The 'Sikh' alcohol and cigarette store in Manchester

[luckysingh99]

Manchester's majority sikh community is the Bhatras, like WLSji has correctly stated above.

I lived there for along time and found it difficult to blend in with them deeply. They are very close knit and don't get involved too much with issues.

You will find the extremes like groups of them who will bad mouth or look down to singhs with trimmed beards and then you get others that will be serving and cooking eggs/bacon in langar hall (I won't name the gurdwara).

To them it is the norm, so when you comment they think you are alien!!!

[luckysingh99]

Are they no bhatras on here that can say I am wrong about their acceptance of alcohol, eggs and meat ???

[Cisco_Singh]

I always thought the Bhatra stuff about eggs and meat in their langar halls were just made up stories, is it actually true ? There isnt any Bhatray or none that I have come accross in the Midlands , I hear there are lots up north leeds, bradford, manchester etc..

Anyway back on topic, that shop with the Khandas probbaly has noting to do with Bhataray whoever owns it should remove the Khanda emblems from the front off the shop, if they want to sell alcohol thats up to them..but they have no right to associate Sikhi logos with their actions.

[luckysingh99]

I always thought the Bhatra stuff about eggs and meat in their langar halls were just made up stories, is it actually true ? There isnt any Bhatray or none that I have come accross in the Midlands , I hear there are lots up north leeds, bradford, manchester etc..

Anyway back on topic, that shop with the Khandas probbaly has noting to do with Bhataray whoever owns it should remove the Khanda emblems from the front off the shop, if they want to sell alcohol thats up to them..but they have no right to associate Sikhi logos with their actions.

Yes it is true about the eggs and bacon. I went to one of these gurdwaras in Manchester and when i came down into the langar hall, I could smell the bacon and saw them cooking the eggs!!

When I told someone who was local in the neighbourhood, they said that they were probably cooking for a wedding janaith that would arrive!!

I have to this day never got my head around it and simply avoided those gurdwaras !

The shop in question was very much owned by a bhatra family and I think they were 3 brothers, but I don't know if they still own it or who runs it. - It's been a good few years since I left the mancs to be here in Vancouver.

[West London Singh]

The

I always thought the Bhatra stuff about eggs and meat in their langar halls were just made up stories, is it actually true ? There isnt any Bhatray or none that I have come accross in the Midlands , I hear there are lots up north leeds, bradford, manchester etc..

Anyway back on topic, that shop with the Khandas probbaly has noting to do with Bhataray whoever owns it should remove the Khanda emblems from the front off the shop, if they want to sell alcohol thats up to them..but they have no right to associate Sikhi logos with their actions.

It is indeed a bhatra owned shop as the surname given on the sign is one of the most common bhatra surnames.

As for your other point, I don't know about their concentration in other northern towns but I do know that they are mainly found in the old port and dock communities of places such as Cardiff, Portsmouth, Bristol and Southampton.

[DailyMail]

Thats right, the ports are dominated by them: Liverpool, Glasgow, Cardiff, Portsmouth, Southampton, Hull, Edinburgh and Bristol. I think they moved into Manchester from Liverpool due to their business with textiles.

I've personally never (knowingly) met one nor have I been to a gurdwara where they are in majority numbers!

[West London Singh]

Thats right, the ports are dominated by them: Liverpool, Glasgow, Cardiff, Portsmouth, Southampton, Hull, Edinburgh and Bristol. I think they moved into Manchester from Liverpool due to their business with textiles.

I've personally never (knowingly) met one nor have I been to a gurdwara where they are in majority numbers!

The exception to that 'port domination' is the city of Southampton. As all of the Sikhs from Punjab that arrived in the UK in the early 1950's came via ship, those ships docked at Southampton and London (Tilbury). Most of those Sikhs got off in London but a fair amount also got off in Southampton. As such, Southampton has a large old time Sikh community, mainly made up of doaba jatts. A walk through the city might sometimes give one the impression that bhatras dominate but that is not the case. There are 4 Gurdwaras in Southampton. Only one of them caters for the bhatra community.

[DailyMail]

I see. Southampton will therefore be an interesting place because I can only assume that it is the only town/city in the UK whereby bhatra's/non-bhatra's are living in significant numbers in relative close proximity for one to truely appreciate the differences/similarities and if any community cohesion (if at all) exists between the two communities.

[singh1986]

I have family that live in Southampton... there is no community cohesion amongst Sikhs full stop. There are 2 Gurdwaray literally across the road from each other because the old community fell out with the new incoming one so they made their own Gurdwara.... you go to either one or the other apparently (so I'm told... also rapidly growing Radhoswami presence in city)

The Bhatra Gurdwara is called Guru Tegh Bahadur Gurdwara... I remember when I was really young in the 90's there was full English breakfast being served but then a few years ago they released this statement...

youtube.com/watch?v=kI2C3fIq2Ic

So I dont know what they are doing anymore...

[West London Singh]

I see. Southampton will therefore be an interesting place because I can only assume that it is the only town/city in the UK whereby bhatra's/non-bhatra's are living in significant numbers in relative close proximity for one to truely appreciate the differences/similarities and if any community cohesion (if at all) exists between the two communities.

As Singh 1986 has articulated above, there is absolutely zero mixing between the bhatra Sikhs and other Sikh groups. Zero. Most Sikhs in Southampton seem to get on better with muslims and hindus than they do with the bhatras and the bhatras themselves seem to get on more with the council estate white chavs. Zero social mixing between the bhatras and non-bhatra sikhs in southampton. The language (dialect), traditions and cultural differences are just too great to ignore. In many ways its like a Norwegian Christian living in the same neighbourhood as an Italian Christian. They might both be Christians but the cultural differences are enormous.