Sikhnet Promotes Homosexuality

[Only five]

So does this mean a person who is born as being gay should marry a person of an opposite sex. Wouldn't that be equivalent to asking a straight person to marry a person of the same gender?

Singh, what is the Guru's way when it comes to marriage?

So the reasons for homosexuals not being able to marry is:

1) They marry because of kaam

2) They cannot produce offspring

A homosexual marriage i purely based on lust when it comes to Sikhi. When two Gursikhs get married, what is the marriage based on? Its based on Gurmat, where they aim, not to get married or even have kids, but aim to reach Sri Waheguru ji.

Counters to these points are:

1) Not all people marry, therefore they do not produce offspring, so does that make that wrong?

Sikhs do not make their sexual orientation to what defines them. Do Gursikhs go around saying im a heterosexual Sikh? Read Sri Sukhmani Sahib da paat, where Guru Sahib says kill your sexual instinct and free yourself from the five vices, which includes Kaam.

2) What if two people of the same gender marry and do not have any kaam thoughts or relation, but are spiritually married? Are people saying it's impossible to not have kaam, if it is impossible, wouldn't it be impossible for customary marriages (male and female) to

Tells me which Gursikh gets married on the bases of his/her sexually orientation? Satguru says to kill it and Gursikhs follow that path and focus on the Gurus way, which says man and woman get married. The homosexual people classify themselves according to their sexual orientation. How can homosexual see other humans as brother, sister, mother, and father when they focus on their sexual orientation? Again Sikhi is not about sexual orientation, but follow the Guru's way.

3) Do these Jathedars at the Akaal Takht represent Akaal Purakh perfectly, these are all people like us, who are elected. What if in the future it is said it is okay for people of same gender to marry?

4) I would say the trustability of many of the jathedars is questionable in terms of having the best interest for Sikhi. I would argue Gurbachan and Joginder Singh are either RSS agents and/or Badal's puppets.

The Hukams are according to Gurmat.

[Singh559]

Veer meray, Its not the matter of our personal liking or not. Its about the sandesh coming from Sri Akal Takht Sahib and that hit the point whether its thug darsho or about gay marriages. Singh Sahib Giani Gurbachan singh or anyone who is jathedar of sri akal takht sahib will earn respect from us if everything stays in control under their time as being sewadar of akal takht sahib.

Veer ji, I don't see how a person could be respected that attends an rss event with chairs where Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj is and accepts such sacrilegious pictures. These people may have leader positions, but they are not leaders.

Darshan is wrong by far and he has split the panth, but don't the jathedars also have the job to set up Sri Dasam Granth seminars and try to unify the panth. GurSikhs like Dr. Jodh Singh have openly challenged darshan to an open/live debate or discussion regarding Sri Dasam Granth.

Would a true GurSikh really stand there and let this happen. Massive beadbi of Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaj... :\

[deadbodydisposal]

You need to be civil. I bet if this conversation was in person, you would not act like an arrogant person. Being infront of a computer screen does not give you the right to treat others like dirt. But if you want to treat others like dirt. Then its best you do it to there faces.

14337 90 ave, Surrey, B.C .... drop by my house anytime big boy.. im expecting you to come dont chicken out now, actions speak louder than words.

treat other like dirt? im the one advocating for giving equal status to gay people while you call their whole lifestyle kaam, against sikhi, in simple terms just plain "wrong" and your complaining about being treated like dirt? HAHAHA man up.

[Only five]

Good point, but are these the quotes you're talking about? :

ਪਰ ਤ੍ਰਿਅ ਰੂਪੁ ਨ ਪੇਖੈ ਨੇਤ੍ਰ ॥

"With your eyes, do not even gaze (in a lustful manner) upon the beauty of another."

(Sukhmani Sahib, Ang 274)

I don't see how this only refers to homosexuality if this is the line you were referring to. This refers to anyone.

Read further into the shabad and Maharaj says the following:

ieMdRI ijq pMc doK qy rhq ]

ei(n)dhree jith pa(n)ch dhokh thae rehath ||

who conquers his sexual instincts and is free of the five sinful passions

nwnk koit mDy ko AYsw Aprs ]1]

naanak kott madhhae ko aisaa aparas ||1||

- O Nanak, among millions, there is scarcely one such 'touch-nothing Saint'. ||1||

ਦੇਖਿ ਪਰਾਈਆਂ ਚੰਗੀਆਂ ਮਾਵਾਂ ਭੈਣਾਂ ਧੀਆਂ ਜਾਣੈ ॥

"Men should look at the opposite gender as mothers, sisters and daughters, (women should look at the opposite gender as fathers, brothers and sons)."

(Bhāī Gurdās: Vār 29/ Paurī 11)

Again, I don't see how this says anything against homosexuality.

I think it would help if we clarify this:

Is a homosexual (physically a male) considered a man. Doesn't that mean he could view a person of the opposite gender as mother, sisters and daughters as well?

Then how would a homosexual see other men? When he already identifies himself as sexually inclined toward men. He won't see them as brothers, but kaam would fill his mind and same goes for those that see themselves as heterosexual, or bisexual. Sikhs are not any of these things and are here to conquer sexual instinct and free ourselves of the 5 vices so we can see Sri Waheguru ji.

Read the Salok on ang 963 by Sri Guru Arjan Dev ji Maharaj. This Salok was provided by Sant Baba Jarnail Singh ji Khalsa to show the manmat people that the woman follows the man in the Anand Karaj. And for the same reason a marriage between two men cannot happen. Read the solak in Gurmukhi not english. The english does not give the full picture of the Salok.

[Singh559]

Tells me which Gursikh gets married on the bases of his/her sexually orientation? Satguru says to kill it and Gursikhs follow that path and focus on the Gurus way, which says man and woman get married. The homosexual people classify themselves according to their sexual orientation. How can homosexual see other humans as brother, sister, mother, and father when they focus on their sexual orientation? Again Sikhi is not about sexual orientation, but follow the Guru's way.

Very true, I agree with you there. That's roughly what I was thinking is the reason why homosexuality is anti-Gurmat.

I agree with the decision passed by the Sri Akaal Takhth Sahib but asking the questions why it's wrong openly helps people understand more deeply why it's not Gurmat.

I still don't trust Gurbachan or Joginder Singh.

[Only five]

14337 90 ave, Surrey, B.C .... drop by my house anytime big boy.. im expecting you to come dont chicken out now, actions speak louder than words.

treat other like dirt? im the one advocating for giving equal status to gay people while you call their whole lifestyle kaam, against sikhi, in simple terms just plain "wrong" and your complaining about being treated like dirt? HAHAHA man up.

:D

[Singh559]

:D

Lol, does this mean you two are going to meet and go to the local park and swing on a swing or possibly go to Enver Creek Secondary School (i know someone who went there last year and is from Surrey)

If you really go that'd be amazingly awkward and awesome at the same time.

[Only five]

I won't waste my time on you today. I'll send you a message and then come out and lets see what happens. okay big boy

[deadbodydisposal]

now back on the topic! :D

does that mean according to akal thakts interpretation of gurmat that we're going to label the sexual orientation of homosexuals as wrong even though in light of recent scientific studies their proof that its linked to biological factors? this is probably a bad analogy but thats like telling a special needs kid that its his fault hes has problems is it not? im not saying homosexuals are physically or mentally sick but isnt that what we're doing?

few links to back up my point:

http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=28531

http://philosophy.illinoisstate.edu/chorvath/PHI202Su10/LeVayHamer%20copy.pdf

[Only five]

now back on the topic! :D

What happened buddy? I know for a fact your not a Singh or even from surrey.

Very true, I agree with you there. That's roughly what I was thinking is the reason why homosexuality is anti-Gurmat.

I agree with the decision passed by the Sri Akaal Takhth Sahib but asking the questions why it's wrong openly helps people understand more deeply why it's not Gurmat.

I still don't trust Gurbachan or Joginder Singh.

Singh look at it this way aswell. If homosexual can get married by the Anand Karaj. Then what about bisexual people? Are you going to deny them two partners because they are attracted to both genders? So Gurmat focuses on Sri Waheguru ji.