What Is The Need? (rebellious Sikhism)

[Guroo Guroo Jaap]

I was wondering what is the need of Khalistan? , Well I know the whole background about 1984 and aftermath , and debates about Sikhs being unequally treated at different places etc etc. But its all leading to a very protesting-wing of Sikhism , I see young people wearing Singh Shirts/Hoods , idolizing Bhindrawale , and acting as if they are the warriors . I almost agree everytime I see atrocities on Sikhs anywhere in the world.

'But begging for a land and not winning it' is not something Sikhism does. Now a days Sikhs are becoming very insecure about their own identities and demanding separate rights and land for themselves like we are some oppressed African refugees (#!@). What good will it do for the Gurus ? , Will the land acquirement please the Guru? Our Gurus only told all reality is what we have perceived during our lives. All this demand for land I think has no divinity attached to it , its all very humanish . Any community in the world can start protesting for a land , it does not look good when I see my own Sikhs do it . I have always pictured the great martyrs as those who never begged or acted oppressed , they always had that victory within , and they never gave in , they fought for what is theirs.

At times even I have felt the need for a separate land (I hate the term Khalistan...) , but I just went through separate thoughts while in bed last night.And thought of sharing them with the Sangat. Please be open about it, any darn Sikh can start yelling about the need of Khalistan and all the emotions attached but does it serve the purpose of Sikhism , or the purpose for which this great dharma was blessed by our Gurus? I think not.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.

I suppose most people see it like this, why should we go on for so long for Khalistan? Fair enough! Some people really arent bothered about it. But i suppsoe what it really comes down to are the families that have actually been affected by this in some way. This could be like they have relatives suffering in india's jails right now as we speak, or they have lost a loved one because of 84. And i think thats what we dont realise. The people that want, need and deserve Khalistan the most are the ones who have been affected by it and need a change to happen! Most the youth these day thinks that if we get Khalistan then thats it, we're sorted, we got the homeland for the Sikhs. But no one thinks of the affected ones! And when they see the youth acting like this, it probabally breaks their hearts because most the youth havent got a clue about it. I think we should have Khalistan to support the victims of the whole 84 thing, there are more people affected by it than we think!

[Akritghan]

I was wondering what is the need of Khalistan? , Well I know the whole background about 1984 and aftermath , and debates about Sikhs being unequally treated at different places etc etc. But its all leading to a very protesting-wing of Sikhism , I see young people wearing Singh Shirts/Hoods , idolizing Bhindrawale , and acting as if they are the warriors . I almost agree everytime I see atrocities on Sikhs anywhere in the world.

'But begging for a land and not winning it' is not something Sikhism does. Now a days Sikhs are becoming very insecure about their own identities and demanding separate rights and land for themselves like we are some oppressed African refugees (#!@). What good will it do for the Gurus ? , Will the land acquirement please the Guru? Our Gurus only told all reality is what we have perceived during our lives. All this demand for land I think has no divinity attached to it , its all very humanish . Any community in the world can start protesting for a land , it does not look good when I see my own Sikhs do it . I have always pictured the great martyrs as those who never begged or acted oppressed , they always had that victory within , and they never gave in , they fought for what is theirs.

At times even I have felt the need for a separate land (I hate the term Khalistan...) , but I just went through separate thoughts while in bed last night.And thought of sharing them with the Sangat. Please be open about it, any darn Sikh can start yelling about the need of Khalistan and all the emotions attached but does it serve the purpose of Sikhism , or the purpose for which this great dharma was blessed by our Gurus? I think not.

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa

Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh.

I suppose most people see it like this, why should we go on for so long for Khalistan? Fair enough! Some people really arent bothered about it. But i suppsoe what it really comes down to are the families that have actually been affected by this in some way. This could be like they have relatives suffering in india's jails right now as we speak, or they have lost a loved one because of 84. And i think thats what we dont realise. The people that want, need and deserve Khalistan the most are the ones who have been affected by it and need a change to happen! Most the youth these day thinks that if we get Khalistan then thats it, we're sorted, we got the homeland for the Sikhs. But no one thinks of the affected ones! And when they see the youth acting like this, it probabally breaks their hearts because most the youth havent got a clue about it. I think we should have Khalistan to support the victims of the whole 84 thing, there are more people affected by it than we think!

i agree-i always here ppl say they love being indian and that its in the past-but what do they knw-only those knw who have been through it-my father was kharkoo singh my family are torture victims i have an 18 yr old chacha who is shaheed.....its easy for people to say we want khalistan or we dont want it

[SA6]

Guys, if you don't mind me butting in.

Even if you haven't got justice for the 1984 riots, how will creating a separate Khalistan deliver that justice?

Why give up your own country? Why not be Indians and demand justice as Indians?

We have fought the Afghans, the Iranians, the Arabs, the Central Asians and in the end we realized that unity is strength. If we continue to fight among ourselves, then outsiders will always be ready to take advantage of us.

I am a Maratha, and even my community has sacrificed its blood for the unity and independence of India.

[Singh_Valiance]

Guys, if you don't mind me butting in.

Even if you haven't got justice for the 1984 riots, how will creating a separate Khalistan deliver that justice?

Why give up your own country? Why not be Indians and demand justice as Indians?

We have fought the Afghans, the Iranians, the Arabs, the Central Asians and in the end we realized that unity is strength. If we continue to fight among ourselves, then outsiders will always be ready to take advantage of us.

I am a Maratha, and even my community has sacrificed its blood for the unity and independence of India.

1. Creating Khalistan won't help us deliver that justice , agreed, but the move will ensure nothing ever like the 84' happens to Sikhs again.

2. Why not demand justice as Indians? , Infact thats what we have been doing ever since the Indian Constitution was written , We fought for the freedom as Indians , We gave Shaheedis as Indians , Our Gurus died for other religions , We have done almost everything that no other race has ever done , but when our very own country becomes inconsiderate of our feelings , ever since its Independence , We will fight for our own space.

The question is not about whether we are fighting as Indians or Punjabis or Sikhs , the question is about being potrayed right . Ever wondered why Sikhs are always potrayed as Funny SardarJi's or Taxi Drivers in 90% of bollywood flicks ? , Ever wondered why the RSS and Bajrang Dal , always tries to dilute the Sikh Image? Ever wondered why a Group of Sikhs protesting against a fake Baba are attacked upon by the country's very own police? Perhaps they have no Idea that the Baba is not good for any religion , not only Sikhism , he has followers from all faiths , and He is nothing but a politically motivated propaganda, who abuses 'Daasis' in his own court , He has a CBI case against him , and on top of that he has Crores of followers all brain-washed! , Why then in the whole of country , only Sikhs protest against him , because thats what they have been doing ever since their formation , fighting against the False.But the country like India which is already full of money hungry Fake Pandits , nonsense rituals and religion-driven politics, poverty-stricken groups , why would they care if another Baba comes and takes them over?? If they don't , we surely do.

And its good that you are a Maratha , you should understand the matter better , our and your people fought side by side against the Tyranny , even for Independence Struggle , or against the Mughals.Its just that we became an Order , a Brotherhood , that will keep fighting till the end of time, while majority of Indian groups will or have faded away.

:gg:

[mskcan]

Guys, if you don't mind me butting in.

Even if you haven't got justice for the 1984 riots, how will creating a separate Khalistan deliver that justice?

Why give up your own country? Why not be Indians and demand justice as Indians?

We have fought the Afghans, the Iranians, the Arabs, the Central Asians and in the end we realized that unity is strength. If we continue to fight among ourselves, then outsiders will always be ready to take advantage of us.

I am a Maratha, and even my community has sacrificed its blood for the unity and independence of India.

Dear Sir/Madam,

I believe as a result of reading a few posts you are over-generalising the issues/concerns posted here. You speak as if it is a vendetta of all Sikhs to create an independent state of Khalistan, when for the most part Sikhs, punjabis, women, children who have suffered genocide, false killings, torture, dismemberment amonst other things merely wish for justice to be served, and the world to hear their voices so that such events do not occur and those that continue to occur (think 1984 George Orwell) be prevented.

PLease see: for UN's realisation of the events...

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showtopic=38268&hl=

Additionally the Sikh seed has been planted in hundreds of countries now, and they are prosperous there, so who can say which is the Sikh's country? Sikhs in reality are of the land, and Freedom is their birthright, for that reason they live in the Unique Image wherever they go. However, as the land of 5 rivers remains the place of origin of the Sikh path, like Jerusalem is to the Christians, that land remains a land of reverence for all those who are alive today...

Please read UN link to understand how voice's are only heard if there is a vibratory medium for it's translation. Withouth this medium, all there is is empty space.

[waaheguroo]

Is there any point in calling it "Punjab" anymore. Only 3 of the 5 rivers flow through it. Pakistan Punjab has lost alot of their Punjabi culture. The Punjabi speaking Hindus of haryana have got their own state so why can't the Sikhs have their own?

[young khalsa]

Khalistan is going to be there.

RAJ KEREGA KHAlsa akee reahe na koey

[SA6]

Guys, if you don't mind me butting in.

Even if you haven't got justice for the 1984 riots, how will creating a separate Khalistan deliver that justice?

Why give up your own country? Why not be Indians and demand justice as Indians?

We have fought the Afghans, the Iranians, the Arabs, the Central Asians and in the end we realized that unity is strength. If we continue to fight among ourselves, then outsiders will always be ready to take advantage of us.

I am a Maratha, and even my community has sacrificed its blood for the unity and independence of India.

Dear Sir/Madam,

I believe as a result of reading a few posts you are over-generalising the issues/concerns posted here. You speak as if it is a vendetta of all Sikhs to create an independent state of Khalistan, when for the most part Sikhs, punjabis, women, children who have suffered genocide, false killings, torture, dismemberment amonst other things merely wish for justice to be served, and the world to hear their voices so that such events do not occur and those that continue to occur (think 1984 George Orwell) be prevented.

PLease see: for UN's realisation of the events...

http://www.sikhsangat.com/index.php?showtopic=38268&hl=

Additionally the Sikh seed has been planted in hundreds of countries now, and they are prosperous there, so who can say which is the Sikh's country? Sikhs in reality are of the land, and Freedom is their birthright, for that reason they live in the Unique Image wherever they go. However, as the land of 5 rivers remains the place of origin of the Sikh path, like Jerusalem is to the Christians, that land remains a land of reverence for all those who are alive today...

Please read UN link to understand how voice's are only heard if there is a vibratory medium for it's translation. Withouth this medium, all there is is empty space.

mskcan, Sikhs are not the only groups who have suffered.

Many thousands Marathis were killed and maimed in religious riots across India in the last 50 years. Some of them were supported by politicians. Yet, we persist, we don't demand a separate country.

This is because our aim is to put aside regional differences and solve our problems as a nation. When it comes to protecting the unity of India, we put aside all our individual grievances.

India may have its faults, but it has given its citizens by far, the most humane treatment in the whole of Asia and the Middle east. Even Europe.

Look at the violent and bloody histories of China, Russia, Japan, Burma, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, Turkey in the last 60 years. Millions and millions have been killed like flies.

The sole objective of uniting as a single nation was to make ourselves strong enough so that we are never invaded again. We are never enslaved again by foreigners.

We may never know why 1984 happened and what was the purpose behind it. But rest assured, the purpose was not to kill Sikhs just for the sake of it.

[SaRpAnCh]

KHALISTAN ZINDABAD

[Guest _xxx_]

mskcan, Sikhs are not the only groups who have suffered.

Many thousands Marathis were killed and maimed in religious riots across India in the last 50 years. Some of them were supported by politicians. Yet, we persist, we don't demand a separate country.

This is because our aim is to put aside regional differences and solve our problems as a nation. When it comes to protecting the unity of India, we put aside all our individual grievances.

India may have its faults, but it has given its citizens by far, the most humane treatment in the whole of Asia and the Middle east. Even Europe.

Look at the violent and bloody histories of China, Russia, Japan, Burma, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka, Saudi Arabia, Iran, Iraq, Turkey in the last 60 years. Millions and millions have been killed like flies.

The sole objective of uniting as a single nation was to make ourselves strong enough so that we are never invaded again. We are never enslaved again by foreigners.

We may never know why 1984 happened and what was the purpose behind it. But rest assured, the purpose was not to kill Sikhs just for the sake of it.

The Maratha movement died with death of Shivaji. After him, clever Brahmin Peshwa diverted the energies of the Marathas for his personal ambitions for conquering lands. There is no maratha movement in india right now, never has been for past hundered years. However, non-maratha Bal Thackrey, another clever brahmin, has used Marathi people for meeting his political ends.

Instead of lecturing here, why don't you lecture Shiv Sena goons not to threaten and terrorize poor north Indians, esp. from Bihar and U.P, from entering in Maharashtra. (is this your version of desh-Bhakti)

You want Sikhs so that you are never invaded again, is that all? Don't Sikhs have another use or place in India except protecting your honour.

You have been explained the reasons for 84, but your sly mind is not ready to accept it, as yet. Maybe , according to you, the purpose to kill Sikhs was one of another way of strengthning national unity. Call it nation building!