Raag

[Singh-in-Welling]

Is it just me......or is raag a must! we can talk about all these different styles of kirtan, but if the shabads sung are not in raag then isn't is going against Maharaj's Hukum?

i've been going through old topics that talk about we should not say other styles of kirtan are wrong....but we are not here to judge, but to follow Maharaj's Hukum! has this tradition, of not only listening to Maharaj's commands but singing in the correct format (raag) been lost throughout the world?

it's virtually changing Gurbani! for example, people singing in raag bhairo instead of raag raamkali, have literally changed what Maharaj is trying to tell us!

i've heard many people saying "it's not abut raag, but singing with pyaar"....but how can we sing with pyaar if we are not listening to what Maharaj is trying to tell us! to be honest the number of raagis out there that sing in the raag ordered by Maharaj are vastly outnumbered to those that do not sing in raag!

i've been having this argument for a long time now.....and now it just seems to look like i'm wrong! for example, people like Giani Amolak Singh Ji did not use to sing or teach kirtan in raag all the time, but look how many people got anand from singing along with them. am i wrong to believe that we should sing a shabad in the raag that Maharaj has written it in?

is it just me?

[Jagmeet]

The raag in which the shabad is written should be sung in the that particular manner.

There are some shabads for example in Sri Dasam Granth and Sri Sarbloh Granth that have no raag, but raag can be added to those depending on the what the shabad is about.

Personally kirtan that is not sung is raag, doesn't make it any less then the actual raag it is in. It just means the message can not be totally understood. You can get anand and ras from kirtan, whether its in raag or not. Just like if gurbani is read in a sehaj paath, you can't read it in raag, you just speak it how its written. You would just get the same anand out of it. But with singing in shud raag, you understand the mood maharaj is getting across. Very important.

Hopefully that makes sense!

[Khaalis]

Actually there is more to it than that. When one replaces the chorus (Rahao) of a shabd with another Pada, they totally change thje message and meanign of the shabd - most kirtani who don't follow Sirlek i.e. raag hukum, don't follow rahao in most cases too. The raag is important because it gets across that which language cannot - i.e. context. The context comes through body language and timbre/expression of voice. Singing a Bairaag or seriousshabd in a happy go lucky format is a total disrespect of Gurbani - i.e. the whole business orientated 'Lakh Kushiyan Paatsaahihan' fraud that kirtani have invented and ignorant sangat demand at thie kiddies birthday akhand paath bhogs etc.

[KEERPA]

kirtan that is not sung is raag, doesn't make it any less then the actual raag it is in. It just means the message can not be totally understood.

so not being fully understood means its equal to Raag Gurbani???????

What I get from it is Raag Kirtan is "higher" than when someone doesnt follow Gurmat Gurbani Raag, and when not sung in raag(not fully understood) means it is "lower" form of kirtan???????

When you say Raag Ramkali/Sohee then it should be sung in what the Manglacharan states. Lets sing Anandu Sahib in a very sad state of despair way and see if it is not flipping the reality around??????

:wacko: after all this youll get people singing Gurbani in heavy metal because "nobody else sings in Raag" :rolleyes:

Learn Kirtan in Raag so you are singing in RAAG, dont learn the showtunes kirtan that is popular. If people dont want to hear raag Kirtan then they shouldnt go to the Gurdwara. If they dont want to hear True Gurmat Gurubani Raag then they are telling Guru Arjan Dev that his system isnt good enough for them????????