How To Stop

[dalsingh101]

As much as I don't like this too, it's not as sinister as the Muslim situation. Not saying its desirable but you know what I mean, I hope? It's like the girls who go off with white guys look around their own community, don't see anyone they like and then they make a conscious decision to choose 'white'. With girls choosing Muslims, there's a whole insidious aspect to it, whereby we know Muslim lads are "encouraged" by certain sections within their faith to convert the women of the kuffar.

I don't agree. I think they have the same agenda of destablising and reducing other communities whilst bolstering their own. It's just one goes about it infinitely more subtly than the other.

Whites often perceive the situation (consciously and subconsciously) along Darwinian lines where they are being the saviours of the dark skinned women from the lesser, brutal, simian like men of her community. This feeds into their control freak, 'hero' and exoticism complexes. That's their 'insidious' element.

Besides, it's their vichaar that starts off as the jumping point for apneean to do what they want and have sexual relationships with whomsoever they feel. Sullay jump in to take advantage of this western conditioning.

[Kalsingh]

Here's a thought : how about we sikh men set the right example ?

The Sikhi that my family has brought me up with teaches me that there is complete and utter equality between the sexes in sikhi. Women can do whatever the boys do. And in my family that is true. None of us men drink or smoke. Neither do any of our women. None of us men have slept around and neither have our women. None of us men visit pubs and neither do our women.

If i or my father did any of these things how on earth could I state that my sister could not do the same ? Is she....because she is a 'she', only half a human ?

For every thread about the unsavoury and immoral things that some sikh females do there should be a hundred threads about the immoral antics of sikh men. We....are a hundred times worse.

You're going off the point. The OP is saying how we should warn our women of the intentions of these people who want to befriend them for sinister reasons. The OP is not thrashing our women.

And about the whole sexism argument for our women not choosing to stay with sikhs (this is not particularly aimed at West London Singh), although sometimes there may be a basis for using it in some situations, overall I reject it and I dont believe it is as powerful a tool in explaining this phenonmen as some people like to portray. Sexism is rife in all communities, particularly muslim communities.

[West London Singh]

You're going off the point. The OP is saying how we should warn our women of the intentions of these people who want to befriend them for sinister reasons. The OP is not thrashing our women

Fella, that is a totally irrational fear. There are probably more mad axe murderers out there with sinister motives against Sikh women than there are 'muslims'. Imagine if sikh female after sikh female kept starting threads here about how some of our men need to be very very carefull because there are many many 'uncle' types out there that start off by pressurizing the sikh into having a drink......but the real sinister motive is that he wishes to have a permanent drinking partner.

Fear...has to be rational. I see threats to sikhs...and sikh women all around me....but the 'muslim youth' is the least of these threats. Have you seen the amount of sikh women and men that have become christians in canada ? Have you seen the number of Punjabi churches out there ? :o The numbers are staggering. Obviously coz we live in england where Christianity is more of a museum relic rather than a working functioning religion we don't really see or understand the threat from it but trust me fella....for our worldwide sikh diaspora....and if you really really wanna 'protect' sikh girls.....the most 'sinister' of them all are the evangelical christians.

Should the sikh women also keep starting threads here warning sikh men about middle age white female 'cougars' that prey on 'brown' men to pick up.....targetting brown men in a 'sinister' way ?

Every single time I read something somewhere about 'muslim men using tricks to lure sikh women' it makes me cringe. It makes me cringe because when the rest of the world reads it they don't think "oh my god....those evil muslims are really bad". What they think to themselves is "oh my god......sikhs must be really stupid". We just make ourselves look like vulnerable slow fools with these constant accusations. All we're telling the world is that our girls are a bit thick and vulnerable and are easily tricked.

I have so many muslim family friends and every last one of them is a wonderfully hardworking decent human being. I really detest this constant vilification of them.

[dalsingh101]

I have so many muslim family friends and every last one of them is a wonderfully hardworking decent human being. I really detest this constant vilification of them.

I have to say. I often feel the same way when you vilify every last Hindu as complicit in antiSikh activity. (I don't have any Hindu friends by the way not that I see anything wrong with anyone that does).

What they think to themselves is "oh my god......sikhs must be really stupid". We just make ourselves look like vulnerable slow fools with these constant accusations. All we're telling the world is that our girls are a bit thick and vulnerable and are easily tricked.

As much as it hurts me to say it, maybe there is a shred of truth in this. We aren't some advanced, sophisticated society - fact. The vast majority of us are from rural backgrounds with all that entails (both positive and negative). And we do seem to be getting tricked by other quoms left right and centre. I'm not surprised if people don't consider us to be the sharpest tools in the box.

If anything, this just reinforces the need to push for a MUCH higher level of education and hopefully resultant sophistication in our quom. Not education to improve our career prospects but genuine raising of intellectual abilities throughout our society. Top to bottom.

[VanHelsingh]

If anything, this just reinforces the need to push for a MUCH higher level of education and hopefully resultant sophistication in our quom. Not education to improve our career prospects but genuine raising of intellectual abilities throughout our society. Top to bottom.

Education and self-improvement isn't even on the radar of Sikh youth. There's the hopeless cases where drink, drugs and sessions are the norm. Then there's the other side who are excellent Sikhs (visually at least) with a passion for the faith, but still no desire to educate or improve themselves intellectually. Some have this mistaken notion that by progressing in their studies it will somehow take them further away from God. What they fail to understand is that through education, they can "arm" themselves and become the instigators of change, instead of becoming bystanders who hold a grudge against their peers who got their heads down instead of making excuses to work hard.

[guptkuri]

Waheguru Ji Ka Khalsa, Waheguru Ji Ki Fateh!

As a Sikh women, I think the problem stems down to equality. Just like West London Singh Veer Ji said that if he drinks, then what can he say to his sister if she wants to drink. I think in our culture we tend to give more freedom to do things against Sikhi, instead of trying to keep both boys and girls from doing bad things.

Its like a boy can do whatever and then a girl when she complains is given a tiny bit of freedom and then she takes advantage of the freedom to do same things as her brother. It should be that both of the children are raised by the same expectations and same rules. She can't drink, neither can he. She can't cut her hair, neither can he.

Only when we get rid of inequality and educate, well we be able to stop conversion.

-guptkuri

Waheguru ji ka khalsa, waheguru ji ki fateh!

[Kalsingh]

Fella, that is a totally irrational fear. There are probably more mad axe murderers out there with sinister motives against Sikh women than there are 'muslims'. Imagine if sikh female after sikh female kept starting threads here about how some of our men need to be very very carefull because there are many many 'uncle' types out there that start off by pressurizing the sikh into having a drink......but the real sinister motive is that he wishes to have a permanent drinking partner.

Fear...has to be rational. I see threats to sikhs...and sikh women all around me....but the 'muslim youth' is the least of these threats. Have you seen the amount of sikh women and men that have become christians in canada ? Have you seen the number of Punjabi churches out there ? :o The numbers are staggering. Obviously coz we live in england where Christianity is more of a museum relic rather than a working functioning religion we don't really see or understand the threat from it but trust me fella....for our worldwide sikh diaspora....and if you really really wanna 'protect' sikh girls.....the most 'sinister' of them all are the evangelical christians.

Should the sikh women also keep starting threads here warning sikh men about middle age white female 'cougars' that prey on 'brown' men to pick up.....targetting brown men in a 'sinister' way ?

Every single time I read something somewhere about 'muslim men using tricks to lure sikh women' it makes me cringe. It makes me cringe because when the rest of the world reads it they don't think "oh my god....those evil muslims are really bad". What they think to themselves is "oh my god......sikhs must be really stupid". We just make ourselves look like vulnerable slow fools with these constant accusations. All we're telling the world is that our girls are a bit thick and vulnerable and are easily tricked.

I have so many muslim family friends and every last one of them is a wonderfully hardworking decent human being. I really detest this constant vilification of them.

Brother, you need to open your eyes. It is not a irrational fear. Yeah, its true that there are other groups who are a threat such as the extremist christians you point out, but this thread is about muslims and so I talk only about them here.

I'm not an Islam hater but many muslims (particularly pakistani muslims) are what we are depicting them as. Its reality brother and I wish it wasn't like it but it is.

Even I'm skeptical about the extent to which some sikh elements have said that muslims use 'tricks' to lure non muslim women. But the sad fact is, the majority of them favour their own and believe in imposing their beliefs on non muslims. Women, particularly sikh women are an easy target for this sort of thing.

[kds1980]

Here's a thought : how about we sikh men set the right example ?

The Sikhi that my family has brought me up with teaches me that there is complete and utter equality between the sexes in sikhi. Women can do whatever the boys do. And in my family that is true. None of us men drink or smoke. Neither do any of our women. None of us men have slept around and neither have our women. None of us men visit pubs and neither do our women.

If i or my father did any of these things how on earth could I state that my sister could not do the same ? Is she....because she is a 'she', only half a human ?

For every thread about the unsavoury and immoral things that some sikh females do there should be a hundred threads about the immoral antics of sikh men. We....are a hundred times worse.

Your post makes me laugh.There are not one but many sikh families that give complete equality to GIrls.No Drinking , partying, going out with girls

Yet Girls Just go out find a non sikh boy and marry her.Look at Manmohan singh all his daughters are very highly educated and married to non sikhs

One of my eldest cousin which was raised in 100% equal environment.her mother even did not go for 3rd child for the sake of boy.Yet when she went for a job the first thing she did was marrying a non sikh.

[dalsingh101]

Suffice to say. It is a complex phenomena which can't be addressed with simplistic understandings.

[West London Singh]

Your post makes me laugh.There are not one but many sikh families that give complete equality to GIrls.No Drinking , partying, going out with girls

Yet Girls Just go out find a non sikh boy and marry her.Look at Manmohan singh all his daughters are very highly educated and married to non sikhs

One of my eldest cousin which was raised in 100% equal environment.her mother even did not go for 3rd child for the sake of boy.Yet when she went for a job the first thing she did was marrying a non sikh.

Your post makes me laugh even more KDS1980 in that you're providing a whole list of your what some sikh females have done as if they're semi-slaves and have sneaked off and done something naughty when nobody was looking and yet you don't bat an eyelid as to what some sikh males have done with non-sikh females. Why not make a list of them too ? Is it because the list would take up at least a couple of pages on this forum ?

My point...which you found hysterical, partly because of your low comprehension skills, was that in my family sikhi is the way sikhi was intended ; complete snd utter equality. None of us men drink and go to pubs....and none of our females do either. If any of us men did drink I would wholheartedly expect my sister and mum to do likewise. I would expect them to follow our bad example.

At the moment I see men and women as equals......and if you ask any non-sikh that shows any interest in sikhism they'll tell you that this is the number one attribute of sikhism.........however, when I'm ready to look at women as a sub-species of human life and ready to keep an eye on them and compile lists as to what their up to, I'll give you a call and perhaps you could send me an application form to join your local branch of the taliban ?