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If God is everywhere, that means God is also in His creation. Correct? This means that the creation is also in God because it can't be in a place where God is not, for there is no such place. Yes, God is One, and we pray to the Creator, not the creation.

LOL. Islamic fascism. When it kicks off, how will whites differentiate you from a musi? Do you wear a turban? Or the rest of the 5Ks? Do you even think the whites will care? The truth is southall is a ghetto and those who live there are used to living in that state. If you think the rest of england is green and pleasant land then you are laughing mad. Once the musis are out, do you think they'll want you? What do white people in this country think of Southall? 'It's a shithole' is what they say. You think they wont stop clearing you out after the musis just because you tried to bumlick them? Have you heard of the phrase 'Perfidious Albion'? http://en.wikipedia....rfidious_Albion http://en.wikipedia....itish_sentiment The rest of the world woke up a long time ago to what horrible people the english are. In our 200 year relationship they have done more damage to us than the hindus/muslims/mughals/persians/aghans/marathas could ever have hoped to do. Again and agian they have lied to us and stabbed us in the back..... because of people like you. The next time your on an EDL rally remember this: 'Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me forever and ever because I am a spineless <banned word filter activated>, shame on me.' And yet many hindus do. Hindustan supports anyone who kills muslims or has an anti-muslim agenda, much in the way they demean sikh internationally. As for hindus all being rich, well if you live in southall then the whole world probably seems rich to you. Many hindus in britain are working class and face the same problems sikhs do like when it comes to girls becoming mattresses for the muslims. On another note, are you saying that british values are in line with Khalsa ones? If you believe that you need to go get an education. Here's what you should do. Get an education. Get married. Emigrate to canada where there are no islamic bogeymen hiding under your bed or in your daughter's bedroom. Work your <banned word filter activated> off and give your kids a good education in N.America. Let them decide their own politics as your own are terrible. Be a good sikh for the rest of your life and then drop dead.

Gurfateh singhoo! I have been reading this topic its very funny, I don’t know who these singhs are who chased u guys but bit childish we are all here to do seva in our own ways, but when majority of the sikh community feel that you are doing something wrong, as a sikh you need to step back and look at your self this is what sikhi teaches us before pointing the finger and saying no your wrong. I always hear negative things about BSSF and have seen some of your post not to impressive BSSF. Post about Barsi samagam at Havelock in dec fact one of the biggest samagams they have had at the gurdwara to date. Over 200 youth stayed and did seva at the barsi for three days and believe in Baba Ji bachan about Sant ji fact. Fact Barsi is one of the biggest programs in the years and has been growing for last six years, if Taksal were promoting lies, maharaj would have put a stop to it by now. Or people would of stopped coming as we are openly promoting sant ji chardi kala at the barsi, if people felt this was wrong why do they keep coming back and bring other? Fact this year barsi went international we had 3 barsis in memory of baba ji in uk 2 in Canada 2 in USA 3 in India all promoting sant jis chardi kala. We were told by baba ji not to argue with singhs about sant ji and let people believe what they want to that’s why you will never get a Taksali posting on here about this topic, but when Taksal is being made a Target then we will reply. On another hand wel done to BSSF for doing this samagam again this year, as it reminds us to start arranging our Shaheedi samagam not in direct competition, but sangat will always go were they feel the true parchar is not hatred as last years is a good example. We have love for every one, and every 1 has the right to believe in what they want. lets not let this hold us back from sikhi singho read bani do seva Guru rakha

When Sant Jarnail Singh Jee Khalsa Bhindranwale comes back, many of us won't find a place to hide our faces. Just saying.

helllo evryone... i am a new memeber here with a motive of gaining some information regarding our own religion... n i have a few questions ... hoping a good response from your side... 1. why does caste system still prevails among sikhs...if our religion aborts it? 2.why do many sikhs visit temple's n worship hindu Gods..whereas idol worshipping is strictly probhitted.? thank u

The Sikh Activist Network calls on the Indian Government to free Dr. Binayak Sen and stands in solidarity with our brothers and sisters of the Adivasi (indigenous) population of India. The Indian government continues a policy of systematically denying marginalized groups the right to manage their own resources and practice their beliefs freely. The “world’s largest democracy” is renowned for the disproportionate measures it uses to suppress these efforts, which often involves gross human rights violations. This disproportionate response is something the Sikh community is all too familiar with.Dr. Binayak is at the forefront of exposing the dire situation of the Adivisi people as well as human rights abuses by the violent Salwa Judum movement, whom many allege is government backed. Since Dr. Binayak’s work is embarrassing for the government, the government had him arrested and then denied him a fair trial. This was so that the government could get a guilty verdict in order to discredit his organization and work. He was found guilty through a politically motivated trial for aiding the Naxalites, a predominately rural movement based on Maoist principles. It is important to note that Dr. Binayak Sen is Vice President of the People’s Union for Civil Liberties (PUCL), an organization that was pivotal in publishing the report, “Who Are the Guilty.” This heavily sourced document exposed the Indian Government’s role and accused many Indian politicians for being directly responsible in the Delhi Genocide, it can be viewed on their website here. We stand in solidarity with human rights activists and efforts of marginalized groups to gain freedom from the tyranny of the Indian State. Please read the following petition and sign it so the signatures can be presented to the Indian Consulate on January 28th 2011. http://sikhactivist.net/?p=2460 To sign petition: http://www.petitiononline.com/binayakt/petition.html

Brother why dont you accept Sikhism? we have pointed out countless flaws in Islam many a time you just have to search previous threads you will see many a valid point why islam fails as a spiritual faith and a political ideology. Tell us why you wont embrace Sikhism and think Islam is better.

Is that a translation or an opinion? Many Mahaan Gursikhs didn't pass the tests for Gurgaddi, but that doesn't mean we start insulting or disrespecting them. Ithaas tells us that Guru Nanak Sahib Ji's worldly family were shown the utmost respect by Guru ANgad Dev Ji up to Kalgidhar Pita Ji. This is Aarta, written by Baba Sri Chand Ji for Guru Sahib, it shows the prem they had: "Let us sing the praises of Nanak, King of kings of both worlds . The whole world is His temple, congregations sing sweet songs in His praise, Millions of goddesses kindle holy lights in His honor, All the gods sing psalms of His praises, All wash His lotus feet. The Sun and moon illuminate Him with their radiance, He is garlanded with mountains of flowers The True Master, the fountain of Light, is merciful to the poor, The king of the winds fans Him while saints and sages meditate on His holiness. The whole universe vibrates with His celestial song, The bells ring out - Onkar, Continuously illuminating the heavens He is one with God whose name is Truth, In Nanak saints find their support. Siri Chand, Nanak's son, declares Nanak is unattainable, unfathomable, unshakeable and pure. Whoever sings Emperor Nanak's praises resides in heaven and achieves complete salvation Oh kind master: give protection to those who seek your shelter. Oh Nanak: You are the savior we are just your children" Only5 - That post by Chatanga is from Suraj Parkash and other historical granths as well.

It must be a coincidence! Surely Muslims wouldn't stoop so low as to indulge in taquiyyah to spread their religion? ;-) For those who don't know, this is what taquiyyah is: http://islam-watch.o...g-for-Allah.htm K.

LOL @ the Muslim da'wah on this thread. It's like one of them has written a little handbook of questions that the rest simply cut and paste to save them from the painful process of thinking for themselves. Peacescent, Your questions have already been answered here: http://www.searchsikhism.com/articles.html I also suggest that you read the following websites which discuss the fallacies of Islam: www.faithfreedom.org http://considerationsofacanadianex-muslim.org/ www.islam-watch.org http://www.ex-muslim.org.uk/ These are written by former Muslims who saw the true face of Islam and decided to leave. Regards, K.

Thanks for pointing this out.

fateh g stay away stay away please i beg u stay away ive seen what tarmala has done pm me if u want more info he is dangerous stay away stay away stay as far away as u can g

Hello, thankyou for your enquisitive enquires with regards to sikhi. By the very fact that you have been drawn to this sikh forum, this suggests that you still have many questions unanswered by your new faith. I am still learning, however i shall humbly attempt to answer your questions. I also look forward to fellow more learned forumers responses. God is everywhere and in everyone. i have taken a nice explanation from the following site: http://www.searchsikhism.com/nirgun.html Let’s begin with Nirgun and Sargun first. We (Sikhs) openly accept this concept to be true since every word of Gurbani is directly revealed from Waheguru. Therefore, Waheguru is Nirgun and Sargun. saragun niragun nira(n)kaar su(n)n samaadhhee aap || He possesses all qualities; He transcends all qualities; He is the Formless Lord. He Himself is in Primal Samaadhi. (Ang 290) niragun aap saragun bhee ouhee || He Himself is absolute and unrelated; He Himself is also involved and related. (Ang 287) raaj joban prabh thoo(n) dhhanee || thoo(n) niragun thoo(n) saragunee ||2|| O God, You are my power, authority and youth. You are absolute, without attributes, and also related, with the most sublime attributes. ||2|| (Ang 211) nira(n)kaar aakaar aap niragun saragun eaek || He Himself is formless, and also formed; the One Lord is without attributes, and also with attributes. (Ang 250) There are many more quotes but the fact is that wherever Waheguru is mentioned as “Nirgun” word “Sargun” also appears. Both words appearing right after each other in the same line does not mean contradiction but a characteristic of Waheguru. Had the two words been separate one could raise doubts. Any rational person can see that since Guru Sahib mentioned both words together there must be hidden meanings to it. The problem with Muslims is that they do not understand why Waheguru is referred to as Sargun. To explain the concept in simple terms, we go to the beginning of time. First Waheguru was only Nirgun as there existed nothing but Him. Then He created the entire creation i.e. solar systems, galaxies, planets, life forms, humans etc. In other words, anything to everything originated from Waheguru. From the One Light, the entire universe welled up. So who is good, and who is bad? ||1|| (Ang 1349) Guru Sahib taught that everyone came from the same source of light and it is the same light that pervades in the entire creation. While Waheguru has no particular form of His own, all forms originated from Him and therefore all forms belong to Him. Since Waheguru is omnipresent and all pervading nothing in the creation is without Him. Therefore, he is Sargun i.e. everything including all life forms and attributes belong to Him. He is the life of the soul in each and every soul; He permeates and pervades each and every heart. (Ang 1273) Thus, it is clear now that the word Sargun refers to creation of Waheguru. When in Gurbaani it says “He Himself is formless and also formed”, “creating Himself” or “fashioning Himself” it refers to creation because He is the creator and resides within the creation. It means that God Himself manifested Himself from His Nirgun (invisible) form, which forever existed, to his Sargun (visible) form. people, O Siblings of Destiny, do not wander deluded by doubt. The Creation is in the Creator, and the Creator is in the Creation, totally pervading and permeating all places. ||1||Pause|| (Ang 1349) This whole world which you see is the image of the Lord; only the image of the Lord is seen. By Guru's Grace, I understand, and I see only the One Lord; there is no one except the Lord. (Ang 922) Guru Sahib saw Waheguru residing in every heart and in every form of creation. This is why He rejected empty rituals like hajj and facing a certain direction during prayers. God is not limited to one direction nor does He reside at one particular place. He is everywhere and everything belongs to Him. Now, it is clear that the word Sargun refers to the creation in which we can see and realize Waheguru and His wondrous miracles. Words “Nirankar” and “Ik Oankar” are not contradictory at all. Here is why: Nir (without) Akaar (form) – Waheguru is without any form. Ik (One) Oan (Brahm or God) Kar (without changes) – One God who has stayed the same, is the same and will always be the same. In other words, He doesn’t change over time. His powers, characteristics and existence are beyond time and forever and ever. Both words convey the same meanings. First word says that Waheguru is formless and has no particular form of His own. Second word means that He is One and has existed forever and does not change over time. He is One universal creator. Therefore, the contradiction does not exist. Muslims are simply confused or trying to find flaws in flawless path, Sikhi, which is an impossible feat. The moghul empire ultimately collapsed. Any empire built on murder, rape and forceful conversions will ultimately fail. Good will always prevail. Our paintings in gurdwaras depict our rich history, which are very proud of. They are not there to breed hatred within sikhs towards muslims. They are to remind us of our history, to remind us of the sacrifices our ancestors made. And they are to inspire us to become better human beings. Sikhism is a unique faith. If you live the sikh way of life this will become apparent. please read the folowig three links summary of distinctions http://www.searchsikhism.com/distinct.html Differences with hinduism http://www.searchsikhism.com/hinduism.html Differences with islam http://www.searchsikhism.com/islam.html <> siq nwmu krqw purKu inrBau inrvYru Akwl mUriq AjUnI sYBM gur pRswid ] ik oa(n)kaar sath naam karathaa purakh nirabho niravair akaal moorath ajoonee saibha(n) gur prasaadh || One Universal Creator God. The Name Is Truth. Creative Being Personified. No Fear. No Hatred. Image Of The Undying, Beyond Birth, Self-Existent. By Guru's Grace ~ ] jpu ] || jap || Chant And Meditate: Awid scu jugwid scu ] aadh sach jugaadh sach || True In The Primal Beginning. True Throughout The Ages. hY BI scu nwnk hosI BI scu ]1] hai bhee sach naanak hosee bhee sach ||1|| True Here And Now. O Nanak, Forever And Ever True. ||1||

1. caste system is not a part of sikhi. There is total equality within the sikh faith. People whom choose to maintain belief in a caste system can not call themself a sikh as this is a core fundamental belief. 2. People who go to temples and worship hindu gods are not sikhs. Being born into a sikh family doesnt make you a sikh, you are only a sikh once you follow the teachings of sikhi fully. If you want to learn about the sikh religion then there is a wealth of information on this site. id also recommend www.allaboutsikhs.com

Councils will be sensitive when dealing with Community Centres owned by religious organisations. I cannot imagine they will force a Muslim community centre to serve alcohol. It's a smoke screen and shows the attitude of the Committee who are hiding behind the council rather than implemeting Gurdwara maryada.

sure feel free to ask any questions

Satkaar Sevadaars have been given a verbal assurance by the Ayrshire Sikh Association that they will no longer be hosting the programme where Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji Maharaaj's Saroop will be taken to the Woodlands Centre (which permits meat, alcohol, tobacco and parties) on Sunday 30 January 2011. This is encouraging news, however, Satkaar Sevadaars have a meeting scheduled with the relevant persons this coming Saturday to confirm any outstanding issues. We will provide the Sangat with a complete picture of the situation in the coming days.

I think the issue with these kind of articles is what other moments of proud Sikh history will writers seize upon next in order to "rationally clarify"? Will they start questioning how it was possible for Guru Arjan Dev Ji to sit on a hot tavvi? Will they start questioning the bravery of the youngest Sahibzaade who were bricked up alive? Will they question the account of how Guru Gobind Singh Ji was seen riding away on his steed by a sadhu whilst Guru Ji's Singhs were mourning his joti jot? Where will it end? We are already under attack from all sides. The last thing we need is for our own people to do other's dastardly deeds for them.

For a long time I have kept my mouth fairly shut when it comes to this website. But honestly, has anyone else noticed they blantly prmote darshan ragi, even though he speaks so much trash? As for there articles, they have a few questionable articles. Like all the fiction stories are about Sikhs having premartial sex and not really following Sikhi. There non-fiction articles are written to sound nice but if you read carefully they clearly disrespect many aspects of Sikhi.

Putting aside the disrespectful usage of 'Nanak' and 'Angad' (in a non-Gurbani context) is this fella suggesting that Guru Nanak Dev Ji's exploits were embellished over the years? This coming from a Sikh writer? My word.

BSSF = pathetic!

Nothing a middle schooler could not come up with. Sri Guru Nanak Dev Ji is Akaal Purakh.

I have remained quiet on this issue - but here goes The truth behind BSSF Founder gagan singh ... formed group to counter boss, then also made sikh tv to counter sikh channel.... Organised shaheed bhai talwinder singh babbar barsi by bssf - to stir controversy in smethwick - from advise from politicians in america harvinder singh sandhu barsi by bssf - again to stir controversy they do sant jee shaheedi smagam to stir controversy camps that happened by bssf at woolwich were not by bssf - they ust asked sangat to put logo on and then didnt do anything. They dont have part in the camps anymore.... as sangat want to stay clear of them BSSF/dal khalsa make sant jee shaheedi smagam and then at london provoke singhs into an argument. . Its sad, main sevadaar has lots of maya - can do anything, but comes into sikhi and goes straight into policits. making organisations, trying to do events etc etc. As a person there is no gurmat there. Its just about point scoring and acting on peoples emotions. The above is fact based. Support dal khalsa, panch pardani etc. Dont take offence, the above is fact based. Admin please keep this up

Jokers. You dismiss their teachings on Sikhi but want to celebrate him? Politics <_<

lol again as i repeated many times to you Dalsingh, you know nothing about me, so please dont make assumptions

Come along with your Khalistani flag to a demo and fly it to your hearts content, i assure you, you will be welcome and if you want you can lead the demo. The edl wanted to come to the annual hyde park rally to show their support for the Sikh community. We advised them that it probably wasn't a good idea due to the narrow mindedness of some members of our owwn communtiy Maybe it doesn't need sikh support, but personally, i am not gonna sit back and be a keyboard warrior on an issue i feel passionate about.

so your saying i'm not welcome here in sangat?

Neo Nazis - Video against the EDL - I rest my case Nazis burn EDL flag

You know what, as an outsider reading your post, I see another possible interpretation. In all of the negatives you put out there, I'm reading about someone who has learned to fight, and with so many Sikh boys being absolutely scared to ever do this, that's no bad thing. You just have to learn self-control. I also see that you ace exams and get offers in companies/educational institutes that many of your peers could probably never manage. So you must have good intellectual capabilities, at least in that domain. When people have rough childhoods it can sometimes manifest with latent anger in adulthood. Deeply felt hopelessness and anger can also remain residually. I think a change of scene is not a bad thing myself but I also think that honest desire for change on your part must go hand in hand with it. What's the point of coming to the US if the same things happen? You make comments about people perceiving you as 'mad'. Maybe firstly tone down whatever it is you do that gives this impression. Maybe you are acting this way to preemptively dissuade anyone from messing with you, who knows? If you are hurt, then you need to be healed psychologically and spiritually. I do believe meditation can play a big part in this. Can I also recommend you look into CBT (Cognitive Behavioural Therapy) as another tool to help you see things differently. You know, I say this from the heart. We can't really do anything about yesterday because it's gone, we can only do anything about today and tomorrow. Sometimes you have to draw a line and go in a new direction. Healing doesn't happen overnight either but takes time. You can't rush it. I do serious suggest meditation, any sort, not specifically Sikh if need be. When you do this, the deep fears you have will arise in your conscious, make note of them and then discard these thoughts and return your focus to what it is you are focusing on with your meditation. Keep up your discipline too, with training. Make sure you keep yourself clean and clothed decently everyday. As well as faith based material, try reading Eckhart Tolle's books, they have helped a lot of people. Sometimes it seems like we have no choice in the things we have to face in life, we do have some choice in how we deal with these things as adults though. Take your time, and start taking small steps in the right direction to start with. Retrain your behaviour and thinking processes. Ask God for support.

Why do people think that Taksaal is the purest form of Sikhism ?Does that mean if someone takes Amrit from a non Jathebandi Sikh has not taken real Amrit ?If you have taken Amrit with a true heart it won't matter what Jatha you took it from you have done the same thing - given your head to the Guru

UAF Is A Cunning Islamist Extremist Front Run By Dirty Islamist Extremists From The Behind.

In Canada, their largest Hindu Advocacy Canadian Hindu Advocacy has joined with JDL .. to support EDL: http://www.adbusters...dl-protest.html One might find it curious to see militant Zionists and Hindu nationalists come together to host a rally in solidarity with racist British football hooligans in the dead of the Canadian winter. But when the common enemy is Islam, transatlantic right wing extremists seem happy to ignore their differences and embrace a marriage of convenience. The leader of the English Defense League (EDL), a rabidly anti-Muslim organization notorious for holding violent and intimidating street protests, was given a forum to address approximately 100 people at the Toronto Zionist Centre by the Canadian wing of the Jewish Defense League (JDL) last Tuesday. In a political and economic climate of uncertainty and fear, scapegoating and blatant racism have found receptive audiences on both sides of the Atlantic. Speaking to the Canadian crowd via Skype connection, EDL leader Stephen Lennon stated that, "Islam stands fundamentally against what we are for. It's like oil and water." He warned Canadians to fight back before being overrun by "Islamofascists" like Britain. Alleged to have been a member of the racist British National Party, Lennon was charged with assaulting a police officer at an EDL demonstration last November. While the EDL has forged links with Dutch far right politician Geert Wilders and elements of the Tea Party movement in the US, this was the group's first foray into Canada. Though major British Jewish organizations have denounced the EDL as Islamophobic and violent, the Jewish Defense League of Canada welcomed them with open arms due in large part to the EDL's support for Israel in what it sees as a war of Western civilization vs. Islam. The JDL claims to be committed to, "the reclamation of the Jewish sense of Justice and the abolition of hatred and bigotry." Outside the event protesters from the Anti Racist Action shouted, "How can you stand arm in arm with these fascists? Your grandparents would be ashamed!" Wearing balaclavas and hoodies emblazoned with the image of a clenched fist over a Star of David, JDL members silently stood guard. Labeled a violent extremist organization by the FBI, the JDL is a far right Zionist movement founded by Rabbi Meir Kahane in 1968. A former charter member of the JDL named Baruch Goldstein murdered 29 Palestinians in a Hebron mosque in 1994. The JDL's website praises Goldstein as, "A martyr in Judaism's protracted struggle against Arab terrorism." Most recently the leader of the JDL, Irv Rubin, and another member were arrested in 2001 for plotting to blow up a mosque in Culver City, California and assassinate Arab-American Congressman Darrell Issa. The Canadian branch of the JDL operates openly in North Toronto, a testament perhaps to the unprecedented strengthening of ties between Canada and Israel over the last five years. While the group has not been linked to any acts of terrorism, hate speech and incitement spewed unchallenged from JDL representatives at the EDL event. Before introducing Lennon a JDL representative advocated the ethnic cleansing of all Palestinians from the Occupied Territories and the destruction of the Al Aqsa mosque in Jerusalem. Expressing support for Florida pastor Terry Jones' effort to organize a mass burning of the Koran on the anniversary of 9/11, he proclaimed, "The Koran should be burned in any civilized country." Global linkages are being made between racist organizations hell bent on combating their perceived enemies. When such voices of violence and provocation receive a welcoming audience in one of the world's most multicultural cities it is frightening to imagine what it portends for the future. The words of a speaker from the group Canadian Hindu Advocacy should serve as a warning. "The problem of Islam is a global problem," he declared. "We will resolve this problem one way or another." Blake Sifton

Why don't you try listening to the advice from more streetwise elders of your own community rather than making protracted and lame bahunay for EDL supporters? You keep going on about how apneean get manipulated by sullay, fair enough. But open your mouth about how goray also have an agenda to turn them into spiritually empty bimbos too. Talk also about the amount of apneean behaving like gorian that you see out and about, and the subtle but powerful pressure from white society to conform to their ways. (That isn't to say we don't have plenty of coconut apnay too by the way). As for the EDL. There is no need for long lectures about them. Just condemn them and their 'Sikh' chumchay. End of.

Stay clear of cults such as tarmala. My chacha ji told me a story of a bibi who got murdered by them for trying to leave.

lol lol lol :lol: sorry for the rudeness..but I really did burst into laughter. on the serious note. No, its not what you need its a uni started by a dodgy cult(Tarmala) .

Is that how sophisticated your political mind is WL? That you think it okay to affiliate with the causes of low class yobbos? Can you SERIOUSLY not see how much of a dumb move that is? SERIOUSLY! I am absolutely flabbergasted. Did you ever stop to think that you might actually be besmirching the good name of Sikhs with such a move. Did you ever stop to give some thought to the mindsets of large swathes of EDL types? As we say in East London: "You sure you're not being a mug mate?!" If your idea of Sikh political expression is to align yourself with groups consisting of open and closet nazis, the barely literate and common yob football hooligan types who couldn't even handle a GCSE in their own language, then I'm sorry but you are a walking example of the Indian ideal of a 'politically clueless Sikh' you speak of. Besides your other points are well off. I'm against all of this overly nationalistic 'posturing' by apnay in their diasporic homes. American apnay can be some of the worst at this. Probably because they are crapping themselves. As an old schooler in the UK myself, I'm fiercely proud of my people's past of facing up to and telling white yob types (be they EDL or BNP or NF) to **** off, when needed. I feel deeply ashamed that any Sikh brother would even entertain the notion of solidarity with such low life sc-um. You need to straighten your head out - and real quick too.

West London 'Singh' apologist for the EDL. Are you for real..........

Who are Sikh 'leaders'? If you mean the old foggies that run Gurdwaras (usually corruptly too), then I'm not surprised that they stay quiet and get on with fleecing funds. Fact is, we haven't got any real leaders in the UK. By this I mean ones that have the support of the majority of the diverse panth, not self appointed ones or ones of various jathas. Plus for an apna to threaten to join rightwing chav goray because people aren't vocally bad mouthing sullay is plain dumb. I live in and have lived in a lot of sullay majority areas. Do you know how much impact EDL bewakoofi has here? I'll tell you - zip, zilch, nowt, nothing! If anything, those idiots (like shortsighted gora policy in general of late) have done nothing but unite Muslims more than ever. Even ones that were at each others throats before. Plus I was around when apnay were at the forefront of challenging Al Mujjaroin types years ago, so don't go on like apnay didn't deal with this issue a long time before low class goray jumped on the wagon and turned it into some chest beating, lager lout days out. Don't be under the illusion that we HAVE TO choose a side between the rightwing tramp gora position and Islamic extremists. We don't. The people that do join the goray are the ones who are so terrified of sullay that they have lost their minds to an extent. That isn't Singh (lion) style at all. In fact it's a bit giddarh when you think about it.....

EDL is a recent phenomena which has gained alot of support from common goreh and few non whites in the UK. It is trying to go global. Naturally a movement of this type will attract large numbers of hate mongers and racists. However there is one side to this which is often overlooked. The increasing influence of militant islam needs to be put in check in the uk. Such organisations appear to slow down the progression of Islamicists such as Anjem Choudary the infamous Muslim cleric Nutcase. He has gone unchecked for years, allowed to say what he wants un-challeneged. Well not anymore, things are about to change. It provides good entertainment to see the two sides go at it. 1 thing i will say is if Sikh Leaders jointly condemn EDL... They should at least be more voiceful about their condemnation of Muslim clerics like Anjem Choudary. Commenting on recent groups is easy. How about the ones that have been around for years hate mongering? ALmahajaroon the organisation he leads. Then once it was banned in uk, he changed the name to Islam4UK. condemn these organisations openly and we will see less sikhs sympathising with EDL yobs.

Just because a Sikh group and a Hindu one are both anti EDL it doesn't make them pals dude. I don't like extremist Islam either but that doesn't make me a supporter of some trash Islamophobic white group who doesn't like them either. How old are you? In any case, tell me who the real K'stanis are these days as opposed to the fake ones please?

Some of us are old enough and worldlywise enough to see yobbo goray low life scum when we see them. I know plenty of Sikhs who faced up to extremist sullah, none of them crawled up a gorays butt in order to do this. Any apna that does is a disgrace and a sell out. Funny how when you see these EDL types Facebook accounts they always have tons of friends who are openly BNP, NF, Combat 18 supporters. Leaders of the EDL have BNP links. Get your head out of the sand and see reality before you embarrass yourself and the quom with your sycophancy and lack of astuteness in these matters.

There's ways of making a stand against certain Islamic groups without joining the EDL. We're not doing ourself any favours by aligning with these far-right groups - even though they argue they aren't far-right.

Well said mate!

Siding with any organisation - even supposedly "well-meaning" Sikh groups as exposed by Southhall Youth (:D) - just isn't for me. I prefer to keep my own council and the only Sikh "organisation" I'll ever belong to is the one Waheguru has directed me towards - the Sikhi faith. All the others are just.....well you simply don't know who believes what, or what your fellow members are up to. No offence to anyone who is a member of any such groups.

thank u all those whose motive was to anwer my questionss.. n mr matheenn..i hope u donot have any problem if we belong to the same place....n d reason y i askd these question because i witnessed it ...dat was the reason i came up with these questions...i have those questions fr muslims as wel...n i am here to gain knowledge on sikhism not islam... peace..

LOL! I guess it's just coincidence that the thread starter, 'Amanbhogal' and 'peacentdisease' just happen to both be from Bahrain. 1. Sikhi doesn't allow discrimination based on caste. The same way Islam doesn't allow alcohol consumption, but many Muslims drink, eat pork and do other stuff that can't be mentioned here. 2. Same as above. You'll have to ask the people who do it why they do.

I know all I need to from your posts mate. Are you Ford 'Giddarh' Capri by any chance???? lol If not - you two must have been separated at birth. Yeh sure. That will REALLY help the cause..........turning it into some right wing hate filled event!

Is that the only reason you are here? To sell the EDL to us?

Before the usual suspects get on my back, or my posts are deleted. Look beyond the media and do your own research. I’ve been to over 10 demos and meets and not had any trouble and if anything have been treated with the utmost respect. The only trouble I had was from a group of black lads who due to the media thought the ‘kkk’ were in town, lol, the klu Klux klan have never even had a ‘branch’ in the UK Yes, I am not naïve to think racists wont try to attach themselves to this movement, but it’s upto the leaders to influence what direction it moves in, and IMHO the leaders/promeninet members including a number of Sikhs are trying to keep the focus on militant Islam and if anything bring about mutual understanding and awareness between different communities in our country.

Turban campaign does not speak for me or the Panth