Captain Amrinder Singh Is Right

[Jonny101]

Some SGPC members openly admit they are freemasons and say there is nothing wrong with it, since it attempts to join all religions. But at higher levels of masonry you have to become a Jew (and commence there rituals to initiate), so maybe these SGPC members (weather they truly are for the panth (lol) or just in it for the £££ or something else), the fact is freemasonry which at the top is all about Zionism/Judaism, it's true goal is to eradicate every other religion apart from there own, the only reason why they are so successful is due to the massive global influence they have over the world. And guess what, all the Sikh free-masons are prominent doctors of the city, principle of the government medical college, senior lawyers, business tycoons and other influential people.

But at the current rate of politics involved in SGPC, it'll will be the downfall of Sikhi, well I should say the downfall has already begun they are playing games with the fundamentals of Sikhi. Members of SGPC should be chosen by the Khalsa's sangat, not on a corrupt system of political elections, since the present SGPC members know nothing of Gurmat anyway. As the OP pretty much said; SGPC has control over Akal Takht. Now you tell me something isn't wrong with that.

Which SGPC member openly admits they are freemasons? Jews jews jew? I can see anti semitic Christians and even Sullahs going against them, but what reason does a Sikh have to be against them? And also tell me which prominent doctor of the city, principle of the government medical colleges, senior lawyers, business tycoons in Punjab are freemasons. Please name some, I'm really curious to know.

The biggest tragedy of the SGPC was that they adopted the election system instead of the selection system. In the election system even the most corrupt and least religious individuals can get elected because they got the most votes and that is what we are seeing with the SGPC today. When the sehejdharis will start voting we can expect the SGPC to really go down the toilet after that because then Monas will start electing Monas after that.. Selection system needs to be adopted and only through this system can the most worthy and rehetvaan individual can be put in the right place. When Gurdev Singh Kaunke was made Jathadar of the Akal Takht is because because at the time the Singhs themselves were rehetvaan and they selected a pious rehetvaan Gursikh like Jathadar Gurdev Singh Kaunke. After him we have not been able to get such a Chardikala Jathadar.

[Jonny101]

Read my posts again and then read them again brother. You will not see me once support Indian congress terrorist party, they are enemies of Sikhism and Sikhs. What I am saying is look behind the powers who are trying to divide Sikhs look at the bigger picture. All i say is captain amrinder is right on this issue. He is a congress official so doesn't get my sympathies but when a person speaks the truth he should be given credit.

Broaden your mind see the elite powers who are playing our uneducated people like fools like they did to break up our empire that we had established through many sacfirces and hard work all gone in the pages of history because people want to limit the influence of Sikhism. The best way to do that is keep dividing Sikhs, sehajdhari Sikhs are Sikhs and proud Sikhs. They maybe not practising gurmat, however if you declare them non-sikhs you are part of the problem and enemy of Sikhism you are giving aid to those who want to see Sikhs surrounded by anti-sikh forces so that eventually you will only find a handful of Sikhs here and there in punjab because the rest of the population have been bullied out of the faith.

I will not let that happen and I will stand up for the rights of Sehajdhari Sikhs to keep making their valuable contributions for the betterment of the Sikh panth and influence in geo-political senseive area's. This is the only way the panth will expand into pakistan and other area's otherwise sit back and cry as population decreases because of madness put forward by SGPC (freemasons).

Genie Jee, the recent uproar of the sehejdhari right to vote is because the Congress government at the center (Delhi) without giving any reason all of a sudden dropped the bomb shell stating that Sehejdharis will be able to vote days before election. This is suspicious, why all of a sudden? All the Panthic jathabandis are against it. Only center(congress), Punjabi congress, the so called "Panthic Morcha" of Sarna who is a congress stooge is supporting the Sahejdharis to vote.

All religious minded Sikh bodies are against it. Then tell me, how can you as a self respecting Sikh(whether mona or not) support this dicision of the Congress party of India being imposed on the Sikhs? I have family members who are monas, but even they say that they are against this decision of the congress government being imposed on the Panth because even they recognise that fact that a person who does not practice Sikhi has no right to make decisions on the Panthic level for the Sikh Panth. Amrinder himself trims his beard, drinks alcohal, keeps extra marital affair with a Muslim woman, what credibility does he or his bosses at Delhi have to meddle in the affairs of the Sikhs?

If Sahejdharis(monas) will be voting what will stop Hindus (who practically look the same) from also voting in SGPC elections?

[genie]

Some SGPC members openly admit they are freemasons and say there is nothing wrong with it, since it attempts to join all religions. But at higher levels of masonry you have to become a Jew (and commence there rituals to initiate), so maybe these SGPC members (weather they truly are for the panth (lol) or just in it for the £££ or something else), the fact is freemasonry which at the top is all about Zionism/Judaism, it's true goal is to eradicate every other religion apart from there own, the only reason why they are so successful is due to the massive global influence they have over the world. And guess what, all the Sikh free-masons are prominent doctors of the city, principle of the government medical college, senior lawyers, business tycoons and other influential people.

But at the current rate of politics involved in SGPC, it'll will be the downfall of Sikhi, well I should say the downfall has already begun they are playing games with the fundamentals of Sikhi. Members of SGPC should be chosen by the Khalsa's sangat, not on a corrupt system of political elections, since the present SGPC members know nothing of Gurmat anyway. As the OP pretty much said; SGPC has control over Akal Takht. Now you tell me something isn't wrong with that.

Together we can work to let it not happen. Maybe some Sikhs can not see the bigger picture but those who have researched into military intelligence tactics, geo-poltical history, freemasons, elitist families, Sikh history, Sikhism. We can openly see who the enemies of Sikhism are and who starts the corruption, divisions and for what purpose.

As long as Sikhs do not have political power no one cares what the Sikhs do but once they do, everyone wants to know especially rival power brokers because Sikhs collectively are a strong force for good in the world we wish well for all of mankind, whereas those who oppose Sikhs just want their group to do well.

[genie]

Genie Jee, the recent uproar of the sehejdhari right to vote is because the Congress government at the center (Delhi) without giving any reason all of a sudden dropped the bomb shell stating that Sehejdharis will be able to vote days before election. This is suspicious, why all of a sudden? All the Panthic jathabandis are against it. Only center(congress), Punjabi congress, the so called "Panthic Morcha" of Sarna who is a congress stooge is supporting the Sahejdharis to vote.

All religious minded Sikh bodies are against it. Then tell me, how can you as a self respecting Sikh(whether mona or not) support this dicision of the Congress party of India being imposed on the Sikhs? I have family members who are monas, but even they say that they are against this decision of the congress government being imposed on the Panth because even they recognise that fact that a person who does not practice Sikhi has no right to make decisions on the Panthic level for the Sikh Panth. Amrinder himself trims his beard, drinks alcohal, keeps extra marital affair with a Muslim woman, what credibility does he or his bosses at Delhi have to meddle in the affairs of the Sikhs?

If Sahejdharis(monas) will be voting what will stop Hindus (who practically look the same) from also voting in SGPC elections?

I agree with your point that it is a suspicious and dangerous move by congress they shouldnt get their paws into something that will backfire on them they already are hated by intelligent Sikhs. I would say before giving the votes to sehajdhari's lets reform the SGPC so that we can clearly let sehajdhari's come into the faith than left hanging in the margins as they form the majority. Majority is the reason why Sikhs are not getting anywhere in politics, majority is the reason why SGPC was created so Sikhs do not get a country or a vote bank or enough community to defend themselves from anti-sikh forces.

When Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji's saroop is burnt in Punjab itself the SGPC says "its an unforunate incident"

Whats so unfortunate about that? its a combat situation do or die for Sikhs we are ready to die for our Guru what is SGPC talking about unfortunate? what kind of sheeps are they, they are ment to be the leaders of the worldwide Sikh community.

[Singhballer]

Genie, I understand that having political power is essential for Sikhs to flourish in the future, but how do we get that power?

We obviously cannot have people who don't follow Gurmat to the fullest to lead us. That cuts out the Badals. That cuts out any non Kes keeping Sikh. People will remember that although Sant Jarnail Singh Ji was a leader for Sikhs he in no way was a political leader. He would in now way would have joined a political party, stood in an election or taken a seat in a legislature. No real Sant mahatma will ever come into politics.

Who the hell do we support? <- Would really like this answered.

How does giving non Amritdharis the right to control who gets to be a Sikh leader help better our leadership? A true Khalsa would want the best for his Panth, to put the leaders up there who he/she knows will be doing their best to improve the Panth. I know for a fact my Chacha dosen't give a rat's a$$ about the panth. He would not use his vote for the best of the Panth. How does giving him the vote help our Panth? It dosen't.. it worsens it. Yes SOME non Amritdharis have full faith in the Guru and would look out for the Panth. But there are LOADS of others that wouldn't be looking out for the panth. There is no way to check the intentions of these people.

Its much harder to change your appearance to look like a Singh than it is to look like a "Sikh".

Giving non Amritdharis the right to vote would allow any christian, muslim, hindu, jew etc. to go and vote. All you have to do is say I am a Sikh and I believe in the Guru and you'd be allowed to vote. That is a BIG BIG problem. It is too easy for non Sikhs to compromise the voting and possibly elect people with an anti-Sikh mentality as an SGPC member. Whos to say some groups like the RSS wouldn't back some Kala Afghana Missionary School product and get him in as an SGPC member to alter and distort Sikhi from its centre?

That would be insane.

[genie]

Singhballer,

This is the problem Keshdhari/amrithdhari Sikhs been worrying about since 1947 and that fear was created by SGPC (freemasons). During the times of the Sikh misls there was keshdhari, amrithdari and sahejdhari Sikhs. Sahejdhari Sikhs were essential for the survive of the Sikh panth during the mughul era because any guy who appeared overtly like a gurSikh would be hunted down and killed there and then. Sahejdhari's were to the mughuls and afghans as underground christians were to the romans. They provided the continuation of the faith at the most difficult phases in our history.

This we have to achknowledge and this is where we have to draw up another rehat maryada that takes inspirtional from SGGS ji because I cant find anywhere in the SGGS ji that states once must keep their kesh to be a Sikh to gain salvation. All Gurbani says is that you keep your kesh to because you are humble you renounce your ego. Guru Nanak dev ji even states in gurbani how sidhus (hindu holymen) keep dirty matted uncut hair thinking they will get spiritual powers. He was showing what a nonsense that idea was.

We must go back to the fundamentals of what a Sikh is and go from there otherwise our enemies will always seek to divide Sikhs into groups and we will get no where politically. There is no credible alternative at the moment, that is the problem.

[genie]

Real talk from just one sahejdhari Sikh, as you can see they are just as proud to be Sikh than any other this is what many forget. You get keshdhari Sikhs who support the enemy and murder Sikhs who want freedom. Never judge appearance of a Sikh, judge them by their heart and their love for Sikhi and Sikhs.

Thousands of monay Sikhs are voicing their opinions on our political situation and if need be ready to fight and die for Sikhism should the call arise. Throughout history this has been the case.

2011 Patriotic Sehajdhari and some Keshdhari Sikhs Giving Their Support To Khalistan on black days of 14th / 15th august when the Sikh homeland was divide between India and Pakistan.

[Singhballer]

This is the problem Keshdhari/amrithdhari Sikhs been worrying about since 1947 and that fear was created by SGPC (freemasons). During the times of the Sikh misls there was keshdhari, amrithdari and sahejdhari Sikhs. Sahejdhari Sikhs were essential for the survive of the Sikh panth during the mughul era because any guy who appeared overtly like a gurSikh would be hunted down and killed there and then. Sahejdhari's were to the mughuls and afghans as underground christians were to the romans. They provided the continuation of the faith at the most difficult phases in our history.

I would refute that. How could non practicing Sikhs have saved things like Amrit Sanchaar, the importance of the 5 Kakkars and Rehit, Shastar Vidiya, Gurbani Vidiya? Those things would have been lost.

The Singhs that lived in the jungles, mountains, deserts in hiding are those that kept Sikhi alive in all its aspects. When Ahmed Shah Durrani was ransacking India the Singhs were alive and well. They attacked his caravans, freed the kidnapped women and the spoils he was tacking with him. They would then go back into hiding. Saying that it was Sikhs living in plain sight under the noses of the Mughal and Afghan powers isn't so real when Singhs alive and keeping Sikhi safe in the Jungles.

This we have to achknowledge and this is where we have to draw up another rehat maryada that takes inspirtional from SGGS ji because I cant find anywhere in the SGGS ji that states once must keep their kesh to be a Sikh to gain salvation. All Gurbani says is that you keep your kesh to because you are humble you renounce your ego.

You wont find taking Kandey Batey da Amrit, compulsory Shastar Vidiya, Miri Piri, etc. in Siri Guru Granth Sahib, but those are HUGE concepts in Sikhi. The importance of Kes in Sikhi is immense. Other Sikhs on this forum are more knowledgeable than me. Send some info Genie's way.

Guru Nanak dev ji even states in gurbani how sidhus (hindu holymen) keep dirty matted uncut hair thinking they will get spiritual powers. He was showing what a nonsense that idea was

Yes thinking that keeping long hair will give you spiritual powers is a nonsense suggestion. But the nonsense part is thinking long hair will give you powers.. keeping kes isn't the nonsense part.

You have still failed to adress the following concerns I and others raised about non Amritdharis to be allowed to vote:

Yes SOME non Amritdharis have full faith in the Guru and would look out for the Panth. But there are LOADS of others that wouldn't be looking out for the panth. There is no way to check the intentions of these people.

Its much harder to change your appearance to look like a Singh than it is to look like a "Sikh".

Giving non Amritdharis the right to vote would allow any christian, muslim, hindu, jew etc. to go and vote. All you have to do is say I am a Sikh and I believe in the Guru and you'd be allowed to vote. That is a BIG BIG problem. It is too easy for non Sikhs to compromise the voting and possibly elect people with an anti-Sikh mentality as an SGPC member. Whos to say some groups like the RSS wouldn't back some Kala Afghana Missionary School product and get him in as an SGPC member to alter and distort Sikhi from its centre?

[genie]

Put voting aside for one moment, that is a red hearing and non issue. The real issue is the defination of what a Sikh is and that goes to the core of the argument, one which was created in 1920-50s by SGPC and has lead the Sikhs to disasters since. You need to look at the core of what SGPC has done by defining only a baptised amritdhari Sikh (ie a Khalsa) can be a Sikh, this is a disasterous way of thinking and has lead to marginalisation of a whole number of sects and turning away those who wished to embraced Sikhi meaning we could have had a country back in 1947. If you keep looking at small issues here and there and judging Sikhs by length of beard and bana. Then you have truely lost it. Sikhi is not in your appearnce Sikhi is in your heart how much love you have for your eternal Guru Sri guru Granth Sahib Ji maharaj.

SGPC has created generations of fools who been running around in circles like headless chickens because its in the interests of the powers behind SGPC to see that influence of Sikhism is contained to a small sect. If we let that plan to continue there will be no Sikhs left in a few decades time because the other religions will have enough numbers to over run Punjab and other area's once inhabited by Sikhs.

[JasSinghKhalsa]

This is the problem Keshdhari/amrithdhari Sikhs been worrying about since 1947 and that fear was created by SGPC (freemasons). During the times of the Sikh misls there was keshdhari, amrithdari and sahejdhari Sikhs. Sahejdhari Sikhs were essential for the survive of the Sikh panth during the mughul era because any guy who appeared overtly like a gurSikh would be hunted down and killed there and then. Sahejdhari's were to the mughuls and afghans as underground christians were to the romans. They provided the continuation of the faith at the most difficult phases in our history.

Genie, you simply seem to be out of your minds. I am gradually understanding what your agenda is over here, but let me clarify some of your misconceptions of Sehajdhari Sikhs protecting Amritdhari Sikhs etc. and the new definition of Sikh you are trying to provide over here and time and again your reiteration of protectiion of Gurudwaras etc.

1). Kesh as a important Rehat Maryada was from the start from first Guru Guru Nanak Dev Jee and all Sikhs (there didn't used to be any differentiation between Sehajdhari/Amritdhari Sikhs) used to keep them as the Rehat Maryada from Guru Nanak and following Guru's. Sikhs not floowing this code of conduct were also there but they still did not use to come under the full 100% Rehat Maryada boundary.

2). Kesh as one of the most important Kakkar was made formal and official by Guru Gobind Singh Jee when founding the KHALSA PANTH during Vaishakhee at AnandPur Sahib. The concept was to have a Singh Swaroop which will be identifiable in millions as at the time of Guru Tegh Bahadur matrydom - all those calling them Sikhs but Kesh-less didn't came forward in Chandni Chowk - Delhi.

3). I feel pity on your arguments of Sehajdhari/Kesh-less Sikhs etc. protecting Gurdwara's and Amritdhari Sikhs. I am slowly and gradually understanding your intentions on this forum. Go through the history and try to find what all Singhs such as Hari Singh Nalwa, Baba Deep Singh Jee, Maharaja Ranjeet Singh, Jassa Singh Ahluwalia and their armies/misls were formed of. Also who used to fight with Aghan Sikhs; I feel pity on your arguments of Kesh-less Sikhs fighting with Afghan armies; there was not even such a concept of Kesh-less Singhs carrying armies and a fighting race. If you want to project history in a wrong way, at least be a bit realistic - don't let people laugh. I also feel pity on your comment on Kesh-less Sikhs required for continuation of faith in difficult times - As per REHAT MARYADA from Dhan Guru Gobind Singh Jee Maharaj "REHAT PYARI MUJHKO, SIKH PYARA NAHIN" - and as per Guru even if 500 Singhs are cut down, 10,000 Singhs are cut down but following the Rehat Maryada and not leaving the Rehat Maryada, it is acceptable.

4). As per your definition of Sikh, the Sikhs who were burnt alive in 1984 by Indian Govt. were Kesh-dhari & Amrit-Dhari Sikhs ONLY. So, a very recent event (27 years old - 1984) - Will say Kesh-less Sikhs were important for continuation of faith? Did any Kesh-less Sikh (as per your definition) came forward for fighting? Very recent event - you are telling a wrong history 200-300 ago; Just to prove it is wrong, I have listed a very recent event. Did anybody came out to protect his Kesh-Dhari / Amrit-Dhari Singh brother?

5). You seem to creating a unnecessary faultline and trying to exploit that faultline with your hidden (not so hidden anymore) agenda on this forum. Time and again, you have the same issue on various posts trying to justify concepts such as "No need to keep Kesh" - SGPC to be controlled by anybody following no REHAT MARYADA etc; Sehajdhari protecting Amridhari/Keshdhari; "Sikhi is at heart, not by Swaroop" etc. Do you have any constructive work or are you being paid for posting such non-sense over here?

I can understand that even lots of Keshdhari and Amritdhari Singhs might not be the best as per following REHAT MARYADA - Politics is there everywhere, but at the priest level, Singhs running Darbaar Sahib and all other Takhts are doing an excellent job - I have the most devoted families in Amritsar doing SEVA whole night and I get the latest update from them; Not even simple Keshdhari Singhs are allowed to do Night SEWA; so what we should say about that? That is the Rehat Maryada and I accept that.

SGPC to be controlled by anybody? What is the population of India? Tomorrow any Tom, <banned word filter activated> and Harry will come and say - I am also Sikh, what if I don't follow the Rehat Maryada of keeping Kesh - Sikhi is at my heart and I want to control the Gurudwara. Why not keep KESH??? Why not just drop the fear of being burnt alive by Indian Govt. or killed by Afghans if you want to control Gurudwaras? Have the resemblance as Guru wanted, you yourself replied earlier that Singhs used to be killed by Afgans etc. and that is the reason why certain people used to have that fear and never want to have the SWAROOP of a Singh. Have that Swaroop and then all control in SGPC is possible - but as you seem to be saying "You want to have both sides of the coin".

People want to enjoy being a fashionable lad, clean shaven (imitating Bollywood star), all fear of being killed off during a Ghallughara (Genocide) is not there by not having a resemblance of a Singh; and when there is a monetary budget of 400 Crores+ in front - Oh, we also want control over that - Sikhi is by heart, not by swaroop.

Waheguru Jee Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Jee Kee Fateh.