etc. I don't know what to call this, either bullying or straight out childish acts but I was doing my own thing infront of my house, and this group of older (atleast 3-5 years older) hindu lads came and grabbed me. I was outnumbered quite badly as it was like 7 of them and me alone. They took me into an ally and 1 of them held me back to a wall while this larger lad continously hit me on my chest and stomach. I asked what I had done and back then I use to swear a lot I guess and said what the f*** they were doing this for etc and they said that I stared at one of there friends in a weird way or something? I dunno, I was just really angry at the time and I didn't know who they were or where they had come from.

So err, I went inside to my house - I didn't cry or anything nor was I seriously hurt but the whole ordeal had kind of really annoyed me and did have a slight impact, wether it's too hindus or what I don't know nor do I care. I'm not gonna say I hate ALL HINDUS NOW or something.

Anyways, I'm over 20 now slightly and i've grown up and all, don't take crap from anyone no more. 1 of the boys from there, the main "leader" ? As you might call it - the guy who I think kind of initiated that whole thing has turned up at a place I work at. He doesn't know it's me and I have kind of outgrown him ? I dunno - but i've seen him twice now in the last few days and I feel like just grabbing him and putting him through a whole tonne of pain.

What I want to ask you is, would my revenge be justified in accordance to Sikhi? Please try think this from not only my view but from a general view.. 7 guys grab 9 year old beat him without reason. 9 year old grows up, has found 1. Should I/He take revenge?

All sorts of weird things are going into my mind, he's obviously seen me at the place I work at, I can't just go an batter him while i'm there. If I was guna do anything I'd cover my face etc (although I wouldn't be able to take my dastaar off really). He comes to the place around 10pm. I'd wait for him and turn off the cameras at the work place and just grab him, beat him and walk off in another direction so he doesn't know that i'm from the shop. This seems to be the "safest" way.

All of the above i've said, perhaps i've said it in anger or confusion. So please hear me out and tell me how I should feel about this opportunity.

Please veerjee's and bhenjee's don't put something out there like "What would Guru Gobind Singh Jee Do?"

Hope to hear something soon. Sorry for typing it out long, but the situation is such that I don't want to miss any details.

Vaheguroo Je Ka Khalsa

Vaheguroo Je Kee Fateh