Kirpan Case For Young Boy

[Papi]

No sorry, i'm not gonna waste my time!!!

How pathetic! First you yell at him for not knowing the significance of the Kirpan but when he asks for more information, you choose not to give any :rolleyes:

[Only five]

No sorry, i'm not gonna waste my time!!!

If you consider yourself a Sikh atleast have the decency to learn what the term and it's principle's mean, instead of being so ignorant.....................

Good day and good luck

If a Kirpan has some other meaning? Please explain.

It sounds very much like the Brahmans and there thread (Jaanou).

Why don't you search this site for the answer? You ask why Kirpan, but you made it clear already, that you won't accept any facts presented. Also you show no sincerity on finding out why.

So here i'll have this back and forth debate with you. Tell us, what kind of evidence you want be to present that will make it clear for you that Kirpan is not like the Jaanuo, not outdated, and it mus be worn.

[SunSingh]

KPhull what the hell are you on about, is mandatory for 'amritdhari' Sikh, something all followers of Sikhi should aspire to do!!!

How is carrying a small blunt dagger, showing that were living 300 years in the past, and how is not compatible with living in modern times, and what relation has the kirpan got to with knife crime. How many attacks have happened using the kirpan??

Do you actually know the purpose of the Kirpan, other then a tool for self defence??

KPhull, you seriously need to think before posting such nonsense, I know of no Sikh, no matter how little knowledge they have of Sikhi showing such disregard to any of the 5 k's!!

"Do you actually know the purpose of the Kirpan, other then a tool for self defence??"

No sorry, can you enlighten me please?

It's about surrendering our minds to the Guru's will. This surrender is the true essence of our path. Look at historical sakhis, it is those Sikhs who had the kirpa to surrender who progressed the most. Those who reject Amrit, and the required kakkars, fail at the first step.

I find Yuktanand Singh ji's posts to be quite illuminating, reflecting a very deep understanding of Gurbani: Explanation of Sikh dharm

I recommend everyone read these, as they contain exceptional knowledge for prachaar.

[papee]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

Sorry Jag_singh I never read your post correctly...

Having being approached by many sikh students about kirpan cases and advising students about what to do next, I have concluded that most of the time it's not the students who goes around showing off their kirpan, I have rarely heard of such cases. Sometimes its often a case when a student is often doing physical excerise at school in P.E, they often have to change into sports gear. This is when other students notice a gursikhs kirpan and often raise it with the teacher, most of the time it is lack of education on the teachers part for not knowing not only freedom of religious expression but also laws within this country.

As a Gursikh we shouldnt hide the fact that we wear a kirpan (at the end of the day Most educated people know about the 5k's) but at the same time we shouldnt be going around scaring people for no reason. A gursikh should remain humble and when justified use the kirpan, but at last resort.

With Gurus Kirpa alot of Kirpan cases in this country do get sorted, However, as stated before it is a sad fact that not many people including schools are educated about this.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

[buddasingh]

Why do we (SIKHS) in the modern age need to wear a kirpan?

We say, the Sikh Faith is compatible with all time lines, but by reading the article and some of the quotes. It clearly indicates we are stuck 300 years in the past.

Does a student in a school, really need to wear a kirpan?

I completely understand the outlook from the staff at the school, the dangers of the weapon being used, not by the young Sikh student, but by other students.

The Modern age we live in, knife crime is on the rise, especially in the larger cities. Schools are using limitless resource to stop knife crime and make schools a safe environment.

Don't you think we should be helping them to attain this?

I apologise if I have offended any one.

"We"? With that knowledge base, you consider yourself a Sikh?...based on your birth I assume? That would be the very definition of non-sikh. There is a great deal of basic info on the net and on ss, have some quick basic reads if a sikh forum interests you.

Why don't governments ban the manufacture, production, sale, use, display, etc of: swords, guns, baseball bats, cricket bats, field hockey sticks, ice hockey sticks, pool cues, motorcycles, alcohol, concerts, protests, hammers, kitchen knives in homes,.... all those things are invovled in crime, violence, or risky behaviour in far larger ways than a kirpan.

Wait lets get really modern kpull.... Maybe the school should think about mandating turbans for all the kids when they are on the playground equipment. God knows such a simple step could prevent so many childhood head injuries, so many that also go undiagnosed and become barriers in some way education and employment for a lifetime.

[papee]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

I was just sent this Message Via Txt message:-

"United Sikhs Live Today on MATV Sky Channel 793 @ 7pm Talking about KIRPAN BAN @ London School"

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

[Jag_Singh]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

Having being approached by many sikh students about kirpan cases and advising students about what to do next, I have concluded that most of the time it's not the students who goes around showing off their kirpan, I have rarely heard of such cases. Sometimes its often a case when a student is often doing physical excerise at school in P.E, they often have to change into sports gear. This is when other students notice a gursikhs kirpan and often raise it with the teacher, most of the time it is lack of education on the teachers part for not knowing not only freedom of religious exp​ression but also laws within this country.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

Your right. Its a hard thing to do, but there are ways around this issue. Maybe teaching the young gursikhs to wear 'shartr' so it can be remained gupt, cannot be seen under any circumstances. Maybe a by wearing a smaller gatra, to keep the kirpan quite high up. Adjusting it in ways to make the gursikhs feel comfortable during physical exercise. Some techniques work for some but not for another.

As a Gursikh we shouldnt hide the fact that we wear a kirpan (at the end of the day Most educated people know about the 5k's) but at the same time we shouldnt be going around scaring people for no reason. A gursikh should remain humble and when justified use the kirpan, but at last resort.

Likewise. It's not about hiding anything, its about keeping the boundaries.

[Jag_Singh]

"We"? With that knowledge base, you consider yourself a Sikh?...based on your birth I assume? That would be the very definition of non-sikh. There is a great deal of basic info on the net and on ss, have some quick basic reads if a sikh forum interests you.

Why don't governments ban the manufacture, production, sale, use, display, etc of: swords, guns, baseball bats, cricket bats, field hockey sticks, ice hockey sticks, pool cues, motorcycles, alcohol, concerts, protests, hammers, kitchen knives in homes,.... all those things are invovled in crime, violence, or risky behaviour in far larger ways than a kirpan.

Wait lets get really modern kpull.... Maybe the school should think about mandating turbans for all the kids when they are on the playground equipment. God knows such a simple step could prevent so many childhood head injuries, so many that also go undiagnosed and become barriers in some way education and employment for a lifetime.

Agreed. Rather than to tackle such issues 'kpull' is only helping to get rid of something which is not even close to the above mentioned.

[papee]

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

I personally believe that we should be comfortable wearing a kirpan and shouldnt keep this "gupt", nor should we start telling people we have a kirpan, as most people know we wear a kirpan anyway. (not many but lessons are given in school in R.E about 5'ks)

However Like Jag_singh has stated other Shaster that a gurmukh carries should be kept Gupt. Gupt is always best.

ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕਾਖ਼ਾਲਸਾਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂਜੀਕੀਫ਼ਤਹਿ

[KEERPA]

At my new job the head director told me to wear my Kirpan underneath my clothes which to me is a fair request . I see many multimillion dollar clients daily so me being a Sikh with panj kakkars and keeping Kirpan gupt is a good way to maintain my Sikhi as well as my job. Wearing it on the outside at work would make people opposed to it start complaining but if they dont know I wear one then they have nothing to complain about other than my Dastar(which they have no right to try to get my boss to fire me for not removing but with Kirpan people have the ability to loophole just to get you to either part with your faith or keep your job)

Young Sikhs should keep Kirpan gupt because society wants you to not wear it so having all the youth wear one gupt makes them think we arent wearing one when in reality we still keep our faith. Some kids Ive seen are clueless to Sikhi and even if their parents are Anmritdhari doesnt mean the kid knows anything regarding Sikhi or Kirpans etc so in some cases Id say there are stupid youths maybe abusing their right to wear Sikhi by provoking complaints because of their attitude etc......

A Sikh should have the ability to have basically "jedi mind trick" ability in order to win a fight, then hands and as a last resort that would end up in death without using brute force then the Kirpan should be used, but just because some guy cheapshots you doesnt mean "bust out the Kirpan" etc....... Some people think kirpan first and Id say they dont understand Gurbani and it reflects in their character.