Bhai Joga Singh (Uk) Slams Badal Dal's Manjit Singh Gk For Their Parties Anti Sikh Policies

[singhbj singh]

Bhai Joga Singh (UK) slams Badal Dal's Manjit Singh GK for their parties anti Sikh policies

[BoleSoNihal]

Bhai Manjit Singh made some interesting points, notably choosing to be Hindustani rather than Khalistani and standing firmly by the Akali Dal alliance with BJP. The explanations for his and the Akali Dal position were not convincing. Bhai Manjit Singh's comments were seen as an anathema and we could feel the anger of the audience.

I looked at the current 'Constitution of Shiromani Akali Dal' (English version) and in 12 pages, found the word 'Sikh' only once. The word 'Guru' was not mentioned. The words 'Akali Dal' were mentioned 70 times! You can view the document here http://eci.nic.in/eci_main/mis-Political_Parties/Constitution_of_Political_Parties%5CConstitution_of_SAD.pdf

Looking back at the Anandpur Resolution (which the Akalis first introduced) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anandpur_Resolution. The word 'Sikh' is mentioned 20 times in a single section called 'Purpose' and the words 'Akali Dal' mentioned only twice (strange how things turn around...). Please read.

On behalf of the Sikh Sangat, who has given the Akali's a mandate on their current policy decisions? I believe the Sikh Panth does not trust the current leadership and do not think they are representing Sikhs or Sikh views and concerns very well. We all know politics in India is corrupt and a sham.

Badal has been Chief Minister of Punjab for a staggering 5 times. He is generally regarded as the second most powerful Sikh leader worldwide, after India's prime minister, Manmohan Singh. But, what are his grand list of achievements for Sikh's? What will he be remembered for? As a man that has done little for Sikhs.

Badal has been reluctant to help the Sikh's because he does not want his family (and those that surround him) to lose power. Is he really scared of those still in jail like Bhai Rajoana? who would become the real Sikh leader if allowed...

Unfortunately, Badal Dal (as they are now known) also knows that for Sikh's, the 'Congress' party are NOT an option. No point in even discussing those murderers. So, we have BJP and Congress, playing Sikh against Sikh. Puppet masters playing the foolish puppets against each other.

The Sikh Panth needs to awake, which is why Badal Dal, BJP and Congress have allowed the Sikh youth to remain in their drug infested states. Badals focus has now turned to the UK, first the start of Akaal TV and now the DSGPC visit. They will never allow the strong independant Sikh voice of the Sikh Channel to establish itself in Punjab (Please support the Sikh Channel).

The 'Khalistan agenda' is very straight forward and needs little articulation. In basic terms, Sikhs are fighting for their homeland and for their survival. Sikhs are fed up of being attacked, both overtly and covertly. Why are Sikh's so passionate about Khalistan? Maybe it's because time and time again Sikh's have been tricked, lied to, victimised, attacked and murdered by others, including those within the Indian Government and then denied justice. Who is willing to help or defend the Sikh's? How will Sikh genocide be stopped? Certainly not with cowardly hindus that attack only with organised support and large numbers.

Whatever our views, it now seems clear from Bhai Manjit Singh's interview that the Akali's do NOT support Khalistan and Sikhs need to support Dal Khalsa.

Sikh's in the UK are viewed as nationalists and Bhai Manjit Singhs visit has been reported (as a Badal Dal mission) to contain Sikh nationalist activity. The delegation was reportedly accompanied by two Chandigarh based journalists. http://www.sikhsiyasat.net/2013/09/20/manjit-singh-gks-encounter-with-sikh-diaspora-in-uk-and-indian-states-efforts-to-contain-sikh-nationalist-activity/

"Badal Dal is playing a pro-active role in containing the activities of Sikh nationalist groups and keeping the Sikh nationalist leaders behind the bars."

For those who fell for Bhai Manjit Singh's comments... Sant Sipahi may not be for you or other Massands...

Putting aside politics, as individuals we all should focus on Dhan Dhan Sri Guru Granth Sahib Ji and make the journey from Manmukhs to Gursikhs/ Gurmukhs.

[Sikhistan]

Before sant ji left this world in 1984, he clearly gave a thrashing anti-sikh account of akali dal and its leaders. Listen to his audio and you will be amazed that same rubbish anti-sikh politics happening in akali that were going on 30 years ago.

[gurnam5]

I think BolesoNihal makes some important points and Bhai Joga Singh's performance was commendable. As I have noted elsewhere, whatever you feel about Manjit Singh GK's own political views you have to give him credit for facing so much hostility with an open commitment to dialogue. He also said that whatever our political differences we should all come together as Sikhs when it came to Panthic Issues, and to their credit the Sikh Council UK agreed on this point.

So, given Manjit Singh GK's rejection of a sepperatist stand point, the real question is to what extent is the Khalistan agenda a 'Panthic Issue'? I would like to offer some thoughts on this. You may think this sounds like a rather silly question given that Sikhs in most Western countries have for the past 30 years been regularly demonstrating against the Indian Government and campaigning for the creation of Khalistan. Surely, one may think, after 30 years of campaigning we all know what Khalistan represents? However, if you look at the situation more closely, in the rather empty rhetoric of the pro Khalistan groups and in particular the actual strength of support they command, I think a different picture emerges. Let us assume that there are 50,000 devout Khalistanis in the UK and a similar number in the US, Canada and the rest of Europe. This gives us a total of 200,000 supporters of Khalistan. Now let us start looking at the picture in India. In Delhi alone there are over 1 million Sikhs and in India as a whole some 22 million. We all know that the demand for Khalistan in India is minimal. We know that because election after election Sardar Simranjeet Singh Maan on a Khalistan platform has done abysmally. I accept that the low support is partly due to media blackouts, but in todays world we have social media which has sparked off revolutions in some of the poorest countries in the world, but apparently not in India; we must ask why?

So the question isn't whether or not Khalistan is a good or bad idea, but that very few people have any interest in the idea. This would suggest that the advocates of Khalistan have failed to explain what they are demanding other than a hollow slogan and hatred for 'the Indian Government'. Manjit Singh's objections to Khalistan as a separatist demand were very clear. What about millions of Sikhs outside of Panjab? what about the immense sacrifice that Sikhs have and continue to make for India? And most of all in a world that is rapidly globalising and the vulnerability of minor currencies (See for example the Scottish Nationalists backtracking from replacing the pound with a separate currency) what chance can an independent Panjabi/Khalistan in such a turbulent economic climate.

You see, where you are a Manjit Singh supporter or not, you must accept that he did present some reasonable arguments and he was open to others, Khalistanis or not to make their case in a democratic and reasoned way. And it is to Bhai Joga Singh's credit that his contribution on the programme was both passionate, evidence based and reasonable. Indeed, I think it is one of the best ever expositions of the gross mistreatment of Sikhs in India. But the prblem is that there is no logical connection with arguing for justice and human rights and demanding Khalistan. They ares separate issues. The issue of human rights knows no borders and even if Khalistan was ever created would still exists. I think one will need to be pretty naive to thing that Khalistan will be some heavenly place where everybody and especially Sikhs is treated with respect. Perhaps we should contrast the dreams and aspiration that Muhammed Ali Jinnah had for the new and Independent Islamic State of Pakistan and the current pathetic disunited blood stained entity. What makes one so sure that Khalistan will not end up like that? Whether one likes it or not Sikhs too have their equivalent of Sunni and Shia. ALso, if one looks at the demographics of Panjab, then unless Khalistan will be a fascist state, how can you argue for a Sikh state where nearly 50% of the people are NOT Sikhs?

I know what some might be thinking, Khalistan will be a democratic state. That would be a good thing, but what then is the difference between Khalistan and the current Panjab and India; they to are notionally democratic states. Perhaps the counter argument is that Khalistan will be a truly democratic state. Well given the deficit of democratic principled amongst our own 'Panthic Jathebandhis' and the terrible mess we see in the Gurdwara elections, I am unsure we Sikhs really know what democracy is. How can one have any confidence in Khalistan when even the main jathebandhis that support Khalistan do not see eye to eye and in some cases have hatred for each other. And so, faced with the prospect of a Khalistan that could end up as another Pakistan, Palestine, Afghanistan or Iraq, then one can understand why most Sikhs in India would be very sceptical of such an idea. It is much easier for us in the west to make these demands; after all we will not have to live there! Given this scenario and given our demographic weakness, then I personably think that Manjit SIngh GK position is much more appealing, which summarised is as follows:

• Let us recognise our political differences, but let us also work together to defend Sikhs everywhere in the world on common issues, such as the daystar, release of political prisoners, justice for families of state sponsored terror etc.
• Let us fight for autonomy for Panjab and other states within a federal India along the lines of the US, Russian Federation or the EU perhaps.
• Let us fight those that project the Sikhs as anti-nationalists, separatists and terrorists and let us remind the rest of India and the world what brave sacrificed Sikhs have given to fight such forces from the times of the Mughal onwards.
• Let us exploit great opportunity to make their demands of human and civil rights in India through the very powerful DGPC which does give us access to 150 embassies in Delhi and Indian Government departments.
• Let us focus on education for that is the ONLY way we can save Sikhi.
• Let us provide support for the millions of Vanjara and Sikhighar Sikhs spread throughout india. They are our future.
• Let us connect and coordinate Sikh organisations across the globe so that we can use our collective power.
• Let us work with other political parties where it suits our electoral aims - politics is about power and there is very little you can do if you are not in power.

So, for the first time in 30 years we have somebody in Manjit Singh GK who has courage, vision, determination, intellect and political knowhow and all we can do is condemn him. This is really sad and just further confirmation of the bankruptcy of ideas amongst the present generation of Khalistan advocates. We will not create Khalistan by simply believing in our own propaganda. So the choice is simple: we can spend the next 30 years spouting off hollow slogans for Khalistan and insults to what is a amorphous entity called the Union States of India or we can begin to make a coherent case for Khalistan in which the non-Sikh population of Panjab does not feel threatened. However, whatever our feelings about Khalistan, the reality is that unless we as Sikhs act together we stand no chance what so ever. And therefore I urge everybody to take this opportunity, grab the olive branch and let us adopt a practical co-operative, collective approach that Manjit Singh GK has drawn our attention to.

This does not prevent us from pursuing democratically the demand for Khalistan and all the other things that Bhai Joga Singh in his contribution alluded to. Manjit Singh was correct to recall that Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindrawale never openly demanded Khalistan and that he was politically manipulated by the Congress, just as Sarna is trying to do today. What Jarnail Singh Bhindrawale did say was that if Khalistan was offered he would not make the mistake that our leaders made in 1947. But we all know Khalistan will not ever be offered to us! The other statement of support for Khalistan that is attributed to Baba Jarnail Singh ji is the a short time before the June 1984 attack when he said that "if the army attacks the Harimandar then the foundation stone of Khalistan would be laid". One can interpret this statement in many different ways, but most crucially, one needs to take into account the context. The Sikhs were demanding the Anandpur Resolution and the Government was dragging its heels. The morchas were in full and there was talk of some kind of strategic assualt on the Harimander. In this context, one might interpret his statement as a political or even negating ploy, a simply a deterrent on the basis that he did not thing the government would move. More controversially one could argue that the other than a few bullets Harminader, remained in tact although the Akal takht as we know was completely destroyer.

Last, it would be great if we could have an open, honest and civil debate about the future prospects of Sikhs in India and the relevance of Khalistan, but my worry is that the current crop of leaders neither have the capability or knowledge to mount a sustained and coherent argument that could convince not their own supporters, but the neutrals who really count.

Finally, please forgive me if I have hurt anybodies feelings or said something objectionably. I speak with immense love for the Panth and total respect for the Shaheeds who have and are laying down their lives to fight tyranny and state terror.

Dr Gurnam Singh (Please note I speak in a personal capacity and not for the Sikh Channel which, as noted by BoleSoniha is independent of all political parties and only interested in the truth)

[BoleSoNihal]

Dr Gurnam Singh, you have made some good points. (even if I disagree with most)

If Sikhs awake and begin to carry out even half of what you have (very nicely) stated, then Badal Dal will be no more. However, I feel if Manjit Singh does have good intentions he will soon be removed.

Others may dissect your comments in a less forgiving way... The "I'd rather be a hindustani than khalistani" point hurt... So which part of "hindu" or "hindustani" is Manjit Singh?

"The non-Muslim people of the South Asian subcontinent called Hindu had no precise word for their religions. They were, as they are, divided into thousands of communities and tribes, each having its own religious beliefs, rituals, modes of worship, etc. In ancient India you had either a yogi, a bhakta, a tantric, a sanyasi, a sankhya vadin, a vedantin, a lokayata, a rishi, a muni, a pandit, a pragna, a yogini, a devi, a swami, a Saivite, a Vaishnavite, a siddha or Buddha, but no Hindu."

Remember he also visited with a distinct agenda (against Khalistani nationalists) which is not what he openly declared or allowed people to prepare for at the outset.

Perhaps Manjit Singh does not have the intellect you give him credit for.

[singh_comradz]

I think BolesoNihal makes some important points and Bhai Joga Singh's performance was commendable. As I have noted elsewhere, whatever you feel about Manjit Singh GK's own political views you have to give him credit for facing so much hostility with an open commitment to dialogue. He also said that whatever our political differences we should all come together as Sikhs when it came to Panthic Issues, and to their credit the Sikh Council UK agreed on this point.

So, given Manjit Singh GK's rejection of a sepperatist stand point, the real question is to what extent is the Khalistan agenda a 'Panthic Issue'? I would like to offer some thoughts on this. You may think this sounds like a rather silly question given that Sikhs in most Western countries have for the past 30 years been regularly demonstrating against the Indian Government and campaigning for the creation of Khalistan. Surely, one may think, after 30 years of campaigning we all know what Khalistan represents? However, if you look at the situation more closely, in the rather empty rhetoric of the pro Khalistan groups and in particular the actual strength of support they command, I think a different picture emerges. Let us assume that there are 50,000 devout Khalistanis in the UK and a similar number in the US, Canada and the rest of Europe. This gives us a total of 200,000 supporters of Khalistan. Now let us start looking at the picture in India. In Delhi alone there are over 1 million Sikhs and in India as a whole some 22 million. We all know that the demand for Khalistan in India is minimal. We know that because election after election Sardar Simranjeet Singh Maan on a Khalistan platform has done abysmally. I accept that the low support is partly due to media blackouts, but in todays world we have social media which has sparked off revolutions in some of the poorest countries in the world, but apparently not in India; we must ask why?

So the question isn't whether or not Khalistan is a good or bad idea, but that very few people have any interest in the idea. This would suggest that the advocates of Khalistan have failed to explain what they are demanding other than a hollow slogan and hatred for 'the Indian Government'. Manjit Singh's objections to Khalistan as a separatist demand were very clear. What about millions of Sikhs outside of Panjab? what about the immense sacrifice that Sikhs have and continue to make for India? And most of all in a world that is rapidly globalising and the vulnerability of minor currencies (See for example the Scottish Nationalists backtracking from replacing the pound with a separate currency) what chance can an independent Panjabi/Khalistan in such a turbulent economic climate.

You see, where you are a Manjit Singh supporter or not, you must accept that he did present some reasonable arguments and he was open to others, Khalistanis or not to make their case in a democratic and reasoned way. And it is to Bhai Joga Singh's credit that his contribution on the programme was both passionate, evidence based and reasonable. Indeed, I think it is one of the best ever expositions of the gross mistreatment of Sikhs in India. But the prblem is that there is no logical connection with arguing for justice and human rights and demanding Khalistan. They ares separate issues. The issue of human rights knows no borders and even if Khalistan was ever created would still exists. I think one will need to be pretty naive to thing that Khalistan will be some heavenly place where everybody and especially Sikhs is treated with respect. Perhaps we should contrast the dreams and aspiration that Muhammed Ali Jinnah had for the new and Independent Islamic State of Pakistan and the current pathetic disunited blood stained entity. What makes one so sure that Khalistan will not end up like that? Whether one likes it or not Sikhs too have their equivalent of Sunni and Shia. ALso, if one looks at the demographics of Panjab, then unless Khalistan will be a fascist state, how can you argue for a Sikh state where nearly 50% of the people are NOT Sikhs?

I know what some might be thinking, Khalistan will be a democratic state. That would be a good thing, but what then is the difference between Khalistan and the current Panjab and India; they to are notionally democratic states. Perhaps the counter argument is that Khalistan will be a truly democratic state. Well given the deficit of democratic principled amongst our own 'Panthic Jathebandhis' and the terrible mess we see in the Gurdwara elections, I am unsure we Sikhs really know what democracy is. How can one have any confidence in Khalistan when even the main jathebandhis that support Khalistan do not see eye to eye and in some cases have hatred for each other. And so, faced with the prospect of a Khalistan that could end up as another Pakistan, Palestine, Afghanistan or Iraq, then one can understand why most Sikhs in India would be very sceptical of such an idea. It is much easier for us in the west to make these demands; after all we will not have to live there! Given this scenario and given our demographic weakness, then I personably think that Manjit SIngh GK position is much more appealing, which summarised is as follows:

• Let us recognise our political differences, but let us also work together to defend Sikhs everywhere in the world on common issues, such as the daystar, release of political prisoners, justice for families of state sponsored terror etc.
• Let us fight for autonomy for Panjab and other states within a federal India along the lines of the US, Russian Federation or the EU perhaps.
• Let us fight those that project the Sikhs as anti-nationalists, separatists and terrorists and let us remind the rest of India and the world what brave sacrificed Sikhs have given to fight such forces from the times of the Mughal onwards.
• Let us exploit great opportunity to make their demands of human and civil rights in India through the very powerful DGPC which does give us access to 150 embassies in Delhi and Indian Government departments.
• Let us focus on education for that is the ONLY way we can save Sikhi.
• Let us provide support for the millions of Vanjara and Sikhighar Sikhs spread throughout india. They are our future.
• Let us connect and coordinate Sikh organisations across the globe so that we can use our collective power.
• Let us work with other political parties where it suits our electoral aims - politics is about power and there is very little you can do if you are not in power.

So, for the first time in 30 years we have somebody in Manjit Singh GK who has courage, vision, determination, intellect and political knowhow and all we can do is condemn him. This is really sad and just further confirmation of the bankruptcy of ideas amongst the present generation of Khalistan advocates. We will not create Khalistan by simply believing in our own propaganda. So the choice is simple: we can spend the next 30 years spouting off hollow slogans for Khalistan and insults to what is a amorphous entity called the Union States of India or we can begin to make a coherent case for Khalistan in which the non-Sikh population of Panjab does not feel threatened. However, whatever our feelings about Khalistan, the reality is that unless we as Sikhs act together we stand no chance what so ever. And therefore I urge everybody to take this opportunity, grab the olive branch and let us adopt a practical co-operative, collective approach that Manjit Singh GK has drawn our attention to.

This does not prevent us from pursuing democratically the demand for Khalistan and all the other things that Bhai Joga Singh in his contribution alluded to. Manjit Singh was correct to recall that Baba Jarnail Singh Bhindrawale never openly demanded Khalistan and that he was politically manipulated by the Congress, just as Sarna is trying to do today. What Jarnail Singh Bhindrawale did say was that if Khalistan was offered he would not make the mistake that our leaders made in 1947. But we all know Khalistan will not ever be offered to us! The other statement of support for Khalistan that is attributed to Baba Jarnail Singh ji is the a short time before the June 1984 attack when he said that "if the army attacks the Harimandar then the foundation stone of Khalistan would be laid". One can interpret this statement in many different ways, but most crucially, one needs to take into account the context. The Sikhs were demanding the Anandpur Resolution and the Government was dragging its heels. The morchas were in full and there was talk of some kind of strategic assualt on the Harimander. In this context, one might interpret his statement as a political or even negating ploy, a simply a deterrent on the basis that he did not thing the government would move. More controversially one could argue that the other than a few bullets Harminader, remained in tact although the Akal takht as we know was completely destroyer.

Last, it would be great if we could have an open, honest and civil debate about the future prospects of Sikhs in India and the relevance of Khalistan, but my worry is that the current crop of leaders neither have the capability or knowledge to mount a sustained and coherent argument that could convince not their own supporters, but the neutrals who really count.

Finally, please forgive me if I have hurt anybodies feelings or said something objectionably. I speak with immense love for the Panth and total respect for the Shaheeds who have and are laying down their lives to fight tyranny and state terror.

Dr Gurnam Singh (Please note I speak in a personal capacity and not for the Sikh Channel which, as noted by BoleSoniha is independent of all political parties and only interested in the truth)

Dr Gurnam Singh, I don't agree with some of your comments for the following reasons. What Sant Jarnail Singh Jee said in reference to the 'foundation stone of Khalistan' was not empty words or scare tactics, but rather a bachan from a Maharapurkh, who saw the wider picture of what was being played out.

This bachan was emphasised by the thousands of singhs and singhniya who have sacrificed their lives for this cause. In 1986 the Sarbat Khalsa set Khalistan as the goal of the Sikh nation.

There is no going back and the only way to safeguard our rights is through self rule. This should have been embedded into our thought process especially through the cultural genocide and human rights abuses we have suffered post 1984. Whether we wish to accept it or not, our quam is in a fight for survival in India.

Unfortunately there are some who still think we can 'make a go of it' in Hindustan and Manjit Singhs comments rub salt in the wounds.

No one can predict Khalistans' borders, just like the misl's who fought for their survival could not foresee Ranjit Singh's raaj.

But Guru Sahib and their mahapurakhs have assured us that one day the Khalsa will have Raaj and this day is not far.

In the meanwhile we should strengthen our jeevans and work for the benefit of the panth.

Personally I don't think that Manjit Singh is sincere in his thoughts for the following reasons. Sukhbir Singh was denied entry into Canada which was followed by the arrests of dozens of youths in Punjab on fabricated charges. Then Manjit Singh is sent as part of an Indian delegation to woo Khalistani's in the UK.

Manjit Singh is a spokesman of Badal and is playing politics by asking Sikhs to stand with the SAD-BJP alliance. Manjit Singh, knowing the sentiments of Sikhs has portrayed himself as a proud Hindustani and has sought to downplay Sant Jee's character and vision by saying that he was manipulated by Congress.

As Sikhs, we should not fall prey to petty politics that have been played out since 1947 and should rise above it.

Furthermore veer jee, in a separate comment linked to this topic, you said that Sikhs involve themselves in 'ritualistic meditation' and 'fancy dress.'

The sole command of Guru Granth Sahib Jee is 'jap' and nothing can be achieved without meditation or kamaii, great Gursikhs of the past bear testament to that. There is nothing 'ritualistic' about reading bani or doing simran.

The bana which I think you're referring to is the uniform of the Khalsa given by Guru Gobind Singh Jee and should not be referred to as 'fancy dress.'

Without sharda in Guru Sahib we will never get anywhere.

Bhul chuk maaf

[chatanga]

I think BolesoNihal makes some important points and Bhai Joga Singh's performance was commendable. As I have noted elsewhere, whatever you feel about Manjit Singh GK's own political views you have to give him credit for facing so much hostility with an open commitment to dialogue. He also said that whatever our political differences we should all come together as Sikhs when it came to Panthic Issues, and to their credit the Sikh Council UK agreed on this point....

)

Dr Gurnam Singh, I didint want to quote your whole post, although it is interesting and there are parts that many will agree/disagree with.

We, the Sikh Nation are caught between a rock and a hard place at the moment I feel. Some people see Khalistan as the solution to all our problems, whereas i feel it will solve some, and most likely create others( ie the pakistani syndrome).

The alternative to our own raaj, is to live in india, and we all know what a disaster that has been since 1947.But there are little positive signs coming from the state to make us think that we are safe there. I can only hope that if we do get our own raaj we do a better job with non-sikh minorities there.

Panjab sikhs at the moment are going through an economic drive. Their focus is mainly on getting out of india to the west, earn some money etc, we all know, Very few, apart from those personally injured by the indian state, are interested in Sikh nationalism beyond slogans, anbd the odd ekath here and there.

[AJ111]

It was very refreshing to hear Sardar Manjit Singh – as it is not a viewpoint anyone outside India has the guts to express. We must separate “Sikh” interests from “Khalistani” interests. The 2 are opposed to each other.

Remember how Sikhs lived with arrogant pride, respect and relative prosperity before 84. All this was destroyed by the Khalistani movement . Let me highlight some of the points of the Khalistani episode that we brush under the carpet (or counter unconvincingly with conspiracy theories)

Hijacking buses – separating the passengers to kill non-Sikhs

Making the Harmindar Sahib a base camp for terror activities

Cutting holes in the marble to make machine gun placements.

Knowing full well that even an inept government will have to act to assert its authority and innocents will get killed............then assassinating the popular prime minister.

What did you think would result ? Was it any surprise that thousands of innocent Sikhs that never supported Khalistan got killed as collateral damage for the Khalistani cause.

The Khalistan agenda was thus achieved to the point where they managed to get great sympathy for the cause but could not actually deliver Khalistan. The government rightly gets the blame for the pogrom but who do you think is equally guilty ?

As respected Dr. Gurnam has said the idea of Khalistan is not practical or achievable. Therefore the only other option is making India work to its original secular ideals. That is the only way for Sikhs to flourish in ANY part of India

[BoleSoNihal]

It was very refreshing to hear Sardar Manjit Singh – as it is not a viewpoint anyone outside India has the guts to express. We must separate “Sikh” interests from “Khalistani” interests. The 2 are opposed to each other.

Remember how Sikhs lived with arrogant pride, respect and relative prosperity before 84. All this was destroyed by the Khalistani movement . Let me highlight some of the points of the Khalistani episode that we brush under the carpet (or counter unconvincingly with conspiracy theories)

Hijacking buses – separating the passengers to kill non-Sikhs

Making the Harmindar Sahib a base camp for terror activities

Cutting holes in the marble to make machine gun placements.

Knowing full well that even an inept government will have to act to assert its authority and innocents will get killed............then assassinating the popular prime minister.

What did you think would result ? Was it any surprise that thousands of innocent Sikhs that never supported Khalistan got killed as collateral damage for the Khalistani cause.

The Khalistan agenda was thus achieved to the point where they managed to get great sympathy for the cause but could not actually deliver Khalistan. The government rightly gets the blame for the pogrom but who do you think is equally guilty ?

As respected Dr. Gurnam has said the idea of Khalistan is not practical or achievable. Therefore the only other option is making India work to its original secular ideals. That is the only way for Sikhs to flourish in ANY part of India

AJ111 which hindu faction are you from?

Who's "we"?

Which part of "Raj Karega Khalsa" do you not understand?

"Remember how Sikhs lived with arrogant pride"... really?

"As respected Dr. Gurnam has said the idea of Khalistan is not practical or achievable." Where did he say this?

[Sikhistan]

Aj111,

Do you believe that Sikhs suffered any type of discrimination under Indian government? Were you or your group/family ever been a victim?

Movement derailed after 90's by our own men. Once started by our most respected religious leader and now in hands of phobia type freeloader leaders.