divorce

[sissy]

leading on from the forum 'IS.....'

what are people's views on divorce and sikhi?

[sher_panjabi]

1) Only people who believe in Guru Granth Sahib Ji as their Guru and actually are Sikhs and Sikhs because of parents or just for the name sake should have Anand Kaaraj.

2) Main causes of divorce = adultery, violence, abuse, communication

- Gursikh (a sikh of the guru) doesn't commit adultery or drink alcohol which is main cause of domestic violence.

3) Sikh marriage = spiritual journey

- if u do sewa, simran, and sangat together - then i don't see how u can get divorce.

Main Causes of divorce (to my knowlege):

1) lack of communication amongst couple

2) abuse/ violence / alcoholism etc

3) no compromise

4) Seeking another man or women to fulfill ur desires

if we follow guru's teachings then divorce is not an issue - if we dont follow guru's teachings then yeah you will get divorce occuring.

my humble views - dont wish to cause offense to anyone.

bhul chuk maaf

[sissy]

good points...

but 2 sikhs can marry each other and still be or end up at different stages of sikhi causing differences

and just like there are differences of opinion about sikhi within the sikh population that can cause problems, this can also happen between a couple

so what if 2 sikhs, despite trying to find a spiritual path together and trying to use sikh values to build a relationship still are not happy together?

and what happens if 2 sikhs marry, and then one partner eg gets led away from the path and despite the support of the remaining sikh partner does not return to sikhi....then ur ideology won't necessarily be applicable....marriage depends entirely on mutualism, irrespective of religion....a mutual will and effort to communicate, respect, be honest, trust etc etc

its true that if u follow the guru's teachings that u will be a better person and therefore less likely to divorce, however we need to account for the fact that people change their ways at different rates and with different sangats.....sikhi may encourage honesty and communication but a person may not acquire this until thye're 50yrs old odd....how much dishonesty and lack of communication should the other partner have to take until that point?.........in the ideal sikh way, u marry someone u r compatible with, but in real life, especially in the context of eastern arranged marriages etc this does not always happen....

here's a hypothetical scenario that represents some of the problems when sikh and indian issues clash....an indian-origin woman and man are introduced...one partner is genuinely interested in sikhi and the other presents themself as religious ie sikh so they sound 'good' and are considered more marriage-worthy...they marry....but now the marriage is 'secured' the non-genuine partner does not even pretend to be interested in pursuing a spiritual jouney that is central to a sikh marriage.......the other partner may gently encourage the non-sikh partner to open their heart to sikhi.....they may succeed or they may not......if they don't and differences continue to occur and accumulate to produce pure hostilty id divorce an option in sikhi?..the genuine sikh may be recognised to have been deceived........they thought they were marrying a sikh but didn't because of the mix-up our generation has about indians and sikhs.........so would divorce and remarriage to a true sikh in this kind of scenario fulfil waheguru's wish that marriage is a spiritual journey of a soul formed from 2 people

sorry, hope that u can make some sense of that hypothetical stream of conciousness!.......i think the crux of the matter is that the sikh way of doing things is with dhian, carefully so as to avoid unnecessarily getting into painful situations eg hostility in the home whereas indian culture is not about using spiritual inteligence but is about what the rest of the pind might say!!!

i agree with ur ideologies...shame that it doesn't tend to occur in everyday life as easily as it is written down/said

[naam_jap]

Gur Fateh,

Great posts... Although I do like to say that not all sikh marriages are spiritual journeys. The individuals themselves in some stage of their lives have to realize the supreme power of the hukam and realize that not all things are within our control. We cannot control other people's thoughts, nor can we cause the sun to not rise today.

But as soon as we realize that there is a universal force acting on all, and that all are binded by that then the feeling of ego comes in humility and start acting with respect to the moral law. Now if two people come to realize this then by Guru's grace two souls become one in two bodies. Then there is no question of divorces. In real sikh relationships there is no divorce.

Since people have detracted from the path of sikhi, they can also make their own judgements about divorce depending on the situation.

Sorry, I know this post is somewhat away from the topic.

[Khalsa4ever]

good points...

but 2 sikhs can marry each other and still be or end up at different stages of sikhi causing differences

and just like there are differences of opinion about sikhi within the sikh population that can cause problems, this can also happen between a couple

so what if 2 sikhs, despite trying to find a spiritual path together and trying to use sikh values to build a relationship still are not happy together?

and what happens if 2 sikhs marry, and then one partner eg gets led away from the path and despite the support of the remaining sikh partner does not return to sikhi....then ur ideology won't necessarily be applicable....marriage depends entirely on mutualism, irrespective of religion....a mutual will and effort to communicate, respect, be honest, trust etc etc

its true that if u follow the guru's teachings that u will be a better person and therefore less likely to divorce, however we need to account for the fact that people change their ways at different rates and with different sangats.....sikhi may encourage honesty and communication but a person may not acquire this until thye're 50yrs old odd....how much dishonesty and lack of communication should the other partner have to take until that point?.........in the ideal sikh way, u marry someone u r compatible with, but in real life, especially in the context of eastern arranged marriages etc this does not always happen....

here's a hypothetical scenario that represents some of the problems when sikh and indian issues clash....an indian-origin woman and man are introduced...one partner is genuinely interested in sikhi and the other presents themself as religious ie sikh so they sound 'good' and are considered more marriage-worthy...they marry....but now the marriage is 'secured' the non-genuine partner does not even pretend to be interested in pursuing a spiritual jouney that is central to a sikh marriage.......the other partner may gently encourage the non-sikh partner to open their heart to sikhi.....they may succeed or they may not......if they don't and differences continue to occur and accumulate to produce pure hostilty id divorce an option in sikhi?..the genuine sikh may be recognised to have been deceived........they thought they were marrying a sikh but didn't because of the mix-up our generation has about indians and sikhs.........so would divorce and remarriage to a true sikh in this kind of scenario fulfil waheguru's wish that marriage is a spiritual journey of a soul formed from 2 people

sorry, hope that u can make some sense of that hypothetical stream of conciousness!.......i think the crux of the matter is that the sikh way of doing things is with dhian, carefully so as to avoid unnecessarily getting into painful situations eg hostility in the home whereas indian culture is not about using spiritual inteligence but is about what the rest of the pind might say!!!

i agree with ur ideologies...shame that it doesn't tend to occur in everyday life as easily as it is written down/said

92504[/snapback]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

This is not only hypothetical, I've heard of cases like this for real! Its pretty sad when it happens, but it DOES happen. You can only go so far, and Gurbani teaches us the value of Sangat, having those who are on the same path as you with you at all times. So of course a marriage partner for a Gurmukh should be another Gurmukh. If not --> divorce.

[Kudrat-Ke-Sab-Bande]

Waheguruji K a Khalsa

Waheguruji Ki Fateh!!!!!!

good posts and geat points. i will jus share my views.

Although I do like to say that not all sikh marriages are spiritual journeys

Thats true. i agree with you.

but people change in their level of spirituality as their times comes with Waheguruji's kirpa.

a marriage is meeting of two souls and not bodies. there is a mutual sense of respect, trust and understanding. a person can get married and later in life realize the essence of sikhi and to be a part of it. however, this is not acceptable to his/her partner. this can cause alot of trouble. would u all justify the person who wants to be Guruji's sikh to stay away from Guruji coz of his/her partner? i personally don't think thats right.

everything happens because of Waheguruji's will/bhana and we have to accept it. being united or seprated like all other things in life are HIS creations. all the sukh & dukh."Sanjog Vijog Duikaar chalave, lekhe aave bhaag".

i don't wish to offend anyone. its jus my views.

sorry.