Shootout Outside Us Gurdwara

[kharkusingh1996]

Shootout outside US gurdwara

Sacramento, California: At least one shot was fired during the annual Baisakhi Parade near a gurdwara at 176 E Pole Road in Lynden on Saturday.

The police arrested a Whatcom County man after a fight broke out and at least one shot was fired outside the gurdwara. Witnesses reported that several men started fighting in front of the Guru Nanak Gursikh Gurdwara. Balwinder Singh Nagra (41) from the Bellingham area allegedly grabbed a gun from his vehicle and shot at several men.

Nagra was arrested and lodged in Whatcom County Jail on the suspicion of drive by shooting and unlawful possession of a firearm. Under the state law, the term “drive-by shooting” includes shootings from the immediate area of a vehicle used to transport the suspect, the weapon or both. There were no known injuries, but the other men involved in the fight left the area.

A bullet went through both the passenger and driver’s side windows of a parked white Toyota Camry in a field, about 150 yards from the event, before striking another parked car. More than 1,000 visitors gathered at the gurdwara for the parade.

Source: The Tribune

http://sikhsangat.org/2014/shootout-outside-us-gurdwara/

Anyone in California sangat know what was the reason behind this shooting? (Better not be gurdwara politics :stupidme: )

[sikhiseeker]

WJKK WJKF

How disgusting, I hope this <banned word filter activated> goes to jail, his beadbi is so wrong on so many levels!

I wonder what Shiri Guru Gobind Singhs punishment would of been to this American gangster wannabe?

WJKK WJKF

[West London Singh]

Even when clever, articulate, stable and worldly people have access to guns it is a dangerous thing.

Americans having open access to guns then, is a disaster waiting to happen.

[ms514]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI JI FATEH

"Americans having open access to guns then, is a disaster waiting to happen." - ???

So...let's disarm the public instead, whose means of self defense against well armed criminals would be using mean words or perhaps rocks? Note that the U.S. Supreme Court has (stupidly) ruled that the police is under no obligation to serve or protect the public (Google it please). Even if it did, the response time for police is in minutes where a perpetrator making the decision to kill you (or you to save yourself if armed) is in seconds. The reason Americans were actually given access to guns was to yes, defend their family and home, but not only from criminals but also corrupt, oppressive governments that come to power. We Americans have been armed for centuries and have managed to not kill each other to extinction, nor will we.

There is the example of Switzerland - all males have fully automatic weapons, training through national militia service and is one of the safest countries in the world. Dangerous is when a person who is armed is either mentally unstable and is not fit to bear arms due to the potential to inflict bodily harm (rectified by an appropriate background check at least to alleviate them from obtaining weapons legally) or being disarmed so they can be victimized by those who are armed. An armed public with basic training is a pretty good deterrent to invasion by foreign forces as well (short of nuclear holocaust, but then nothing really would be left to defend at that point...).

1984 November in Delhi would have been much different had the Sikhs been armed and fought back. Shastar Naam Malaa and Guru Sahib's Hukam instructs to keep arms for a Sikh - no weaponry was taboo (and there are Sikh Americans like me, armed both by religion and by country law). In fact, the more troubling nonsense working through the U.S. right now is the limiting of arms access and dumb laws like magazine size limitations and automatic weapon bans (because as you know, criminals follow the law all the time...) without any justification within the U.S. Constitution to support these limitations. Using Columbine, Newtown, Aurora shootings as emotional leverage against gun ownership is a dis-service to the public. It will never prevent a criminal from obtaining a gun ( see http://gizmodo.com/5928889/buying-a-ton-of-guns-on-the-internet-is-cheap-legal-and-shockingly-easy) and will only disarm and constrain the law abiding public from the only feasible defense available to them: their own ability to defend themselves.

One can even make the case that this person who perpetuated the crime would have hesitated in his actions had he known the other party was equally armed and capable of defending himself/herself/themselves.

So TL;DR: I disagree with your assertion.

[West London Singh]

We Americans have been armed for centuries and have managed to not kill each other to extinction, nor will we.

You Americans have 3rd world levels of gun crime / murders. No other first world country comes even close to having even a small proportion of that amount of murders with guns.

If thats a gun success story to you than we obviously have different notions as to the inpterpretation of good and bad.

[ms514]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/1000-knife-crime-victims-in-london-each-month-shocking-new-figures-show-8681511.html

http://www.examiner.com/article/knives-replace-handguns-uk-as-weapon-of-choice

And you UK lot have a stabbing problem - does that mean that knives should be outlawed in the UK? Seems like its not the weapon, its the person's motivation to inflict bodily harm.

[BhaiSukhSingh]

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/1000-knife-crime-victims-in-london-each-month-shocking-new-figures-show-8681511.html

http://www.examiner.com/article/knives-replace-handguns-uk-as-weapon-of-choice

And you UK lot have a stabbing problem - does that mean that knives should be outlawed in the UK? Seems like its not the weapon, its the person's motivation to inflict bodily harm.

You cannot make that comparison.

If you take all the murders in the uk and compare it to the usa gun crime deaths, the usa outweighs them.

Its the ready availability of the weapon. A knife can kill maybe 1 or 2 people.

An M16 can kill 100s.

VAHEGURU JI KA KHALSA, VAHEGURU JI KI FATEH

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/1000-knife-crime-victims-in-london-each-month-shocking-new-figures-show-8681511.html

http://www.examiner.com/article/knives-replace-handguns-uk-as-weapon-of-choice

And you UK lot have a stabbing problem - does that mean that knives should be outlawed in the UK? Seems like its not the weapon, its the person's motivation to inflict bodily harm.

Just read the links its talks on knife crime I.e. muggings rapes im sure knifes are used in the us for similar crimes

[proud2bejatt]

http://pastebin.com/i3Bcb6AR

The USA has half the murder, three or more times the guns from the 60s and 70s.

Furthermore, you're supposed to be a Sikh, a Sardar, a man.

We shouldn't need to discuss whether men should defend things. It's what men do, otherwise they are not men. They maybe male boys however; it's obvious all sides in the dispute were dumb for fighting at a nagar kirtan but one side may be right.

Obviously no one dastar came off, or it would say murder near gurudawara. So, w.e let them resolve it, the whole jail thing is not cool because the person saying it has probably never been arrested.

Stuff happens, it's the risk you take going outside. USA has the majority of its crime committed by young black males.

That's a statistical fact, and not ; ( ; ( 'racist'.

If you avoid rundown areas and thuggish looking people, it is safer than Europe and the people nicer.

Any major European city I.e Paris, Rome, or London has organized gangs of pickpockets, human traffickers and scam artists. You have no way to protect yourself there, and the criminals are harder to spot.

Unless you're looking for it, or buying drugs you won't really get caught up in anything. I mean, even Toronto's 150k public housing population accounts for most of the 80 or 90 murders each year.

Even though the people are largely black, the best advice would be to avoid public housing. USA is the exact same, NYC or Toronto have murder rates below 5 per 100k overall yet certain blocks pass the hundreds.

Why do you need to go see a crackhouse or police raid?

--

You wouldn't rather carry a rifle and a few pistols/revolvers just to be safe? ( keep others safe)

Does the old saying, 'A Sikh doesn't leave the house without 40 kilos of armor' need to be any clearer?

-

Also the 3-6 inch siri sahib is a British imposition.

Look up what the 5 shastaars were, and understand for the Khalsa to rule (which is its order) it must be able to destroy whatever injustice stands in its way; for the just have never blocked the way of the khalsa, it is justice born on this earth.

Done posting for awhile, if I don't get banned will reply to w.e. Peace.

ਖਾਲਿਸਤਾਨ ਜ਼ਿੰਦਾਬਾਦ | ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕਾ ਖਾਲਸਾ | ਵਾਹਿਗੁਰੂ ਜੀ ਕੀ ਫਤਹਿ | |

[kharkusingh1996]

In my own opinion, American Sikhs should at least have a weapon to protect themselves due to the ignorant violence that occurs in the U.S. it wouldn't hurt to have training + weapon to secure your own family or own self. Sikhs are still being racially targeted by people in public and who knows what is the next time a Singh is gunned down in America....

[West London Singh]

USA has the majority of its crime committed by young black males.

That's a statistical fact, and not ; ( ; ( 'racist'.

No. It is racist. The majority of crime, like everywhere else, is committed by the disenfranchised. America would do better to address that institutionalised racism rather than see guns as an anwser to any social problem.

Even though the people are largely black

So these 'blacks' ,who's killings and deaths you dismiss, are they some sort of sub-human animals not on a par with human beings ?

Are they so unimportant as humans that their deaths en-masse come second to your 'rights' to access automatic machine guns ?

The 'fact' is that there are more black 16 year old males in jail in America than there are in college. Thats a truly damning statement that should, in theory, be enough to end this discussion. But of course it won't. It won't because of thinking like this:.....

The reason Americans were actually given access to guns was to yes, defend their family and home, but not only from criminals but also corrupt, oppressive governments that come to power.

Americans, with their limited knowledge and understanding of the world at large, are intellectualy stuck in the year 1776. You base your assumption on America being a great democracy on the basis that you don't have a monarch with despotic powers. What you fail to realise is that no other western democracy has had one either for many hundreds of years now. In terms of democracy then, it can be best summed up with the 'fact' that no other nation in the history of the world has imprisoned a greater proportion of it's citizens than the United States of America. Not Stalin's USSR, not China, not Iran, not even Pol Pot's Cambodia. This dubious honour falls to America and shows it's self-label as a 'free' country as a complete sham. It is your own government that is oppressive and it is them that are impregnating you with misguided notions of how guns are safeguarding your freedom.

Furthermore, you're supposed to be a Sikh, a Sardar, a man.

Yes. A Sikh. A Sikh stands for sarbat da bhalla. The welfare of all existence. He does not put his own desires first and disregard the damage being done to others simply because most of the 'others' have black skin. Sikhi is organised compassion.

There is honour in the shastar. The Sikh, when he masters Shastar vidya and gatka, masters defence first and foremost. The Sikh, when he masters the sword, the chakar etc, defends with ease and lets the opponent wear himself out to the point of ineffectiveness. There is honour in this art of warfare.

There is no honour in pointing a gun and pulling the trigger. It takes no warrior to do that. It is something that little old ladies, little kids and mental patients can do.

There is nothing 'Sikh' about the gun.