Sants: How Is It Decided If One Is A Sant?

[sikhwithquestion]

Hi,

I have been watching the Sikh Channel and have noticed that quite a lot of Giani's have 'Sant' in-front of their names...Ranjit Singh Dhaadrianwale for example is sant Ranjit Singh. From my understanding Sant nowadays identifies with being from a sect 'Sikh' community ie. Radhaswami's? Is it appropriate to use sant for anyone who teaches a few things about Sikhi. Or is Sant now the common term for someone with a bit of a following? I believe that Sants were those in the heyday of our Guru's, e.g. Sant Kabir?

I would like to hear what are the reasons for this and actual answers for the usage of 'Sant'.

Many Thanks and I look forward to hearing your thoughts.

[11Gurus1Jot]

To answer your question a Sant must be a very high individual and very knowledgealbe in Sikhi - as you say. I don't know the exact level or line an individual has to cross to become a Sant.

However, one thing I am certain of is, as far as Sikhi is concerned, before any one can be called a Sant they need to be an Amritdhari who follows full Rehit Maryada and lives for the sole purpose of joining Sikhs to Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaaj and no other individual who calls themselves a Guru. Any deviation from this would make that individual a deviant rahter than a Sant!

As for the question, Who has past that level in Sikhi to be called a Sikh Sant... you would have to ask a more learned Sikh about that,

[VanHelsingh]

Hi,

I have been watching the Sikh Channel and have noticed that quite a lot of Giani's have 'Sant' in-front of their names...Ranjit Singh Dhaadrianwale for example is sant Ranjit Singh. From my understanding Sant nowadays identifies with being from a sect 'Sikh' community ie. Radhaswami's? Is it appropriate to use sant for anyone who teaches a few things about Sikhi. Or is Sant now the common term for someone with a bit of a following? I believe that Sants were those in the heyday of our Guru's, e.g. Sant Kabir?

I would like to hear what are the reasons for this and actual answers for the usage of 'Sant'.

Many Thanks and I look forward to hearing your thoughts.

a) First time I've heard that being a Sant automatically denotes that the person is a Radhaswami.

b) As far as I'm aware, it was Bhagat Kabir.

As for the original question, I always thought such an honour was bestowed on a person by the Akal Takhat (much like a knighthood). So if you've shown yourself worthy of 'Sant' status, you are referred to as such but only if approved by the Akal Takhat. Which is all well and good, until I wonder about those individuals who call themselves 'Sant' but are really not.

[Matheen]

All the criteria that make one a Sant are listed by Guru Sahib. If you're in the presence of a real Sant, you'll know it yourself, SImran will start automatically within you.

[VanHelsingh]

All the criteria that make one a Sant are listed by Guru Sahib. If you're in the presence of a real Sant, you'll know it yourself, Simran will start automatically within you.

That is an excellent point. I cannot tell you how true that is.

[11Gurus1Jot]

As Radhaswami was mentioned in the above topic I think all sikhs should watch this links. One is in Punjabi and one is in English, take your pick

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-gjerX3XJI

http://www.youtube.com/user/UKGSTSEVA#p/u/9/kKnaF_v0JS8

[Singh559]

It is true many people abuse the name of Sant, however, one must first educate oneself whether a person is truly a sant or not. It may not be as black and white as people may think in terms of finding out whether one is a Sant or not. Some have their own agenda at hand under the mask...

Sant Hari Singh Randhawa talks about Sants at 21 minutes:

Why was my post edited?

[SSG]

WJKK WJKF,

Sri Guru Arjan recites in the 13th Astapatee of Sri Sukhmani Sahib what a Sant can do and what a slanderer of a sant faces...

sMq srin jo jnu prY so jnu auDrnhwr ]

sant saran jo jan parai so jan uDhranhaar.

One who seeks the Sanctuary of the Saints shall be saved.

sMq kI inMdw nwnkw bhuir bhuir Avqwr ]1]

sant kee nindaa naankaa bahur bahur avtaar. ||1||

One who slanders the Saints, O Nanak, shall be reincarnated over and over again. ||1||

AstpdI ]

asatpadee.

Ashtapadee:

sMq kY dUKin Awrjw GtY ]

sant kai dookhan aarjaa ghatai.

Slandering the Saints, one's life is cut short.

sMq kY dUKin jm qy nhI CutY ]

sant kai dookhan jam tay nahee chhutai.

Slandering the Saints, one shall not escape the Messenger of Death.

sMq kY dUKin suKu sBu jwie ]

sant kai dookhan sukh sabh jaa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, all happiness vanishes.

sMq kY dUKin nrk mih pwie ]

sant kai dookhan narak meh paa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, one falls into hell.

sMq kY dUKin miq hoie mlIn ]

sant kai dookhan mat ho-ay maleen.

Slandering the Saints, the intellect is polluted.

sMq kY dUKin soBw qy hIn ]

sant kai dookhan sobhaa tay heen.

Slandering the Saints, one's reputation is lost.

sMq ky hqy kau rKY n koie ]

sant kay hatay ka-o rakhai na ko-ay.

One who is cursed by a Saint cannot be saved.

sMq kY dUKin Qwn BRstu hoie ]

sant kai dookhan thaan bharsat ho-ay.

Slandering the Saints, one's place is defiled.

sMq ik®pwl ik®pw jy krY ]

sant kirpaal kirpaa jay karai.

But if the Compassionate Saint shows His Kindness,

nwnk sMqsMig inMdku BI qrY ]1]

naanak satsang nindak bhee tarai. ||1||

O Nanak, in the Company of the Saints, the slanderer may still be saved. ||1||

sMq ky dUKn qy muKu BvY ]

sant kay dookhan tay mukh bhavai.

Slandering the Saints, one becomes a wry-faced malcontent.

sMqn kY dUKin kwg ijau lvY ]

santan kai dookhan kaag ji-o lavai.

Slandering the Saints, one croaks like a raven.

sMqn kY dUKin srp join pwie ]

santan kai dookhan sarap jon paa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, one is reincarnated as a snake.

sMq kY dUKin iqRgd join ikrmwie ]

sant kai dookhan tarigad jon kirmaa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, one is reincarnated as a wiggling worm.

sMqn kY dUKin iqRsnw mih jlY ]

santan kai dookhan tarisnaa meh jalai.

Slandering the Saints, one burns in the fire of desire.

sMq kY dUKin sBu ko ClY ]

sant kai dookhan sabh ko chhalai.

Slandering the Saints, one tries to deceive everyone.

sMq kY dUKin qyju sBu jwie ]

sant kai dookhan tayj sabh jaa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, all one's influence vanishes.

sMq kY dUKin nIcu nIcwie ]

sant kai dookhan neech neechaa-ay.

Slandering the Saints, one becomes the lowest of the low.

sMq doKI kw Qwau ko nwih ]

sant dokhee kaa thaa-o ko naahi.

For the slanderer of the Saint, there is no place of rest.

nwnk sMq BwvY qw Eie BI giq pwih ]2]

naanak sant bhaavai taa o-ay bhee gat paahi. ||2||

O Nanak, if it pleases the Saint, even then, he may be saved. ||2||

sMq kw inMdku mhw AqqweI ]

sant kaa nindak mahaa attaa-ee.

The slanderer of the Saint is the worst evil-doer.

sMq kw inMdku iKnu itknu n pweI ]

sant kaa nindak khin tikan na paa-ee.

The slanderer of the Saint has not even a moment's rest.

sMq kw inMdku mhw hiqAwrw ]

sant kaa nindak mahaa hati-aaraa.

The slanderer of the Saint is a brutal butcher.

sMq kw inMdku prmysuir mwrw ]

sant kaa nindak parmaysur maaraa.

The slanderer of the Saint is cursed by the Transcendent Lord.

sMq kw inMdku rwj qy hInu ]

sant kaa nindak raaj tay heen.

The slanderer of the Saint has no kingdom.

sMq kw inMdku duKIAw Aru dInu ]

sant kaa nindak dukhee-aa ar deen.

The slanderer of the Saint becomes miserable and poor.

sMq ky inMdk kau srb rog ]

sant kay nindak ka-o sarab rog.

The slanderer of the Saint contracts all diseases.

sMq ky inMdk kau sdw ibjog ]

sant kay nindak ka-o sadaa bijog.

The slanderer of the Saint is forever separated.

sMq kI inMdw doK mih doKu ]

sant kee nindaa dokh meh dokh.

To slander a Saint is the worst sin of sins.

nwnk sMq BwvY qw aus kw BI hoie moKu ]3]

naanak sant bhaavai taa us kaa bhee ho-ay mokh. ||3||

O Nanak, if it pleases the Saint, then even this one may be liberated. ||3||

sMq kw doKI sdw Apivqu ]

sant kaa dokhee sadaa apvit.

The slanderer of the Saint is forever impure.

sMq kw doKI iksY kw nhI imqu ]

sant kaa dokhee kisai kaa nahee mit.

The slanderer of the Saint is nobody's friend.

sMq ky doKI kau fwnu lwgY ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o daan laagai.

The slanderer of the Saint shall be punished.

sMq ky doKI kau sB iqAwgY ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o sabh ti-aagai.

The slanderer of the Saint is abandoned by all.

sMq kw doKI mhw AhMkwrI ]

sant kaa dokhee mahaa aha^Nkaaree.

The slanderer of the Saint is totally egocentric.

sMq kw doKI sdw ibkwrI ]

sant kaa dokhee sadaa bikaaree.

The slanderer of the Saint is forever corrupt.

sMq kw doKI jnmY mrY ]

sant kaa dokhee janmai marai.

The slanderer of the Saint must endure birth and death.

sMq kI dUKnw suK qy trY ]

sant kee dookhnaa sukh tay tarai.

The slanderer of the Saint is devoid of peace.

sMq ky doKI kau nwhI Twau ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o naahee thaa-o.

The slanderer of the Saint has no place of rest.

nwnk sMq BwvY qw ley imlwie ]4]

naanak sant bhaavai taa la-ay milaa-ay. ||4||

O Nanak, if it pleases the Saint, then even such a one may merge in union. ||4||

sMq kw doKI AD bIc qy tUtY ]

sant kaa dokhee aDh beech tay tootai.

The slanderer of the Saint breaks down mid-way.

sMq kw doKI ikqY kwij n phUcY ]

sant kaa dokhee kitai kaaj na pahoochai.

The slanderer of the Saint cannot accomplish his tasks.

sMq ky doKI kau auidAwn BRmweIAY ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o udi-aan bharmaa-ee-ai.

The slanderer of the Saint wanders in the wilderness.

sMq kw doKI auJiV pweIAY ]

sant kaa dokhee ujharh paa-ee-ai.

The slanderer of the Saint is misled into desolation.

sMq kw doKI AMqr qy QoQw ]

sant kaa dokhee antar tay thothaa.

The slanderer of the Saint is empty inside,

ijau sws ibnw imrqk kI loQw ]

ji-o saas binaa mirtak kee lothaa.

like the corpse of a dead man, without the breath of life.

sMq ky doKI kI jV ikCu nwih ]

sant kay dokhee kee jarh kichh naahi.

The slanderer of the Saint has no heritage at all.

Awpn bIij Awpy hI Kwih ]

aapan beej aapay hee khaahi.

He himself must eat what he has planted.

sMq ky doKI kau Avru n rwKnhwru ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o avar na raakhanhaar.

The slanderer of the Saint cannot be saved by anyone else.

nwnk sMq BwvY qw ley aubwir ]5]

naanak sant bhaavai taa la-ay ubaar. ||5||

O Nanak, if it pleases the Saint, then even he may be saved. ||5||

sMq kw doKI ieau ibllwie ]

sant kaa dokhee i-o billaa-ay.

The slanderer of the Saint bewails like this

ijau jl ibhUn mCulI qVPVwie ]

ji-o jal bihoon machhulee tarhafrhaa-ay.

- like a fish, out of water, writhing in agony.

sMq kw doKI BUKw nhI rwjY ]

sant kaa dokhee bhookhaa nahee raajai.

The slanderer of the Saint is hungry and is never satisfied,

ijau pwvku eIDin nhI DRwpY ]

ji-o paavak eeDhan nahee Dharaapai.

as fire is not satisfied by fuel.

sMq kw doKI CutY iekylw ]

sant kaa dokhee chhutai ikaylaa.

The slanderer of the Saint is left all alone,

ijau bUAwVu iqlu Kyq mwih duhylw ]

ji-o boo-aarh til khayt maahi duhaylaa.

like the miserable barren sesame stalk abandoned in the field.

sMq kw doKI Drm qy rhq ]

sant kaa dokhee Dharam tay rahat.

The slanderer of the Saint is devoid of faith.

sMq kw doKI sd imiQAw khq ]

sant kaa dokhee sad mithi-aa kahat.

The slanderer of the Saint constantly lies.

ikrqu inMdk kw Duir hI pieAw ]

kirat nindak kaa Dhur hee pa-i-aa.

The fate of the slanderer is pre-ordained from the very beginning of time.

nwnk jo iqsu BwvY soeI iQAw ]6]

naanak jo tis bhaavai so-ee thi-aa. ||6||

O Nanak, whatever pleases God's Will comes to pass. ||6||

sMq kw doKI ibgV rUpu hoie jwie ]

sant kaa dokhee bigarh roop ho-ay jaa-ay.

The slanderer of the Saint becomes deformed.

sMq ky doKI kau drgh imlY sjwie ]

sant kay dokhee ka-o dargeh milai sajaa-ay.

The slanderer of the Saint receives his punishment in the Court of the Lord.

sMq kw doKI sdw shkweIAY ]

sant kaa dokhee sadaa sahkaa-ee-ai.

The slanderer of the Saint is eternally in limbo.

sMq kw doKI n mrY n jIvweIAY ]

sant kaa dokhee na marai na jeevaa-ee-ai.

He does not die, but he does not live either.

sMq ky doKI kI pujY n Awsw ]

sant kay dokhee kee pujai na aasaa.

The hopes of the slanderer of the Saint are not fulfilled.

sMq kw doKI auiT clY inrwsw ]

sant kaa dokhee uth chalai niraasaa.

The slanderer of the Saint departs disappointed.

sMq kY doiK n iqRstY koie ]

sant kai dokh na taristai ko-ay.

Slandering the Saint, no one attains satisfaction.

jYsw BwvY qYsw koeI hoie ]

jaisaa bhaavai taisaa ko-ee ho-ay.

As it pleases the Lord, so do people become;

pieAw ikrqu n mytY koie ]

pa-i-aa kirat na maytai ko-ay.

no one can erase their past actions.

nwnk jwnY scw soie ]7]

naanak jaanai sachaa so-ay. ||7||

O Nanak, the True Lord alone knows all. ||7||

sB Gt iqs ky Ehu krnYhwru ]

sabh ghat tis kay oh karnaihaar.

All hearts are His; He is the Creator.

sdw sdw iqs kau nmskwru ]

sadaa sadaa tis ka-o namaskaar.

Forever and ever, I bow to Him in reverence.

pRB kI ausqiq krhu idnu rwiq ]

parabh kee ustat karahu din raat.

Praise God, day and night.

iqsih iDAwvhu swis igrwis ]

tiseh Dhi-aavahu saas giraas.

Meditate on Him with every breath and morsel of food.

sBu kCu vrqY iqs kw kIAw ]

sabh kachh //tai tis kaa kee-aa.

Everything happens as He wills.

jYsw kry qYsw ko QIAw ]

jaisaa karay taisaa ko thee-aa.

As He wills, so people become.

Apnw Kylu Awip krnYhwru ]

apnaa khayl aap karnaihaar.

He Himself is the play, and He Himself is the actor.

dUsr kaunu khY bIcwru ]

doosar ka-un kahai beechaar.

Who else can speak or deliberate upon this?

ijs no ik®pw krY iqsu Awpn nwmu dyie ]

jis no kirpaa karai tis aapan naam day-ay.

He Himself gives His Name to those, upon whom He bestows His Mercy.

bfBwgI nwnk jn syie ]8]13]

badbhaagee naanak jan say-ay. ||8||13||

Very fortunate, O Nanak, are those people. ||8||13||

sloku ]

salok.

Shalok:

qjhu isAwnp suir jnhu ismrhu hir hir rwie ]

tajahu si-aanap sur janhu simrahu har har raa-ay.

Give up your cleverness, good people - remember the Lord God, your King!

eyk Aws hir min rKhu nwnk dUKu Brmu Bau jwie ]1]

ayk aas har man rakhahu naanak dookh bharam bha-o jaa-ay. ||1||

Enshrine in your heart, your hopes in the One Lord. O Nanak, your pain, doubt and fear shall depart. ||1||

Sorry for this long post but i hope it has brodened your understanding on this subject, because with Guru ji's kirpa it has really opened my eyes...

Forgive me if anything i posted here has hurt anyone but it it is the gurus bani and we all, as a panth, need to wake up and release who our true guru is...

WJKK WJKF...