Hmmm...bachittar Natak...

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Everyone here has probably heard of the Bachittar Natak, which details the meditation of Dusht Daman Sahib. Commonly, this is the previous incarnation attributed to Guru Gobind Singh Sahib. But, and it could just be my ignorance, would that not be against what Sikhism believes? Allow me to explain...

Sikhs believe that the Guru Sahiban were all one Shabad Guru jyot through ten mortal frames and then the final Granth Sahid frame that is the Guru Granth Sahib. Now, that would mean that Guru Nanak Sahib was the first body and Guru Gobind Singh Ji was the last human body of that Jyot. In this case, would not the story of Bachittar Natak be about that jyot? Basically, the Bachittar Natak would be a story of that one Jyot, then would the story not be applicable to Guru Nanak Sahib as well as the rest of the human frames that embodied that Jyot?

Note: This is NOT a Dasam Granth Sahib debate...!!!

[gupt_paapi]

nope.. its lyk jyot passed thru guru ji's but on top of THAT guur ji got another life to be the soni of hsi father, Guru TEgh Bahadur Ji.

These r 2 stories that r LINKED. they BOTH lead to the same thing

[Khalsa4ever]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

I may expose my ignorance in this, but from what I remember, Guru Gobind Singh was always a separate jot from Guru Nanak. Now also what I know is what you said, that the Jot of Guru Nanak passed on from one Guru to the next until Guru Gobind Singh, who then blessed Guru Granth Sahib with it.

Well, you know how when we attain enligtenment, we are supposed to "merge" with the Jot of Waheguroo? It might be similar, in that the Jots of the Gurus merged together...

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

[Akali_Sodhi]

Maharaaj speaks of his past life, remember at the end of the day. Guru Gobind Singh Ji was still a body....joyt would be every were, including the yugs

[singh_comradz]

Sat Sri Akal:

Everyone here has probably heard of the Bachittar Natak, which details the meditation of Dusht Daman Sahib.  Commonly, this is the previous incarnation attributed to Guru Gobind Singh Sahib.  But, and it could just be my ignorance, would that not be against what Sikhism believes?  Allow me to explain...

Sikhs believe that the Guru Sahiban were all one Shabad Guru jyot through ten mortal frames and then the final Granth Sahid frame that is the Guru Granth Sahib.  Now, that would mean that Guru Nanak Sahib was the first body and Guru Gobind Singh Ji was the last human body of that Jyot.  In this case, would not the story of Bachittar Natak be about that jyot?  Basically, the Bachittar Natak would be a story of that one Jyot, then would the story not be applicable to Guru Nanak Sahib as well as the rest of the human frames that embodied that Jyot?

Note:  This is NOT a Dasam Granth Sahib debate...!!!

148564[/snapback]

how i see it the jot of the True Guru which passed through the human Guru's and into SGGS is separate to the souls of the individual Guru's. for instance in my opinion the jot entered Guru Nanak Dev Ji when he was 'missing' for three days and was in communion with God. and the same jot is in the shabad, hence shabad Guru

and in the case of Guru Gobind Singh, as well as his predecessors, they did alot of bhagti and kamai in previous lives.

does that make sense? i apologise if i'm wrong in any way.

[gupt_paapi]

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

I may expose my ignorance in this, but from what I remember, Guru Gobind Singh was always a separate jot from Guru Nanak. Now also what I know is what you said, that the Jot of Guru Nanak passed on from one Guru to the next until Guru Gobind Singh, who then blessed Guru Granth Sahib with it.

Well, you know how when we attain enligtenment, we are supposed to "merge" with the Jot of Waheguroo? It might be similar, in that the Jots of the Gurus merged together...

Waheguroo jee ka Khalsa!

Waheguroo jee kee Fateh!

148571[/snapback]

In Bachitar Natak it also says that only the righteous people can see no difference between all the 10 Gurus...

As candle passes its fire to another candle, the jyot was passed on From 1 body to another.

[Kharkoo4Life]

Sat Sri Akal:

Everyone here has probably heard of the Bachittar Natak, which details the meditation of Dusht Daman Sahib.  Commonly, this is the previous incarnation attributed to Guru Gobind Singh Sahib.  But, and it could just be my ignorance, would that not be against what Sikhism believes?  Allow me to explain...

Sikhs believe that the Guru Sahiban were all one Shabad Guru jyot through ten mortal frames and then the final Granth Sahid frame that is the Guru Granth Sahib.  Now, that would mean that Guru Nanak Sahib was the first body and Guru Gobind Singh Ji was the last human body of that Jyot.  In this case, would not the story of Bachittar Natak be about that jyot?  Basically, the Bachittar Natak would be a story of that one Jyot, then would the story not be applicable to Guru Nanak Sahib as well as the rest of the human frames that embodied that Jyot?

Note:  This is NOT a Dasam Granth Sahib debate...!!!

148564[/snapback]

You are exactly right bro. Nobody wants to admit this cuz so many people have profited (socially and financially) by misleading the masses bout the story of bachitar natak and by admiting that it goes against gurmat (which it does) they would have to both admit they are lying n mistleading others n plus give up their lucrative trade of deceit.

The jot u talk of, of the guru, first entereed guru nanak, passed thru ten mortal frames upto guru gobind singh and now rests within guru granth and khalsa panth. No guru ever wrote about any of their previous incarnations so y the last wud suddenly feel the need to do such seem absurd. The storytellin of bachitar natak goes completly aginst the very fundamentals of SIkhi.

To those who will surely be upset by this, i am not saying that all of the writings in dasam granth are without value. There may indeed be some of it which may have been written by guru gobind singh, but the vast majority is not in accordance with gurbani so could not be the writing of any guru. ANyways, without gettin off track ur right, the story if taken as written wud be about that one jot, same jot which passed thru all gurus, so wud be equally applicavble to all of them. DId the rest of the gurus not remember this past "incarnation" of their jot? Did they forget to preach this story to the sikhs? Was there a reason they didnt talk bout previos lifes? Are previous lives even relevent within Sikhi? Why over 250 years did only the very last guru speak of it?

These are all questions which need to be carefully thought out by every sikh before blindlyjumping and accepting every single word in dasam granth as being true and written by guru gobind singh.

The truth is someone long ago, wrote down the name guru gobiidn singh on the outside of a book with various writings, (some of the gurus, and some not) and people naturally having respect for the guru sahib automatically persumed everthing in that book to be written by that guru. ANd anyone who dares challenges that is taken as being ant-panthic and against the guru, when the truth of the matter is all they want to do is make sure no anti-gurmat writing is accidently attributed to be the gurus jus because of unee shurdha.

[Harnek Singh]

Waheguru Jika Khalsa, Waheguru Jiki Fateh,

I came across this site, I need sangat's opinion on this matter greatly.

Bachittar Natak

Gurfateh

[Kharkoo4Life]

Waheguru Jika Khalsa, Waheguru Jiki Fateh,

I came across this site, I need sangat's opinion on this matter greatly.

Bachittar Natak

Gurfateh

148639[/snapback]

Everything in that article is true. Unfortunately, the majority of the general public is not familiar with those facts and have gone on blindly accepting everything in the dasam granth as bieng written by guru gobind singh. And cuz of this unee shurdha (blind faith) any attempt by anyone to conduct a logical analysis of dasam granth is taken as an act of disrespect.

Hopefuly after reading this article many people will learn the truth (thou i am certain those who wish to live by blind faith will continue to ignore all the questions raised in the article).

[ms514]

Sat Sri Akal:

Maybe I should have not started this topic as it is going exactly where I did not want it to go...which is debating the authenticity of the Dasam Granth Sahib and the compositions within. The question was whether the composition would apply only to the Tenth Patshahi or all Gurus, but it is going somewhere completely different.

Sorry for the trouble and anyone I offended...