Sikhi and Marriage Jaat Issues

[DesiVibe]

ur right it doesnt, but it sure does affect amritdhari youth coming from minority castes when they wanna get married after taking amrit whos going to take responsibility for them?

times have changed from 100 years ago family networks , now its mainly jathas, taksals, dehras, dals that are keepin in sikhi, so youth turn towards these. Sadly one group is dominated by one jaat or the next ie nihung dals mazhabis, taksals and jathas malwai landowner peasants, sant dehras in england african sikhs.

How many sikhs do you know that will follow the hukam to marry a Sikh regardless of any particular group? so theres a problem. I recall in one of bhai kulbir singhs posts some years ago how rehetvaan gursikhs were refused rishte because of their caste. So breaking from jaat paat is too far a shot when people r too into it, instead you need an intermediate shot.

The problem is further created by different lifestyles clashing which then leaves us with another option to balance even numbers out that helps people get into sikhi and not have future problems. There is a difference to looking at this ideologically and reality whats going on. I have seen countless people from minorities turn back and some of them are now ex amritdharis. I certainly do not feel its right to judge someone as weak as we would not know unless we stood in their shoes.

admin veerji writes

"Since caste has nothing to do with Sikhi, these topics will not be discussed. A Sikh is given Hukam to marry a Sikh regardless of any particular group. What matters is Gursikhi lifestyle. "

[natsilahk]

I actually think a combination of arranged marriages and Hindu concepts have destroyed a large portion of Sikhi.

Being born Jatt, I was exposed to the rest of my "Jatt family" and my parents friends...who were....predominantly Jatt.

I've seen the following circumstances all too much :

Father is a very observant Sikh, but the inter-caste marriage with a wife who is not so observant at all. She is the one who says its no big deal to for their children to cut their hair and so on. This simply works in this manner or the opposite direction (Wife is the observant Sikh).

Imagine if, in this case, the father had a choice to marry anyone of his choice, and was not limited to his caste. Since, Sikhism is important to a few of us, we also want a sibling who is on the Sikh path (regardless of prior race or religion)...we woulda had alot more real sikhs by now..

But in reality what did happen :

Father was ex-communicated from his family for his views on Sikhi, because he did not acknowledge being Jatt like the rest of his family and tried to follow Sikhi principles.

Sad stories :wub:

[Sewadar]

This will be the last post on jatt and other caste issue. We allow this thread to go on but in future any new thread on this issue will be deleted by the sewadars without giving any reason. If new member still post new threads on this particular issue again and again, he/she will be put under moderation. Thanks

[randip singh]

Hi Admin, :wub:

The tact you should take is let these racists post on "Jaat" (caste, race, creed, gender etc) and expose them for the anti-Sikh elements that they are.................. :e:

...........We as Sikh are on the path of righteousnes................these morons who state oh I am not a caste but a race (which in Sikh terms is a non-argument) be challenged on Bani and be shown to all members on this forum and others for the fools they are.............. :e:

.............just my two cents.............

[JSingh]

It is very very difficult to change our parents' mind about cast issue. Majority of our parents believe in it. But times are changing and the new generation will be far better Sikhs than their parents in terms of caste issue. Only the people who they think belong to high caste (majority of them, not all) are proud of themselves. The low caste ones have nothing to be proud of. so they have this advantage. In these days, Sikhs are the biggest discouragement for people who want to be Sikhs. This is sooo true. Just think about all the problems in our community. we have created all of them. We keep doing those things that are strictly forbidden in Sikhi and expecting other people to know about who sikhs are and what sikhi is. Baba Hardev Singh said one day that if you want to make one Sikh, be a Sikh. People will turn to Sikhi by looking at a Gursikh's life. All those ex amritdharis and people who have been turned away from Sikhi, actually is not their fault, but ours. Our parents play a major role in it. We are not free to practice sikhi because we are trapped in daulity between parents and Sikhi. Our parents also know that they are not allowed to believe in caste system and Guru Granth Sahib Ji says that those we are proud of their caste are "fools", but still, this is very hard fact to accept.

[Khalsa4ever]

It is very very difficult to change our parents' mind about cast issue. Majority of our parents believe in it. But times are changing and the new generation will be far better Sikhs than their parents in terms of caste issue. Only the people who they think belong to high caste (majority of them, not all) are proud of themselves. The low caste ones have nothing to be proud of. so they have this advantage. In these days, Sikhs are the biggest discouragement for people who want to be Sikhs. This is sooo true. Just think about all the problems in our community. we have created all of them. We keep doing those things that are strictly forbidden in Sikhi and expecting other people to know about who sikhs are and what sikhi is. Baba Hardev Singh said one day that if you want to make one Sikh, be a Sikh. People will turn to Sikhi by looking at a Gursikh's life. All those ex amritdharis and people who have been turned away from Sikhi, actually is not their fault, but ours. Our parents play a major role in it. We are not free to practice sikhi because we are trapped in daulity between parents and Sikhi. Our parents also know that they are not allowed to believe in caste system and Guru Granth Sahib Ji says that those we are proud of their caste are "fools", but still, this is very hard fact to accept.

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

:TH: Right on jee!

vwihgurU jI kw Kwlsw!

vwihgurU jI kI &iqh!!

[Jaspaul Singh]

It is very very difficult to change our parents' mind about cast issue. Majority of our parents believe in it. But times are changing and the new generation will be far better Sikhs than their parents in terms of caste issue.

Veerji,

I believe this is partially true because of two reasons: First, i believe that not majority but there are many youth still that do believe that the caste system and marriages in same caste has to be in sikhism. Second, in india, we are saying second generation, but in india i believe this same caste marriages will be present for a long time... but yes in the western countries, these views are changing...

[djsingh]

The worst part is that.......

We have been facing this caste problem even after it has been prohibted in the religion.....

If guru ji want us to do away with our differenty creeds and follow one creed of khalsa ....why are we not leaving the caste system..... :wub:

Just saying that sikhism does not preach caste system won do.... ........we will have to phase this system out....

Prominent sikh organisations will have to unite and declare all surnames prohibted.................or device a title system which is not caste based and followed by all.......

Something needs to be done... :D

Fateh