Tooriya

[Akaal Purakh Di Fauj]

Wahegurujikakhalsawahegurujikifateh

What is the state of Tooriya?

Does this differ from mukhti? If so how? If not where do its origins lie?

Wahegurujikakhalsawahegurujikifateh

[Guest]

What is tooriya?

[luckysingh99]

Turiya is the chautha padh or 4th state of consciousness.

This is when one can transcend Maya completely.

It is not the same as mukhti since that is salvation.or complete freedom and immersion with Guruji.

The 4th state of consciousness comes before Mukhti

When mukhti happens then one's consciousness is merged with the supreme consciousness.

The question you ask is a good one and I don't have the full answer because sikhi is not about the mukhti described above.???

Although sikhi accepts the ancient concept of mukhti but this mukhti is AFTER you die.

Whereas sikhi instructs us about JEEVAN MUKHTI- or salvation whilst alive.

This also means to be DEAD WHILST ALIVE !!

The BIG QUESTION is what is the real difference between Jeevan mukhti and Turiya ???

I have come to conclude and accept that there is a very thin line between both.

Once you have reached Turiya or the 4th state, then you have completely detached yourself from MAYA. This means you don't see your mother as your mother, your don't see your father any different, You don't see your enemy any different to your son/daughter..etc.. YOU SEE and ACCEPT ALL as ONE.

NO MAYA means NO DUALITY.

IS this the ULTIMATE ????

NO, I don't think so. Because you are still you, you still have the little ego that defines you, your name, status..etc..

The Only thing left after complete detachment from maya is to SUBMIT yourself COMPLETELY to his HUKAM.

This means No worrying about what or how you are to live your future days, you submit all your MIND,BODY and SOUL.

to HIS HUKAM or Divine will.

Makes you realise how hard it really is to submit your Head to Guruji during amrit, do we all stay and continue as if we have permanently submitted our heads ????

Is our head really, always still in his hands or was it just during amrit sanchar ??

Not easy to answer is it because this is what differentiates a gursikh from a gurmukh.

[Guest]

My god this post was brilliant....Thank you for explaining!!!

What other stages are there?

[sat]

Turiya is the chautha padh or 4th state of consciousness.

This is when one can transcend Maya completely.

It is not the same as mukhti since that is salvation.or complete freedom and immersion with Guruji.

The 4th state of consciousness comes before Mukhti

When mukhti happens then one's consciousness is merged with the supreme consciousness.

The question you ask is a good one and I don't have the full answer because sikhi is not about the mukhti described above.???

Although sikhi accepts the ancient concept of mukhti but this mukhti is AFTER you die.

Whereas sikhi instructs us about JEEVAN MUKHTI- or salvation whilst alive.

This also means to be DEAD WHILST ALIVE !!

The BIG QUESTION is what is the real difference between Jeevan mukhti and Turiya ???

I have come to conclude and accept that there is a very thin line between both.

Once you have reached Turiya or the 4th state, then you have completely detached yourself from MAYA. This means you don't see your mother as your mother, your don't see your father any different, You don't see your enemy any different to your son/daughter..etc.. YOU SEE and ACCEPT ALL as ONE.

NO MAYA means NO DUALITY.

IS this the ULTIMATE ????

NO, I don't think so. Because you are still you, you still have the little ego that defines you, your name, status..etc..

The Only thing left after complete detachment from maya is to SUBMIT yourself COMPLETELY to his HUKAM.

This means No worrying about what or how you are to live your future days, you submit all your MIND,BODY and SOUL.

to HIS HUKAM or Divine will.

Makes you realise how hard it really is to submit your Head to Guruji during amrit, do we all stay and continue as if we have permanently submitted our heads ????

Is our head really, always still in his hands or was it just during amrit sanchar ??

Not easy to answer is it because this is what differentiates a gursikh from a gurmukh.

Is that not the same as Karam khand, the abode/state before one reaches Sach Khand ?

[SunSingh]

turiya avastha is bhramgian/chautha padd/sahaj avastha

[luckysingh99]

Is that not the same as Karam khand, the abode/state before one reaches Sach Khand ?

It is the same in that once one is in karam kand/sach khand they are also jeevan mukht and in turiya avastha.

However, these terms are not interchangeable as such but they overlap until eventually there is one state.

I may be wrong, but I studied all this a while back and it was quite difficult to get your head around it. There are lots of refences out there but most drift away from gurmat and get you confused. Gurbani mentions all of these in different areas, so if you look at them carefully without interchanging, then you begin to get the idea.

The khand realms are stages attained from bhaghti- in simple words. When one gets to karam khand wich is before sach khand, then one is filled with divine grace.

The person is also ner completely self-realised.

Remember that this stage is attained by devotion and bhagti compared to realising and detaching from maya as in turiya avastha.

They do overlap very much, but all of us start and approach from different angles.

This is why the old yogis would go and hide away in caves away from the world, because their approach was to get out of the maya illusion as much as possible as a starting point.

A gursikh is to live in the world ocean of maya but rise above it like a water bubble to get across.- However, still remaining attached to the rest of the ocean.

Personally, I find that each approach helps the other.Such that devotion and bhagti will automatically help you begin untie yourself from maya. But you can also do this by conquering the 3 worlds of maya and then rising to the 4th state. or turiya avastha.

[gurdeepsinghjohal]

Saram khand and karam khand are combine together in a sense that you do the saram, he will bless you with his karam

and this can be also called tooriya you rise above maya.

Need to research and discuss more on this topic.

[GPS]

Gurbani says chautha pad is last stage.

ਚਉਥੇ ਸੁੰਨੈ ਜੋ ਨਰੁ ਜਾਣੈ ਤਾ ਕਉ ਪਾਪੁ ਨ ਪੁੰਨੰ ॥

चउथे सुंनै जो नरु जाणै ता कउ पापु न पुंनं ॥

Cẖa▫uthe sunnai jo nar jāṇai ṯā ka▫o pāp na puʼnnaʼn.

One who knows the Lord in the fourth state, is not subject to virtue or vice.

ਘਟਿ ਘਟਿ ਸੁੰਨ ਕਾ ਜਾਣੈ ਭੇਉ ॥

घटि घटि सुंन का जाणै भेउ ॥

Gẖat gẖat sunn kā jāṇai bẖe▫o.

One who knows the mystery of God the Absolute, who pervades each and every heart,

ਆਦਿ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਨਿਰੰਜਨ ਦੇਉ ॥

आदि पुरखु निरंजन देउ ॥

Āḏ purakẖ niranjan ḏe▫o.

knows the Primal Being, the Immaculate Divine Lord.

ਜੋ ਜਨੁ ਨਾਮ ਨਿਰੰਜਨ ਰਾਤਾ ॥

जो जनु नाम निरंजन राता ॥

Jo jan nām niranjan rāṯā.

That humble being who is imbued with the Immaculate Naam,

ਨਾਨਕ ਸੋਈ ਪੁਰਖੁ ਬਿਧਾਤਾ ॥੫੧॥

नानक सोई पुरखु बिधाता ॥५१॥

Nānak so▫ī purakẖ biḏẖāṯā. ||51||

O Nanak, is himself the Primal Lord, the Architect of Destiny. ||51||

[luckysingh99]

Saram khand and karam khand are combine together in a sense that you do the saram, he will bless you with his karam

and this can be also called tooriya you rise above maya.

Need to research and discuss more on this topic.

I think that Saram Khand is before Karam khand.

From what I gather , Saram khand = with spiritual efforts

Karam khad= his grace

In order we have, - Dharam khand = realm of Moral duty

Gian khand = realm of spiritual knowledge

Saram khand = realm of spiritual effort

Karam Khand = realm of divine grace

Sach khand = realm of Truth

the stages between saram, karam and sach khand are very close together compared to the first two which are Dharam and Gian khand